SoxProspects News
|
|
|
|
Legal
Forum Ground Rules
The views expressed by the members of this Forum do not necessarily reflect the views of SoxProspects, LLC.
© 2003-2024 SoxProspects, LLC
|
|
|
|
|
Forum Home | Search | My Profile | Messages | Members | Help |
Welcome Guest. Please Login or Register.
Lester, Gomes & cash traded to OAK for Cespedes + draft pick
|
Post by redsoxfan2 on Jul 31, 2014 9:14:19 GMT -5
Just seems less relevant, doesn't it? You see his .767 OPS this year and you look back at last year's .737 and say that's a good, sizeable and the most recent sample. Besides it becomes a little easier to exploit a guy after you get a book on him. Would you really argue his last 900 at bats is not a large enough sample? Oh okay, I see we are just arbitrarily manipulating the stats to back up your own point. That's cool. I'll end the conversation that. Not really worth discussing if that is what we are doing. Willy Mo Pena had A good season.
|
|
|
Post by elguapo on Jul 31, 2014 9:15:33 GMT -5
Cespedes has played some CF. Poorly. We do have two legit LF signed for next season, which signals another trade sooner or later. Although Nava has been OK in right.
|
|
|
Post by theburn on Jul 31, 2014 9:16:05 GMT -5
Any chance BC now tries to flip Cespedes? There's a real lack of bats on the market right now.
|
|
|
Post by soxfan06 on Jul 31, 2014 9:16:24 GMT -5
If you look at what the Cubs got for Garza, this is a complete fail barring some stupendous follow-up move. Good lord...some people. We just got a top 30 MLB outfielder and a top 50 draft pick (+$800,000 to the draft pool) for 2 months of Jon Lester AND got a team to take Jonny Gomes off our hands. This place is a cluster****.
|
|
|
Post by amfox1 on Jul 31, 2014 9:16:43 GMT -5
Any chance BC now tries to flip Cespedes? There's a real lack of bats on the market right now. There's always a chance.
|
|
|
Post by gregblossersbelly on Jul 31, 2014 9:18:23 GMT -5
You guys keep saying we were getting a prime prospect. We weren't. LA said they weren't dealing their guys. Pittsburgh said they weren't. St. Louis is probably saving theirs for David Price
|
|
|
Post by Don Caballero on Jul 31, 2014 9:18:22 GMT -5
If you look at what the Cubs got for Garza, this is a complete fail barring some stupendous follow-up move. Wait, WHAT? That depends on how you view Edwards I guess, but there's absolutely no way the Garza deal makes this looks like a failure. Outside of Edwards, they got Mike Olt (LOL) and two relievers.
|
|
|
Post by amfox1 on Jul 31, 2014 9:18:47 GMT -5
If you look at what the Cubs got for Garza, this is a complete fail barring some stupendous follow-up move. Good lord...some people. We just got a top 30 MLB outfielder and a top 50 draft pick (+$800,000 to the draft pool) for 2 months of Jon Lester AND got a team to take Jonny Gomes off our hands. Draft pick is between rounds 2 and 3, so it will be closer to #70.
|
|
|
Post by soxfan06 on Jul 31, 2014 9:19:33 GMT -5
Oh okay, I see we are just arbitrarily manipulating the stats to back up your own point. That's cool. I'll end the conversation that. Not really worth discussing if that is what we are doing. Willy Mo Pena had A good season. Well luckily for Cespedes, he has had 3 good seasons. In his first 3 years in the MLB. Wily Mo Pena had also never reached 2 WAR, something Cespedes has surpassed in each of his first 3 seasons in the league.
|
|
|
Post by soxfan06 on Jul 31, 2014 9:20:49 GMT -5
Good lord...some people. We just got a top 30 MLB outfielder and a top 50 draft pick (+$800,000 to the draft pool) for 2 months of Jon Lester AND got a team to take Jonny Gomes off our hands. Draft pick is between rounds 2 and 3, so it will be closer to #70. Okay, that's fair. Still very valuable. That adds a lot of money to the pool.
|
|
|
Post by jmei on Jul 31, 2014 9:21:08 GMT -5
I am curious what prospect-centered packages were on the table. Part of it was just folks developing unrealistic expectations about what Lester would bring back (i.e., Pederson or Bundy were never realistic options), but I do think they could have gotten someone like Bell or Piscotty. Is one cheap year of an above-average outfielder worth more than six years of a riskier prospect?
|
|
|
Post by thelavarnwayguy on Jul 31, 2014 9:21:16 GMT -5
Rotoworld calls Oakland the most pitcher friendly park in baseball. Lester should be one happy camper with this move and it's not like they will re sign him. Gotta belive Cespede's numbers go up in Fenway.
|
|
|
Post by Guidas on Jul 31, 2014 9:22:14 GMT -5
If you look at what the Cubs got for Garza, this is a complete fail barring some stupendous follow-up move. Good lord...some people. We just got a top 30 MLB outfielder (for 1 year) and a top 50 draft pick (+$800,000 to the draft pool) ( for the reported 2nd worst Draft Class in the last 20 years) for 2 months of Jon Lester AND got a team to take Jonny Gomes off our hands. This place is a cluster****.
|
|
|
Post by redsoxfan2 on Jul 31, 2014 9:22:36 GMT -5
Willy Mo Pena had A good season. Well luckily for Cespedes, he has had 3 good seasons. In his first 3 years in the MLB. Wily Mo Pena had also never reached 2 WAR, something Cespedes has surpassed in each of his first 3 seasons in the league. Don't get me wrong, I love this trade. I just believe the last two years mean more than what he did before that. Now, with him moving to hitter-friendly Fenway park verse the pitcher-friendly Oakland I expect his numbers to climb a bit. I also love that he's a good defender with a canon arm. He's worth it. My point is simply that the last 900 ABs shouldn't be valued any less than his first >500.
|
|
|
Post by britalb on Jul 31, 2014 9:22:38 GMT -5
Warming to this deal. Cespedes is a good player at a position of need who seems tailor-made for Fenway. Optimistic about our chances of signing him beyond 2015 if we choose to do so. The draft pick is a decent little throw-in. Also, we put Lester in a place where he's very unlikely to resign, so the chance to grab him back up in the offseason is as alive as it was ever going to be. Exactly. I'm listening to Lou Merloni complaining about this on WEEI. He doesn't seem to get that this means 1) The Red Sox aren't rebuilding. They're going for it next year 2) They are sincere in their desire to re-sign Lester They wanted to make sure that Lester would be a rental. They've done that. They could even re-sign Gomes. So they've basically picked up a great fielder with right-handed power by lending their players for the end of a lost season. And if they had re-signed Lester, they wouldn't have gotten a draft pick. So now they get Lester and a pick. Kind of genius.
|
|
|
Post by elguapo on Jul 31, 2014 9:23:37 GMT -5
Cespedes 12 13 14+partial bWAR: 3.9 1.6 3.0+ fWAR: 2.9 2.3 2.3+
|
|
|
Post by soxfan1615 on Jul 31, 2014 9:23:47 GMT -5
I get that prospects need to be loved, worshiped and adored here, and some of you are upset that we didn't get a prospect, but this is better than any prospect return in my opinion. It shows that they are still looking to be competitive next year, and they got a good major league player back for Lester, something none of these prospects are a guarantee to be.
|
|
|
Post by ctfisher on Jul 31, 2014 9:23:52 GMT -5
If you look at what the Cubs got for Garza, this is a complete fail barring some stupendous follow-up move. Or its not because Mike Olt hasn't done anything, CJ Edwards is hurt, and the other guy the Cubs got was never considered a legit prospect. We got a quality big league player at a position of need who's almost certainly going to hit a lot better in Fenway. What did you think we were going to get, Oscar Taveras?
|
|
|
Post by Guidas on Jul 31, 2014 9:24:58 GMT -5
If you look at what the Cubs got for Garza, this is a complete fail barring some stupendous follow-up move. Or its not because Mike Olt hasn't done anything, CJ Edwards is hurt, and the other guy the Cubs got was never considered a legit prospect. We got a quality big league player at a position of need who's almost certainly going to hit a lot better in Fenway. What did you think we were going to get, Oscar Taveras? No, but I didn't think they were going to get Cody Ross, either.
|
|
|
Post by ctfisher on Jul 31, 2014 9:25:57 GMT -5
Or its not because Mike Olt hasn't done anything, CJ Edwards is hurt, and the other guy the Cubs got was never considered a legit prospect. We got a quality big league player at a position of need who's almost certainly going to hit a lot better in Fenway. What did you think we were going to get, Oscar Taveras? No, but I didn't think they were going to get Cody Ross, either. That's a joke of a comparison, and I really hope you know that
|
|
|
Post by taftreign on Jul 31, 2014 9:26:47 GMT -5
Fangraphs has Cespedes at a 113 Wrc+ and 2.3 WAR to this point in 2014. Let's see what benefit if any Fenway brings to these numbers.
|
|
|
Post by pedey on Jul 31, 2014 9:26:50 GMT -5
I think cespedes will thrive at Fenway park. However, that is a very little return for Lester. If we got tommy milone too, I would be fine with that. (Or bring back alcantara)
|
|
|
Post by redsoxfan2 on Jul 31, 2014 9:27:13 GMT -5
Or its not because Mike Olt hasn't done anything, CJ Edwards is hurt, and the other guy the Cubs got was never considered a legit prospect. We got a quality big league player at a position of need who's almost certainly going to hit a lot better in Fenway. What did you think we were going to get, Oscar Taveras? No, but I didn't think they were going to get Cody Ross, either.
|
|
|
Post by soxfan06 on Jul 31, 2014 9:27:13 GMT -5
Good lord...some people. We just got a top 30 MLB outfielder (for 1 year) and a top 50 draft pick (+$800,000 to the draft pool) ( for the reported 2nd worst Draft Class in the last 20 years) for 2 months of Jon Lester AND got a team to take Jonny Gomes off our hands. This place is a cluster****. Back to the narrative that the Red Sox are never going to re-sign a free agent every again I see......again ignoring the fact that we just recently signed Pedroia, Ortiz and Napoli to very fair extensions. But since we didn't pay the 7+ year, $140+ million dollar deal for Lester, we are NEVER going to sign anyone again. OMGZ. Also love the draft narrative. 1 year out, before the players get to develop more we always hear about how this draft class sucks or this draft class is worthless. Just because it won't be the best draft class in recent times doesn't mean there isn't value to be gotten out of it.
|
|
|
Post by cba82 on Jul 31, 2014 9:27:16 GMT -5
Wonder why the rush, with six hours to go before the deadline? I guess the other suitors truly fell away, and Ben concluded that this was the best he was going to get.
Nava is a loser from this deal; I see his playing time dropping dramatically.
Agree with django that it's a curious asset for Oakland to give up as they prepare for the playoffs. With Billy Beane, you always have to wonder what he knows that you don't.
|
|
|