redsox04071318champs
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Always hoping to make my handle even longer...
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Dec 5, 2016 15:09:02 GMT -5
I hope all the people who say things like "Hey it's not my money! We HAD to have an ace!" are ready for us being out on Otani because we sunk 217m into David Albatr-err, Price. If Price continues to win during the regular season and thinks he can make more he'll opt out. So there's that. Still amazed by this news. I don't see any reason for Nippon Ham Fighters to do this, unless they are desperate for cash, which is usually not the case. Anyway, he'll likely be a Dodger or a Yankee, so go Dodgers... Don't underestimate the Cubs. They need young pitching more than anything else. Lackey and Arrieta most likely are gone after this season. This is the kind of guy Theo will probably try to move heaven and earth for. Don't know if the Cubs get him but they'll be right there with the Dodgers and Yankees going after him.
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Post by bluechip on Dec 5, 2016 15:42:28 GMT -5
I hope all the people who say things like "Hey it's not my money! We HAD to have an ace!" are ready for us being out on Otani because we sunk 217m into David Albatr-err, Price. If Price continues to win during the regular season and thinks he can make more he'll opt out. So there's that. Still amazed by this news. I don't see any reason for Nippon Ham Fighters to do this, unless they are desperate for cash, which is usually not the case. Anyway, he'll likely be a Dodger or a Yankee, so go Dodgers... Well Dodgers have debt problems, so I wouldn't say they are a certainty to be bidding.
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Post by jmei on Dec 5, 2016 17:43:46 GMT -5
The Dodgers' debt problems have been overblown (in short, they have a lot of debt, but they also have a lot of revenue and are cash flow positive), and they have a ton of salary coming off the books. I don't think there's any real reason to think they'll be financially handicapped going forward. I also think that front office is outside-the-box enough to use Otani as a true two-way player, and it's that kind of team that is likely to value Otani high enough to be seriously in the running.
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Post by sarasoxer on Dec 5, 2016 18:31:07 GMT -5
I hope all the people who say things like "Hey it's not my money! We HAD to have an ace!" are ready for us being out on Otani because we sunk 217m into David Albatr-err, Price. If Price continues to win during the regular season and thinks he can make more he'll opt out. So there's that. Still amazed by this news. I don't see any reason for Nippon Ham Fighters to do this, unless they are desperate for cash, which is usually not the case. Anyway, he'll likely be a Dodger or a Yankee, so go Dodgers... I'll go on record as saying the Price acquisition will bite us in the butt. IMO his "stuff" is in decline...and not surprisingly given his innings pitched. He is a tall guy with less than impeccable command so unless the latter changes significantly (I think that is harder at his age and physical stature), I'll go on the record as saying that I think we have an albatross. If I could move him now, I would and assume some salary. Hopefully that would give us a better opportunity at Otani or others. The Yankees are setting up nicely for a huge young free agent haul.
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Post by bluechip on Dec 5, 2016 20:42:57 GMT -5
The Dodgers also run the risk of being taxed at 90% if they sign Otani.
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Post by jmei on Dec 5, 2016 21:58:38 GMT -5
The Dodgers also run the risk of being taxed at 90% if they sign Otani. They would pay a marginal tax rate of 90% for the amount that they exceed the luxury tax threshold plus $40M. That's not really that much of a deterrent. NBA teams must pay a luxury tax equal to 100% of the amount that they exceed the luxury tax threshold, yet teams do so regularly.
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Post by burythehammer on Dec 6, 2016 19:17:24 GMT -5
Ken Rosenthal reported on Twitter that MLB officials told teams there will be no exception made for Otani. So looks like it could be three years. Which is probably good for us.
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Post by iakovos11 on Dec 6, 2016 19:25:51 GMT -5
If Price continues to win during the regular season and thinks he can make more he'll opt out. So there's that. Still amazed by this news. I don't see any reason for Nippon Ham Fighters to do this, unless they are desperate for cash, which is usually not the case. Anyway, he'll likely be a Dodger or a Yankee, so go Dodgers... I'll go on record as saying the Price acquisition will bite us in the butt. IMO his "stuff" is in decline...and not surprisingly given his innings pitched. He is a tall guy with less than impeccable command so unless the latter changes significantly (I think that is harder at his age and physical stature), I'll go on the record as saying that I think we have an albatross. If I could move him now, I would and assume some salary. Hopefully that would give us a better opportunity at Otani or others. The Yankees are setting up nicely for a huge young free agent haul. Wait, are you talking about Price or Porcello?
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Post by sarasoxer on Dec 6, 2016 21:35:39 GMT -5
I'll go on record as saying the Price acquisition will bite us in the butt. IMO his "stuff" is in decline...and not surprisingly given his innings pitched. He is a tall guy with less than impeccable command so unless the latter changes significantly (I think that is harder at his age and physical stature), I'll go on the record as saying that I think we have an albatross. If I could move him now, I would and assume some salary. Hopefully that would give us a better opportunity at Otani or others. The Yankees are setting up nicely for a huge young free agent haul. Wait, are you talking about Price or Porcello? I wasn't clear??
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sarcasmo
Rookie
Formerly known as mtomeo
Posts: 91
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Post by sarcasmo on Dec 7, 2016 10:47:18 GMT -5
Can someone explain the CBA change to me? So teams are capped at $5 mil (or $10) signing bonus for guys under 25. I get that. But what happens in years 2+? How long is the original deal? Does it have to be multi-year? Essentially, what stops a team from signing him for $5/$10, but announcing a $200 Mil contract extension the next day?
Also, and slightly OT, I'm watching the HR Derby and the overlays are all in Japanese, but everyone has English lettering on their jerseys. What gives?
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Dec 11, 2016 9:27:51 GMT -5
www.mlbtraderumors.com/2016/12/quick-hits-otani-red-sox-brewers-phillies.html?fv-home=true&post-id=80280Otani is probably going to end up taking a minor league contract and coming to the states next year. “@jeffpassan: Source: New CBA includes ”death penalty“ for teams caught cheating internationally. MLB can penalize up to 50% of int’l pool $ through 2021.” Wouldn't it just be worth it to pay Otani whatever he wants next off season and just accept the death penalty? I'm sure the large market teams will still be thinking this way. Or will the league prevent teams from doing this? Either way if I'm the Sox, I'm loading up on international draft pool money. This is what I'd trade Buchholz for this off-season.
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Post by bigpupp on Dec 11, 2016 9:45:00 GMT -5
Teams can only improve their international draft pool money by 75%, and cheating would most certainly mean the team doesn't get to keep the player. There really isn't a way to safely game the system here.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Dec 11, 2016 9:52:35 GMT -5
Teams can only improve their international draft pool money by 75%, and cheating would most certainly mean the team doesn't get to keep the player. There really isn't a way to safely game the system here. I'm not sure if the CBA mentions this but you may be right, it only mentions a 50% downgrade for international draft pool money in future years.
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Post by bigpupp on Dec 11, 2016 9:57:42 GMT -5
Teams can only improve their international draft pool money by 75%, and cheating would most certainly mean the team doesn't get to keep the player. There really isn't a way to safely game the system here. I'm not sure if the CBA mentions this but you may be right, it only mentions a 50% downgrade for international draft pool money in future years. Right, but it's also a hard cap meaning the Sox couldn't go over even if they wanted to. The deal would never be approved (they wouldn't get to keep the player) and they would get the 50% reduction.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Dec 11, 2016 10:01:46 GMT -5
I'm not sure if the CBA mentions this but you may be right, it only mentions a 50% downgrade for international draft pool money in future years. Right, but it's also a hard cap meaning the Sox couldn't go over even if they wanted to. The deal would never be approved (they wouldn't get to keep the player) and they would get the 50% reduction. Alright that makes sense. Trade Buchholz for international draft pool money it is then if I'm the Sox.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Dec 11, 2016 10:29:12 GMT -5
I mean how crazy good would the Sox rotation be if they had Otani, this definitely increases their chances if he's willing to accept a minor league deal-
Sale Otani Price Porcello Rodriguez/Porcello/Wright
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Post by kman22 on Dec 11, 2016 11:18:43 GMT -5
I mean how crazy good would the Sox rotation be if they had Otani, this definitely increases their chances if he's willing to accept a minor league deal- Sale Otani Price Porcello Rodriguez/Porcello/Wright Porcello is so good that he can be the #4 AND #5 starter.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Dec 11, 2016 11:41:24 GMT -5
I mean how crazy good would the Sox rotation be if they had Otani, this definitely increases their chances if he's willing to accept a minor league deal- Sale Otani Price Porcello Rodriguez/Porcello/Wright Porcello is so good that he can be the #4 AND #5 starter. Oops meant Pomeranz. Typo.
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Post by jimed14 on Dec 11, 2016 11:49:22 GMT -5
Can someone explain the CBA change to me? So teams are capped at $5 mil (or $10) signing bonus for guys under 25. I get that. But what happens in years 2+? How long is the original deal? Does it have to be multi-year? Essentially, what stops a team from signing him for $5/$10, but announcing a $200 Mil contract extension the next day? The deal is a signing bonus and that's it. Then they are regular minor league players like anyone else and when/if they make the majors, they get 3 years of minimum salary and 3 years of arbitration.
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Post by jimed14 on Dec 11, 2016 11:50:48 GMT -5
Teams can only improve their international draft pool money by 75%, and cheating would most certainly mean the team doesn't get to keep the player. There really isn't a way to safely game the system here. I'm not sure if the CBA mentions this but you may be right, it only mentions a 50% downgrade for international draft pool money in future years. Manfred will do whatever he wants to punish the team, kind of like what he did to us already.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Dec 11, 2016 11:57:58 GMT -5
I'm not sure if the CBA mentions this but you may be right, it only mentions a 50% downgrade for international draft pool money in future years. Manfred will do whatever he wants to punish the team, kind of like what he did to us already. Ouch ya, you may be right. He's punished the Sox twice actually with the closing of the Pomeranz deal and the "international scandal."
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Dec 11, 2016 12:15:54 GMT -5
This is great news that came out today.
The Sox are in the mix with everyone if they actually show interest and want Otani now (they should and will).
They could have the best pitching prospect in the world controllable for a posting fee of 20 million plus the 5 million dollars (maybe more if they can acquire more international pool money) for the next 6+ years.
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Post by Guidas on Dec 11, 2016 12:23:11 GMT -5
This is great news that came out today. The Sox are in the mix with everyone if they actually show interest and want Otani now (they should and will). They could have the best pitching prospect in the world controllable for a posting fee of 20 million plus the 5 million dollars (maybe more if they can acquire more international pool money) for the next 6+ years. Unless Otani manipulates the system by saying he'll only accept a 1 or 2 year deal.
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Post by wcsoxfan on Dec 11, 2016 12:39:06 GMT -5
Can someone explain the CBA change to me? So teams are capped at $5 mil (or $10) signing bonus for guys under 25. I get that. But what happens in years 2+? How long is the original deal? Does it have to be multi-year? Essentially, what stops a team from signing him for $5/$10, but announcing a $200 Mil contract extension the next day?Also, and slightly OT, I'm watching the HR Derby and the overlays are all in Japanese, but everyone has English lettering on their jerseys. What gives? Teams aren't allowed to make these 'under-the-table' deals to circumvent the rules. MLB would simply reject the extension and the team would be subject to further penalties at the commissioner's discretion.
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Post by wcsoxfan on Dec 11, 2016 12:42:36 GMT -5
This is great news that came out today. The Sox are in the mix with everyone if they actually show interest and want Otani now (they should and will). They could have the best pitching prospect in the world controllable for a posting fee of 20 million plus the 5 million dollars (maybe more if they can acquire more international pool money) for the next 6+ years. Unless Otani manipulates the system by saying he'll only accept a 1 or 2 year deal. He would be a minor leaguer and subject to the same rules as any other minor leaguer signed as a free agent. Minimum salaries in MiLB until MLB, then minimum MLB salary for 3 years and then arbitration for 3 years - unless the team chooses to pay him more out of the 'goodness of their hearts'. But any significant increase above these rates would be thoroughly investigated. This is why many suspect he won't be posted despite what has been reported.
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