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John Farrell hired as manager, Mike Aviles to TOR
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Post by mredsox89 on Oct 21, 2012 21:11:52 GMT -5
For what it's worth, which may be minimal, Pedroia and Ortiz have already come out with statements/interviews about being happy that Farrell is back. It may be irrelevant, but it's certainly a nice thing to hear given how nonexistent these praises were when BV was hired
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Post by buffs4444 on Oct 21, 2012 21:32:15 GMT -5
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Post by soxfan06 on Oct 22, 2012 0:42:55 GMT -5
Anyone focusing on David Carpenter's value, other than to figure out if he can be salvaged, is looking at it the wrong way. This isn't about Aviles for Carpenter. It is Aviles for Farrell. Only reason we got Carpenter was because of MLB rules so the "classic" Cherrington stuff is pretty silly.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Oct 22, 2012 7:13:03 GMT -5
For what it's worth, which may be minimal, Pedroia and Ortiz have already come out with statements/interviews about being happy that Farrell is back. It may be irrelevant, but it's certainly a nice thing to hear given how nonexistent these praises were when BV was hired It's not worth much considering Farrell has already gotten anonymously torched by a player who may or may not be (but, lets be serious, actually is) Dustin Pedroia.
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Post by brianthetaoist on Oct 22, 2012 8:34:14 GMT -5
Anyone focusing on David Carpenter's value, other than to figure out if he can be salvaged, is looking at it the wrong way. This isn't about Aviles for Carpenter. It is Aviles for Farrell. Only reason we got Carpenter was because of MLB rules so the "classic" Cherrington stuff is pretty silly. Well, since I was the one that said "classic," you're missing my point. Everyone was speculating about Lind coming back and before that about pitchers going to the Jays, but I was just pointing out that in deals large and tiny, Ben Cherington will always get more pitching, it seems. Whether it's spaghetti against the wall or legit prospects like Rubby and Webster, at this point in time, at least, there's a clear MO from Ben: grab pitching whenever you can and hold on to what you've got. Even though it's not a real "trade" of Aviles for Carpenter, t's not like Ben had no say in who was coming back from the Jays ...
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steveofbradenton
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Watching Spring Training, the FCL, and the Florida State League
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Post by steveofbradenton on Oct 22, 2012 9:43:38 GMT -5
Lightning does strike once in awhile!
I'm really pleased that Ben Cherington puts so much emphasis on picking up pitchers who have (some) potential. Every once in awhile, the light-bulb comes on for an athlete and they get to the next level. It happens! Not often, but it happens.
Some of this "spaghetti" will stick, and we all know, especially after the last 12 months, that pitching wins games and pitching gets you into the play-offs.
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Oct 22, 2012 10:05:47 GMT -5
And judging by the way the Yankees went dwon, its pitching that shows up with more prevalence in the postseason too.
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Post by James Dunne on Oct 22, 2012 13:06:20 GMT -5
And judging by the way the Yankees went dwon, its pitching that shows up with more prevalence in the postseason too. The Yankees had a 2.76 ERA in the postseason. I know "pitching wins pennants" is the cliche, and all respect is due for the Tigers staff, which was dominant. But it was pretty clear the Yankees problem throughout the playoffs wasn't the pitching.
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Post by buffs4444 on Oct 22, 2012 13:44:39 GMT -5
Those Yankee numbers are a bit misleading given that they were mostly earned against a mediocre Oriole team (and I say that in postseason terms, clearly they were a better team than us this year). Compare the 1.76 ERA in the ALDS to the 4.14 ERA in the ALCS and their staff was more exposed against a better lineup.
I say better because I believe in the model the Tigers are using to (most likely) power them to a World Championship this year. It should be familiar to most because it's a very similar model to the one we used to win in '04 and '07: solid staff headlined by an ace with two huge bats in the middle of a mostly solid lineup.
This is what BC should be looking to put together this offseason. The pitcher is right there for the taking on the FA market, with Greinke. For the life of me, other than Upton, I'm struggling to come up with another middle of the order bat that BC could add to the existing core to drive this lineup. It's going to be a fun offseason to watch though, that's for sure....
Cheers, Lou
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Post by borisman on Oct 22, 2012 15:17:53 GMT -5
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Post by grandsalami on Oct 22, 2012 15:25:08 GMT -5
If you read the full quotes, he has no problem with the GM and the owners (of TOR) have no problem with Sox owners.. Please can we stop his baseless accusing
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Post by borisman on Oct 22, 2012 15:32:26 GMT -5
Ok, so Larry doesn't leak. You keep believing that pal. And sure, accusing once is enough so I'll be done with it. And no, I don't have proof. I have my opinion.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Oct 22, 2012 15:35:27 GMT -5
Ok, so Larry doesn't leak. You keep believing that pal. And sure, accusing once is enough so I'll be done with it. And no, I don't have proof. I have my opinion. Question: what's inherently wrong with leaks? Do you think a GM is going to stop doing business with the Red Sox, turning down what would be the best offer available in some situation, just because things might leak? He's not happy, but I think the chances are slim that the leaks have much of a material effect on anything. Just my opinion.
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Post by bigpapismangosalsa on Oct 22, 2012 15:38:45 GMT -5
Let me just chime in here and say that I'm a fan of the hire. For me it went in this order of preference in 1) Farrell - assuming not prohibitive compensation and 1a) Ausmus.
Aviles, while a useful piece, certainly isn't prohibitive in my opinion.
There were things that I liked with Ausmus that Farrell might not have had, and there are certainly question marks with Farrell as well, but I think those are out-weighed by the positives of his hire.
One more thing that I like, IF Louvello ends up being the bench coach, you are going to see four of the highest profile names "running" the Red Sox with a player development background in Cherington, Hazen, Farrell and Louvello. This is a good thing.
The Sox are / were at their best with paying money for elite Free Agents (Manny, Damon, extending Schilling) and building from a core within or more "under the radar" guys.
They ran in to trouble with the "lets just get the best FA out there" in names like Crawford and Lackey. This to me signifies many good things - not the least of which was a clear and well run plan. That is a good thing.
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Post by elguapo on Oct 22, 2012 15:47:19 GMT -5
If you read the full quotes, he has no problem with the GM and the owners (of TOR) have no problem with Sox owners.. Please can we stop his baseless accusing The whole thing is beside the point, but the full quote is entirely consistent with reading that AA is insinuating that Lucchino is unprofessional, Friend of Beeston though he may be. It's surprising that he said anything about it at all, which suggests that he was very annoyed.
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Post by mainesox on Oct 22, 2012 16:57:18 GMT -5
If you read the full quotes, he has no problem with the GM and the owners (of TOR) have no problem with Sox owners.. Please can we stop his baseless accusing The whole thing is beside the point, but the full quote is entirely consistent with reading that AA is insinuating that Lucchino is unprofessional, Friend of Beeston though he may be. It's surprising that he said anything about it at all, which suggests that he was very annoyed. Except he never names, or even implies Larry in any of it. In fact, his exact quote is "we don’t know where it came from or how it started," so any talk of Lucchino being at fault is pure, baseless, speculation. I'm not even convinced that it's anything more than Anthopoulos being upset about the whole deal and just complaining for the sake of complaining. One of the things he's apparently referring to was Lind being involved in the deal, which was nothing more than speculation by a Toronto writer. He's upset about the deal getting out before it's "official?" That happens almost every time. He's upset about stories that came out about issues with Farrell as a manager? That came from Vizquel talking to the Toronto Sun. The only think Larry could even potentially be involved in is leaking the deal before it's "official," but it's not like that's a big deal (or even unusual) and I don't see how it would be beneficial for Larry to leak it at that point anyway - they had already agreed on the deal it just hadn't been made official yet.
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Post by grandsalami on Oct 22, 2012 17:53:04 GMT -5
little OT but intersting
Scott Lauber @scottlauber Francona to Cleveland media (from @mlbastian) on final years w/#RedSox: "My title didn't need to be manager. It was like fire-putter-outer."
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Post by elguapo on Oct 22, 2012 18:01:53 GMT -5
Speculation on an internet discussion forum!?? Perish the thought. But when a GM says he's upset, but that he has no problem with Ben, and the owners have no problem with each other -- process of elimination leads to questioning that which is left unsaid.
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wcp3
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Posts: 3,815
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Post by wcp3 on Oct 22, 2012 19:26:35 GMT -5
World Series or bust.
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Post by Don Caballero on Oct 22, 2012 21:42:24 GMT -5
Boy, what's up with Larry Luchino's name that makes most people go moronic when discussing him?
I very much like this deal and have been a big Farrell fan for quite a while. Glad we got past this one.
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Post by patrmac04 on Oct 23, 2012 12:25:28 GMT -5
I thought the introduction press conference was very reassuring. I can see why Farrell commands respect from the players. I am very happy to be rid of the passive aggressive digs that Bobby V liked to use through the media. Farrell has a no BS attitude and it is clear that he is very happy to have landed the Sox manager job.
More importantly, I am happy to see that Lester, Clay, Pedroia and Ortiz are all happy about the hire. If this team is going to make it back to the playoffs next year, those are the core members of the team that need to have a great year. I am especially happy about Lester who appeared to want nothing more than to leave Boston after this season. His tweet shows excitement and hope that there is a way to solve the problems he had during the year. It also gives me the slightest bit of hope that they can figure out a way to get Bard back on track as John addressed that specifically in the press conference.
Overall, I am happy that the Sox don't appear to be a cluster bleep right now and that they are making quick and decisive choices and getting the job done. There is a lot of work to still do, but this is the first time in a while that I am excited about this team.
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Post by borisman on Oct 23, 2012 13:23:46 GMT -5
Ok, so Larry doesn't leak. You keep believing that pal. And sure, accusing once is enough so I'll be done with it. And no, I don't have proof. I have my opinion. Question: what's inherently wrong with leaks? Do you think a GM is going to stop doing business with the Red Sox, turning down what would be the best offer available in some situation, just because things might leak? He's not happy, but I think the chances are slim that the leaks have much of a material effect on anything. Just my opinion. I don't care about the leaks either but why is it always questioned where the leaks come from, ala Francona and pain killers. If it's not Larry then it's Larry's leak of choice. He has contacts in the media and he leaks stuff every year. Let's not pretend like we don't know who it is. No, like I said, I don't know for sure nor do I have proof, just an opion which is totally on-base.
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Post by mredsox89 on Oct 23, 2012 13:36:12 GMT -5
Lovullo reported as likely the next bench coach
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redsox04071318champs
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Always hoping to make my handle even longer...
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Oct 23, 2012 16:16:29 GMT -5
Question: what's inherently wrong with leaks? Do you think a GM is going to stop doing business with the Red Sox, turning down what would be the best offer available in some situation, just because things might leak? He's not happy, but I think the chances are slim that the leaks have much of a material effect on anything. Just my opinion. I don't care about the leaks either but why is it always questioned where the leaks come from, ala Francona and pain killers. If it's not Larry then it's Larry's leak of choice. He has contacts in the media and he leaks stuff every year. Let's not pretend like we don't know who it is. No, like I said, I don't know for sure nor do I have proof, just an opion which is totally on-base. One possibility for a leak, among others, is The Dentist, Charles Steinberg. He spoonfed CHB's article trashing Theo many years ago, left town when Theo won the power struggle, and returned when Theo left. My educated guess would be that Theo saw him as a sieve.
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Post by mantush on Oct 23, 2012 22:17:33 GMT -5
I find it funny that David Carpenter was drafted by Bane when he was with the Angels. I wonder if he had any behind the scenes influence.
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