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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Nov 10, 2014 16:29:52 GMT -5
First headscratcher of the offseason. Good for Cuddyer, I thought that tag was going to kill his options. Now the need to get cespedes so they can fill their roster with HR derby contestants. Except, unfortunately for us, this will take them out of the running for Cespedes. They'll run a Granderon/Lagares/Cuddyer outfield, with Cuddy likely grabbing some time at first against LHP's. Pretty shocked about this signing. Can't wait to see what the AAV is. Jon Heyman ?@jonheymancbs 23s24 seconds ago Cuddyer gor $21M for 2 years from #mets
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Post by jrffam05 on Nov 10, 2014 16:37:25 GMT -5
Jack Curry ?@jackcurryyes David Robertson has turned down the Yankees qualifying offer. Never good seeing the Yanks get extra picks. This could backfire on Robertson. Yankees probably will not offer anything over the qualifying offer now to him, so the bar is set pretty high for a reliever. Now it's basically a minimum of 25M for a reliever + draft pick. As for the Mets good for them being aggressive, but they are really paying the price. Reasonable salary, but losing the 15th pick hurts. And Cuddyer, he only got 1 year and 5M more than QO, it's a bit curious that he signed that fast for that little upside.
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Post by ethanbein on Nov 10, 2014 22:51:44 GMT -5
Marc Carig ?@marccarig Mets announce they’ve signed Michael Cuddyer to a two-year contract. Well then. Is this as absurd as it seems? Giving up a pick for a 35 year old on a two year deal who will be lucky to hit 2 WAR in either season? The only way this even remotely makes sense IMO is if they end up signing one of the top flight QO guys and Cuddyer essentially costs them their second pick Yeah, to me this seems to signal that the mets were already planning on signing one of the QO free agents and so they saw that first rounder as gone already. Who would they even go for though? They have plenty of pitching, no need at 3rd base... I can't see any good reason at all for this.
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Post by texs31 on Nov 10, 2014 23:28:28 GMT -5
If they want in on Tulo (it could cost them some of that pitching) A FA starter would make some sense maybe?? Just speculation.
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Post by James Dunne on Nov 10, 2014 23:33:02 GMT -5
If they want in on Tulo (it could cost them some of that pitching) A FA starter would make some sense maybe?? Just speculation. I don't know that they have the pieces for Tulowitzki, but I think you're on the right track here. Wheeler or Niese or someone could definitely be part of a package for a position of need if they sign Scherzer or Lester.
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Post by jmei on Nov 10, 2014 23:41:36 GMT -5
The fifteenth pick is valuable, but it's not necessarily a deal breaker. If, say, you think it's worth $9m (which is in the high range of valuations, IIRC), the Mets effectively paid 2/$30m for Cuddyer. That's still a good bit more than I would pay, but at least one other team thought he was worth a similar amount (the Rockies, who offered him the QO). In this $/WAR market, it really only values him as slightly over a two win player, which is not totally outrageous. He averaged that amount over the last two years despite averaging less than two-thirds a season.
It's a bad deal, but not a totally awful one, and it wouldn't be that hard for it to turn out decently well.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Nov 10, 2014 23:47:57 GMT -5
I think it's safe to say that the Rockies offered him a QO in the hope that this very thing would happen. I would have bet against it, but what do I know?
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Nov 11, 2014 2:03:01 GMT -5
All 12 free agents who were extended a qualifying offer have turned it down.
That said, I don't think it's necessarily a coincidence that Cuddyer signed today. His agent may have foreseen that he'd be the next guy to wait until the last possible minute to get an offer if he turned it down and told the Mets if they wanted him they needed to get it done before the deadline.
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Post by vermontsox1 on Nov 11, 2014 21:03:50 GMT -5
Chris Cotillo ?@chriscotillo #Cubs in talks to acquire Jordan Zimmermann from the #Nationals, per @gdubcub
He was a potential Red Sox target. Wouldn't be surprised if he nets a decent prospect in return.
More important, though, this could affect how aggressive the Cubs will get with Lester. Will be interesting to see.
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,700
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Post by nomar on Nov 11, 2014 21:20:38 GMT -5
Hmm it would probably be alcantara but that doesn't seem like enough. Baez would work but I doubt they'd trade him and no way Bryant or Soler is moved.
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Post by James Dunne on Nov 11, 2014 21:23:59 GMT -5
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Post by adiospaydro2005 on Nov 11, 2014 21:26:53 GMT -5
I would think that Russell and CJ Edwards would be two of the top prospects the Nats would target in a trade for Zimmerman.
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Post by taftreign on Nov 11, 2014 22:31:35 GMT -5
Here is a post of mine from Nov 1 in the trade forum. Seems Chicago is thinking similarly. If Washington is looking for mostly bats I have to admit Theo definitely has more to offer but if they would like an arm in return I'd say Boston would have a shot. It does all come down to having a negotiating window to work out an extension because without securing Zimmerman long term it's very risky for the price.
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Post by James Dunne on Nov 11, 2014 22:41:18 GMT -5
If the Red Sox don't want to include Betts or Bogaerts then they just aren't going to be able to match up with the Nationals as well as the Cubs are.
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Nov 12, 2014 11:45:49 GMT -5
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Nov 12, 2014 16:17:48 GMT -5
Ken Rosenthal ?@ken_Rosenthal 1m1 minute ago Sources: #Tigers close to re-signing Victor Martinez to four-year deal.
Looks like the first major player is off the board. Cross them off the longshot to sign Sandoval list
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 12, 2014 16:57:07 GMT -5
I don't think the Cubs will sign either Lester or Scherzer or Shields for that matter. Or I should maybe say, I don't think it's smart for them to do so. They have been so patient and have built a strong young nucleus so it seems like a rush to sign the 30+ year old starters this year. It's highly likely that the young bats need some seasoning before they are ready to really contend. Why waste a year or two of these guys and wait for their decline phase? It just doesn't match up.
Trading for the younger Zimmerman and waiting for next years younger free agent class makes a lot more sense long term. Short term they aren't contending next year anyways.
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Post by vermontsox1 on Nov 12, 2014 17:42:44 GMT -5
Ken Rosenthal ?@ken_Rosenthal 1m1 minute ago Sources: #Tigers close to re-signing Victor Martinez to four-year deal. Looks like the first major player is off the board. Cross them off the longshot to sign Sandoval list V-Mart is obviously a great player, but they are going to have a serious chunk of change tied up in Martinez, Verlander, and Cabrera for years to come.
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Post by James Dunne on Nov 12, 2014 17:50:07 GMT -5
Why miss out on a rare arm like Scherzer or Lester because there's a chance they won't be ready to contend in 2015? If the Cubs like one of those guys well enough to sign him, it means they think he's still going to be a good pitcher in 2016-2018, which means it makes sense to sign him. Also, it's not like signing Lester would cost them anything but money (which they have plenty of to spend) in terms of their rebuild.
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Post by jmei on Nov 12, 2014 17:50:30 GMT -5
Short term they aren't contending next year anyways. For what it's worth, Vegas (and a lot of smart analysts) disagree. I think they have the seventh-highest 2015 World Series odds in the league, basically on par with the Cardinals. I think that's aggressive, but it makes some sense-- their pythag record was basically .500 this year, and they have more good prospects coming up and something like $50m of AAV to spend. If they wanted to, they could probably get into the fringes of contention as soon as next year.
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Post by soxfan06 on Nov 12, 2014 18:13:51 GMT -5
4 years, $70 million for a pure DH?
No wonder why Ortiz kept b----ing about getting a new deal.
But if Ortiz were 35 in this market he would probably get more than that so I'm not shocked.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Nov 12, 2014 18:29:37 GMT -5
Short term they aren't contending next year anyways. For what it's worth, Vegas (and a lot of smart analysts) disagree. I think they have the seventh-highest 2015 World Series odds in the league, basically on par with the Cardinals. I think that's aggressive, but it makes some sense-- their pythag record was basically .500 this year, and they have more good prospects coming up and something like $50m of AAV to spend. If they wanted to, they could probably get into the fringes of contention as soon as next year. I don't think you ever want to punt a year in which your team might have a chance because you think they'll have a better chance later on. If the Cubs have a chance to compete next year (and I think they do) they should just go for it.
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Post by sarasoxer on Nov 12, 2014 20:26:42 GMT -5
For what it's worth, Vegas (and a lot of smart analysts) disagree. I think they have the seventh-highest 2015 World Series odds in the league, basically on par with the Cardinals. I think that's aggressive, but it makes some sense-- their pythag record was basically .500 this year, and they have more good prospects coming up and something like $50m of AAV to spend. If they wanted to, they could probably get into the fringes of contention as soon as next year. I don't think you ever want to punt a year in which your team might have a chance because you think they'll have a better chance later on. If the Cubs have a chance to compete next year (and I think they do) they should just go for it. Because they and Epstein are smarter than that.
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Post by jimed14 on Nov 13, 2014 7:46:30 GMT -5
Why miss out on a rare arm like Scherzer or Lester because there's a chance they won't be ready to contend in 2015? If the Cubs like one of those guys well enough to sign him, it means they think he's still going to be a good pitcher in 2016-2018, which means it makes sense to sign him. Also, it's not like signing Lester would cost them anything but money (which they have plenty of to spend) in terms of their rebuild. There is quite a list of pitchers next year. Obviously not all will be available, but some of Samardzija, Zimmerman, Price, Cueto, Latos, Fister and maybe Greinke will. If you wait a year, that's one less year of risk that the guy you signed didn't throw out his elbow or decline.
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Post by jmei on Nov 13, 2014 7:55:30 GMT -5
Why miss out on a rare arm like Scherzer or Lester because there's a chance they won't be ready to contend in 2015? If the Cubs like one of those guys well enough to sign him, it means they think he's still going to be a good pitcher in 2016-2018, which means it makes sense to sign him. Also, it's not like signing Lester would cost them anything but money (which they have plenty of to spend) in terms of their rebuild. There is quite a list of pitchers next year. Obviously not all will be available, but some of Samardzija, Zimmerman, Price, Cueto, Latos, Fister and maybe Greinke will. If you wait a year, that's one less year of risk that the guy you signed didn't throw out his elbow or decline. This may be pedantic, but it's not really one less year of risk, you've just pushed it one year into the future.
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