Potential Mariners trades

Wonder if they are making room for mad max

If you're talking about the Mariners, they have indicated they don't have the money and probably can't clear enough.

Mariners have indicated that they would deal Walker but in the right deal. He's not untouchable per-say.

Thanks Larry!

My thoughts

I'm of the belief that we on this board could be under valuing cespedes and Craig, especially with the moves already made this year. Also, assuming we are playing with 12 position players, 2 ml need to be traded, and I think these two are the most expendable. Both these players would carry value for the mariners.

I think the mariners would consider trading walker, if 1 they felt the trade + the rest of their offseason put them in a good position to win their division and 2 they relieved some type of future value. What the trade has to be ignorantly don't have a clue.

With the article posted above that I can't quote from my phone, would anyone really hesitate to trade cespedes and Craig for iwakuma, and walker, even without the add on prospect?

I can't recall situation where 1 high level prospect (walker has ml experience but I don't count him as a proven ml yet) was traded for multiple kid level mlb guys. Although in theory I think it works out I would never expect it to happen. But here's a thought.

Craig + cespedes + two pitching prospects not Owens or Rodriguez for walker + (add pieces here). If we signed Lester is do that trade, and is think mariners would like it too. Adds two pieces to help immediate need, Craig is signed lt, and gives 2 pieces ready to compete for starting jobs. We get a guy to slot into our rotation with ace potential. I wouldn't be surprised if I over or under valued walker in this proposal, but it is interesting.

I love the trade ideas to procure either a guy like Iwakuma (which I think would cost Cespedes plus a low level prospect to balance out the fact that he cannot garner a pick, or Napoli straight up), and even more so to acquire guys like Walker and Paxton. I believe at this point Paxton is going to be pretty close to untouchable. Right now their rotation is probably Felix, Iwakuma, Paxton, Elias and Walker (I'm quite sure that Young is a free agent, plus he's going to be 36). If we wanted to trade for Iwakuma and Walker, it would cost a ton, but I think there are some ways to make it work.

Including Napoli (or Craig if they really like him) and Cespedes both would probably be a must. Then we'd need to look at what else they could use. Their farm system is actually pretty darn strong, including Walker, Guerrero, Peterson, Wilson, Sanchez, Diaz, etc so I don't think our 40 man roster crunch candidates are what would bridge the gap. A player that I think would interest them quite a bit would be Buchholz, honestly. Even with his struggles, he still had a 4.01FIP last season, and has two years of reasonable control left beyond this one. One assumes his struggles could also be mitigated moving from the ballparks in the AL East to those in the AL West, even beyond the obviously Fenway to Safeco move.

Napoli, Cespedes, Buchholz, Ranaudo and Wright for Iwakuma, Walker and a lower level prospect like Pike, Avery or Kivlehan. I think that could make some sense for both teams.

Our line up becomes - Betts-RF; Pedroia-2b; Ortiz-DH; Ramirez-LF; Sandoval-3b; Bogaerts-SS; Nava/Craig-1b; Castillo-CF; Vazquez - C. In this scenario, I'm saying we do whatever it takes to sign Lester and the rotation is Lester, Iwakuma, Kelly, De La Rosa and Walker. Would leave us the option to trade more from the MLB/AAA pitchers (Owens, Johnson, Rodriguez, Webster, Barnes, Workman, Escobar) if we wanted to still acquire another proven MLB starter as well, obviously the prospect going out would be dependent on the return coming back, but that 6pack also provides insane depth and great upside.

The only issue for Walker is a possibly wonky shoulder. They say it's healthy but he was scheduled to throw 30 innings in the AFL and only threw 9 before he went home.

I doubt he's realistically available.

I makes little sense for them to trade Walker. They're going to need someone like him, making small money and pitching like a 2 or 3 with the amount of money they'll already have on the books. If they are to contend, Walker and Paxton are going to have to pan out pretty darn well. Hard to see either of them being dealt.

I totally forgot about that in regards to Iwakuma's contractual status being "the same" as Cespedes. My bad there.

On the idea of trying to find out how to get Walker (or Paxton) for Buchholz, here is where I fall on that: Clay is such an enigma that in my mind, you cannot project him reasonably for any level of performance. Would it surprise anyone if next year he made 30 starts with a 2.75ERA (pretty darn close to his 2010 numbers); or if he made 30 starts with a 4.75ERA (almost the average between 2012 and 2014 stats); or 15 starts with a 1.95ERA (similar to his 2013). Not me.

Now, that could have some value if you have a pretty known commodity at the top of your rotation (like the M's do with Hernandez) or we did with Lester - for sure. However, I don't think it has a lot of value when you're already depending on at least two "unknowns" with Kelly and De La Rosa AND you still need to fill in the SP1 and SP2 slot ahead of him.

He has all the talent in the world, and is on a team-friendly deal at this point. However, with so many unknowns surrounding him, I cannot help but think if you could include him in a deal to acquire a prospect with number 1 upside (but admittedly not proven) it makes a lot of sense for this Red Sox team. Especially in a world where you're looking to (or at least should be looking to) move some salary to re-sign Lester (or get Shields) along with potentially looking to extend another number two level starter. It would also help dramatically in of-setting the prospect cost to acquire Hamels.

For example, say we have to give up Owens, Escobar and Rijos to get Hamels (this is what I think of as a reasonable deal for both sides, with the caveat that Reuben Amaro is not a sane person). Giving up Owens would hurt a lot less if Walker was instead our top prospect, but starting at the major league level as our 5th starter.

Larry, did you mean Cole Hamels or Jason Hammel. Honest question since you said "Hamel".

Cole Hamels is basically a clone of Jon Lester and signed for considerably less than what I think Lester ends up at (5yrs and $110M as opposed to let's guess 6yrs and $140M). I'd give up a very good and decent prospect (like Owens and Cecchini) for Hamels.

There is also Jason Hammel, who quite frankly, is a terrible pitcher in the AL and a free agent.

Fair point on the "unloading prospects". Though I think Hamels is being pretty highly underrated here. Of course it depends on whom those group of prospects would entail. If that involves Betts or Bogaerts, yeah, it's probably too much. If we're talking Owens (whom this very site projects to be a low 2 / high 3) and other 8-20 prospects for Hamels (who has been better than top 20 in SP WAR over the past four years) he's exactly the type of guy who would help our rotation a lot.

Back to the Mariners, any of Iwakuma, Walker or Paxton would help our rotation a lot too.