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Post by mredsox89 on Nov 25, 2014 14:38:42 GMT -5
Plus, signing everyone in one offseason when you have a protected first rounded really minimizes the draft pick/slot money cost of FA signings. Plus, signing everyone in one offseason when they aren't competing with the Yankees or Dodgers to bid them up. I hadn't thought of this but it's a great point. The last 10 or so years, most FA's the Sox have been in on have featured the Yankees as a major player. This offseason is a rare chance where that doesn't necessarily seem to be the case. I wonder how the Yanks will play in the bidding for Lester/Scherzer. My guess is that Lester comes back and Scherzer goes to the Bronx, one shortly after the other
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Nov 25, 2014 16:33:34 GMT -5
Ramirez’s news conference is at 4 p.m. Pushed back, perhaps to early evening. Sounds like they're trying to make a trade to clear space, even if just a minor one.
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Post by pedroelgrande on Nov 25, 2014 18:23:23 GMT -5
@alexspeier: Hanley Ramirez contract: $3M bonus, 2015 - $19M, 2016-18 - $22M Vesting option for 2019: $22M
Referred to him as LF Hanley Ramirez.
Juan Francisco DFA'd.
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Post by grandsalami on Nov 25, 2014 19:00:11 GMT -5
jon Heyman ?@jonheymancbs 21s21 seconds ago
Hanley breakdown: 19M in 2015, 22M 2016, '17 and '18. 2019 22M option vests with 1050 plate appearances in 2017 and '18 3M bonus
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Post by ctwebb on Nov 25, 2014 19:15:11 GMT -5
Obviously he'll be playing half his games at Fenway, but do we think he will have the speed to play decent defense in some of the bigger ballparks? And how does his arm compare to an average outfielder?
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Post by mredsox89 on Nov 25, 2014 19:16:33 GMT -5
jon Heyman ?@jonheymancbs 21s21 seconds ago Hanley breakdown: 19M in 2015, 22M 2016, '17 and '18. 2019 22M option vests with 1050 plate appearances in 2017 and '18 3M bonus So basically the last year only happens if he plays full seasons in 17/18. Either he doesn't and they are done after 18, or he's still a legit full time player and has stayed healthy and the Sox get what should still be a very good bat for what may be "low $" 5 years from now. I like it
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Post by orcoaster on Nov 25, 2014 19:57:54 GMT -5
Great signing. Very exciting to have Hanley come back home. I think he'll have no problems adjusting to LF as he was potentially moving to CF anyway if he had stayed with Boston. I love that he reached out to the RS about coming back at a different position.
Does anyone have a link to the press conference transcript?
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Post by thursty on Nov 25, 2014 20:23:25 GMT -5
Saw Hanley's presser and he was really impressive; I know it's easy to be cynical (and most of the times it pays), but I bought his "I'm a different guy and this is home" line. Actually both pressers were kind of cool.
And at least wrt to Panda, we're certain it actually wasn't about the money this time. Don't want to be maudlin, but step back a bit and think about the reach and pull that the Red Sox have; SF is not exactly a desert and yet Boston and the Red Sox have some mysterious pull on this Venezuelan-born, wealthy, undoubtedly self-absorbed and narcissistic ballplayer. The MSM is completely bemused and confounded by Sandoval's preference to play for the Red Sox.
And is there a player with a worse reputation than Hanley? And he putatively reached out to the Red Sox and suggested that he could play LF? How cool is that. The return of the (wayward) prodigal son and all that. And Pedroia already on his ass.
OK, OK it probably won't last - but I'm moved by their respective attitudes -
not that probably anybody here needs convincing, but we're not just fans of any team
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Post by mgoetze on Nov 25, 2014 23:44:20 GMT -5
1050 PA in 2 seasons is a better vesting condition than what I expected for the Red Sox. Definitely happy about this structure. (5/$90m straight-up would still have been even better, though. )
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Post by jmei on Nov 26, 2014 0:21:04 GMT -5
Obviously he'll be playing half his games at Fenway, but do we think he will have the speed to play decent defense in some of the bigger ballparks? And how does his arm compare to an average outfielder? He's got a strong arm and solid athleticism, and some have thought that his best position may be LF. I'm more skeptical-- it'll be tough for a guy who has never played OF to learn reads off the bat, cutting off balls, playing ricochets, etc.
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Post by moonstone2 on Nov 26, 2014 7:58:33 GMT -5
@alexspeier: Hanley Ramirez contract: $3M bonus, 2015 - $19M, 2016-18 - $22M Vesting option for 2019: $22M Referred to him as LF Hanley Ramirez. Juan Francisco DFA'd. I don't understand why they didn't cut Weeks instead. I hope the Sox use the ten day period to sign him to a minor league deal
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Post by dirtywater on Nov 26, 2014 8:39:49 GMT -5
@alexspeier: Hanley Ramirez contract: $3M bonus, 2015 - $19M, 2016-18 - $22M Vesting option for 2019: $22M Referred to him as LF Hanley Ramirez. Juan Francisco DFA'd. I don't understand why they didn't cut Weeks instead. I hope the Sox use the ten day period to sign him to a minor league deal I think it's just a matter of us being a little bit more thin up the middle. And by thin, I mean... less thick lol
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Nov 26, 2014 9:21:54 GMT -5
@alexspeier: Hanley Ramirez contract: $3M bonus, 2015 - $19M, 2016-18 - $22M Vesting option for 2019: $22M Referred to him as LF Hanley Ramirez. Juan Francisco DFA'd. I don't understand why they didn't cut Weeks instead. I hope the Sox use the ten day period to sign him to a minor league deal On the first part, I think it's that the plan all along was to non-tender him, so losing him is more palatable. Also, his utility is diminished with BOTH Hanley and Sandoval signing, as the former basically becomes your backup third baseman based on the current roster, right? On the latter, he'll have to clear waivers before he can go to the minors. I'm 95% sure you know that, but just in case.
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Post by jmei on Nov 26, 2014 9:22:25 GMT -5
They weren't going to tender Francisco a contract (he would have cost $2m or so and wouldn't fit on the 25-man), so he was gone sooner or later.
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Post by nothingball on Nov 26, 2014 9:49:13 GMT -5
YES! Hanley now appears on the site header. It's almost like he never left!
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 26, 2014 10:13:42 GMT -5
Brock Holt may be the current backup at third. Maybe not if you are talking long term, but this team shies away from moving guys around short term so I'm guessing Hanley stays in left and doesn't fill in at third or short when Pablo and X need off days. I don't agree with that, nor do I agree with not moving Betts to second to fill in for Pedey, but it's what we should expect.
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Post by kman22 on Nov 26, 2014 10:18:23 GMT -5
Brock Holt may be the current backup at third. Maybe not if you are talking long term, but this team shies away from moving guys around short term so I'm guessing Hanley stays in left and doesn't fill in at third or short when Pablo and X need off days. I don't agree with that, nor do I agree with not moving Betts to second to fill in for Pedey, but it's what we should expect. I think that was more for Mookie because he was transitioning to the majors. Maybe at first they'll do that as Hanley transitions to LF, but I don't think they'll hold back all season.
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Post by thursty on Nov 26, 2014 11:37:11 GMT -5
Was looking at Hanley's minor league numbers, and was a bit surprised to see some of his struggles (no question Xander's numbers are better).
But it raises a question that I thought someone here might be able to answer. We're all aware of the precipitous drop in offense over the last half-dozen years or so (800 is the new 900 and all that). Has the trend been as pronounced in the minors? If you believe that the tougher PED testing has played a major role in the ML decline, it stands to reason that the minor league drop-off is less steep (since the minors had tougher testing earlier and a variety of other factors)
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Nov 26, 2014 12:12:28 GMT -5
Brock Holt may be the current backup at third. Maybe not if you are talking long term, but this team shies away from moving guys around short term so I'm guessing Hanley stays in left and doesn't fill in at third or short when Pablo and X need off days. I don't agree with that, nor do I agree with not moving Betts to second to fill in for Pedey, but it's what we should expect. Well, they showed a willingness to move Betts to second at the end of last season when Pedroia was going to be out long term. I do agree with your point though, which is a good one. May depend on the roster construction at the time - when Pedroia got hurt, for example, Holt was out too. Betts was probably option #3. Here, would probably depend if Holt were around and still hitting, in the case of a long term injury.
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Post by moonstone2 on Nov 26, 2014 20:51:27 GMT -5
It is generally agreed that the reason Hanley's minor league numbers were so poor was that he wasn't trying, which at times has been a theme throughout his professional career.
This is certainly the type of thing that talk radio overblows and likely part of the reason Hanley was willing to sign so quickly. However it's part of his risk profile.
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Post by GyIantosca on Nov 26, 2014 21:14:25 GMT -5
I am surprised when they announced Hanley at the press conference with Ben, that Dr Charles didn't have "I'm coming home" cheesy ass song in the background playing.
But I was hearing Felger and Mazz and they were making fun of Lucchino because he criticized the Yankees for overspending and I guess this is what the Sox are doing now. But my reaction is so as fans we should be outraged? I mean why cant a team change direction if they want for one season? This is not the Carl Crawford all over again because we are dropping more payroll after this season. We are not in over our heads. We can still make moves because we are well positioned. Can you believe we could make moves and not even touch our top 8 prospects.
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Post by moonstone2 on Nov 26, 2014 22:03:11 GMT -5
I don't understand why they didn't cut Weeks instead. I hope the Sox use the ten day period to sign him to a minor league deal On the first part, I think it's that the plan all along was to non-tender him, so losing him is more palatable. Also, his utility is diminished with BOTH Hanley and Sandoval signing, as the former basically becomes your backup third baseman based on the current roster, right? On the latter, he'll have to clear waivers before he can go to the minors. I'm 95% sure you know that, but just in case. If he's non-tendered he doesn't have to clear waivers to sign a minor league deal. In theory, you can negotiate a minor league deal with a player, not tender him a major league deal and then subsequently sign him. If he's DFA'd with the intention of releasing him from his major league deal and signing him to a minor league deal, he could be claimed by other teams, who could conceivably negotiate a minor league deal with him that he would sign on December 2nd. I'm pretty sure that he hasn't agreed to a major league deal for 2015, which would mean he could not be sent outright to the minors.
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Post by jimed14 on Nov 27, 2014 9:16:08 GMT -5
I am surprised when they announced Hanley at the press conference with Ben, that Dr Charles didn't have "I'm coming home" cheesy ass song in the background playing. But I was hearing Felger and Mazz and they were making fun of Lucchino because he criticized the Yankees for overspending and I guess this is what the Sox are doing now. But my reaction is so as fans we should be outraged? I mean why cant a team change direction if they want for one season? This is not the Carl Crawford all over again because we are dropping more payroll after this season. We are not in over our heads. We can still make moves because we are well positioned. Can you believe we could make moves and not even touch our top 8 prospects. They need something to complain about. If we didn't sign them, they'd be complaining that John Henry is cheap.
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Post by jmei on Nov 27, 2014 9:47:58 GMT -5
There's a pretty big difference between a four year deal through age 34/a five year deal through age 33 and the Crawford deal. These two contracts are significantly lower-risk.
(A six-year Lester deal, though...)
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Post by nhdave on Nov 29, 2014 10:48:48 GMT -5
And at least wrt to Panda, we're certain it actually wasn't about the money this time. Don't want to be maudlin, but step back a bit and think about the reach and pull that the Red Sox have; SF is not exactly a desert and yet Boston and the Red Sox have some mysterious pull on this Venezuelan-born, wealthy, undoubtedly self-absorbed and narcissistic ballplayer. The MSM is completely bemused and confounded by Sandoval's preference to play for the Red Sox. I was puzzled by it too... but keep in mind, taxwise, CA is brutal for high earners.
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