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Post by kmann on Dec 11, 2014 11:15:12 GMT -5
I'm the one didn't like the trade. It was like traded from #1 starter pitcher Jon Lester for Cespendes (lasted 2 1/2 months as RS) then flipped him for #5 starter pitcher Rick Porcello. He's been Detriot #5 pitcher in his entire career there. It's dumb trade. He'll leave after one yr due to Scott Boras as his agent. I hate this. Do you think we have championship caliber pitching staff in Buchholz, Miley, Kelly, Porcello & TBD? I don't think so. There's reason why Ben gave us 2 last place finish in 3 years. I think you might be under estimating Porcello. He is a young guy who may have just figured it out. He is not a #5 in my book. However, as a stated about 30 minutes ago, I would feel a whole lot better if he was my #3 next year. It's still very early in the offseason. A lot of work to be done, but Porcello is a step in the right direction.
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Post by Don Caballero on Dec 11, 2014 11:15:32 GMT -5
I L-U-V this trade. I guess the other names floated around weren't realistic and Porcello is a very talented pitcher. Him and Kelly are two dudes who peripherals don't match the sheer stuff, so they are good bets for improvement in a non statistically way.
Get Cole Hamels and be done with the offseason.
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Dec 11, 2014 11:16:23 GMT -5
I'm the one didn't like the trade. It was like traded from #1 starter pitcher Jon Lester for Cespendes (lasted 2 1/2 months as RS) then flipped him for #5 starter pitcher Rick Porcello. He's been Detriot #5 pitcher in his entire career there. It's dumb trade. He'll leave after one yr due to Scott Boras as his agent. I hate this. Do you think we have championship caliber pitching staff in Buchholz, Miley, Kelly, Porcello & TBD? I don't think so. There's reason why Ben gave us 2 last place finish in 3 years. We still have cap room and can always get a rental starter at the trade deadline. Keep in mind Lester and Price were traded for not a whole lot last year.
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Post by MLBDreams on Dec 11, 2014 11:18:59 GMT -5
It's strange to see all of you pump up after obtain Miley & Porcello in different trades. It's not the same situation as we got Pedro Martinez & Curt Schilling (both CY Young winner aces) by the trade. I don't think Miley & Porcello will be difference maker.
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Post by jrffam05 on Dec 11, 2014 11:20:09 GMT -5
Good move, like it.
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Dec 11, 2014 11:21:09 GMT -5
It's strange to see all of you pump up after obtain Miley & Porcello in different trades. It's not the same situation as we got Pedro Martinez & Curt Schilling (both CY Young winner aces) by the trade. I don't think Miley & Porcello will be difference maker. You're right, they would've totally been better off not getting any one and rocking a 3 man rotation until the prospects are ready in July. Every trade isn't going to be for a hall of famer.
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Post by Don Caballero on Dec 11, 2014 11:21:11 GMT -5
I'm the one didn't like the trade. It was like traded from #1 starter pitcher Jon Lester for Cespendes (lasted 2 1/2 months as RS) then flipped him for #5 starter pitcher Rick Porcello. You do realize that in a world where Porcello is #5 starter the Red Sox don't have a single arm who projects as MLB rotation material, right? And that Swihart and Vazquez are backups at best, Mookie is going to reverse into a pumpkin, Xander will drop baseball and become a soprano singer, Ben Cherington is secretly Dan Shaughnessy, Dustin Pedroia is going to be a Yankee and Summer Glau ain't amazingly beautiful, right? This is anarchy!
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Dec 11, 2014 11:22:39 GMT -5
It's strange to see all of you pump up after obtain Miley & Porcello in different trades. It's not the same situation as we got Pedro Martinez & Curt Schilling (both CY Young winner aces) by the trade. I don't think Miley & Porcello will be difference maker. The Ace (and maybe masterson too) are still on the way. Thats why people are getting excited. We haven't given up a whole lot other than Ruby and Cespedes. Lot of cash and prospects still.
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,763
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Post by nomar on Dec 11, 2014 11:24:28 GMT -5
Worth nothing that Avila is a horrible framing catcher so CV will be an upgrade for Porcello.
Hope we extend him. He's from NJ and has reason o want to be in the northeast. Porcello's skillset is underrated and he's so young still. A four or five year extension would only take him through his 30/31 year old season.
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Post by youngbillrussell on Dec 11, 2014 11:27:08 GMT -5
MLBDreams go away
You can't always acquire a Pedro Martinez or a Curt Schilling
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sarcasmo
Rookie
Formerly known as mtomeo
Posts: 91
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Post by sarcasmo on Dec 11, 2014 11:27:12 GMT -5
Love this deal. Porcello isn't even 26 yet. I hope we can extend him assuming he continues his upwards trend.
Is Jordan Zimmermann still in play? Betts for Zimmermann?
Lot's of good arms hit FA next year. Maybe we just ride out this year with a bunch on mid-rotation guys hoping the offense carries us.
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Post by brendan98 on Dec 11, 2014 11:30:42 GMT -5
Looks like Tigers just got Simon from the Reds. Don't know what they gave up yet, but adding Cespedes while switching Porcello for Simon seems like a nice upgrade for them. Obviously, whatever they had to trade to the Reds might change that.
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Dec 11, 2014 11:30:58 GMT -5
Love this deal. Porcello isn't even 26 yet. I hope we can extend him assuming he continues his upwards trend. Is Jordan Zimmermann still in play? Betts for Zimmermann? Lot's of good arms hit FA next year. Maybe we just ride out this year with a bunch on mid-rotation guys hoping the offense carries us. Not sure how I would feel about trading betts for a guy with one year left on his deal.
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Post by pedroelgrande on Dec 11, 2014 11:32:51 GMT -5
Love this deal. Porcello isn't even 26 yet. I hope we can extend him assuming he continues his upwards trend. Is Jordan Zimmermann still in play? Betts for Zimmermann? Lot's of good arms hit FA next year. Maybe we just ride out this year with a bunch on mid-rotation guys hoping the offense carries us. Nice username you have there... No Betts for a 1-year rental is a no go.
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Post by Don Caballero on Dec 11, 2014 11:34:02 GMT -5
Looks like Tigers just got Simon from the Reds. Don't know what they gave up yet, but adding Cespedes while switching Porcello for Simon seems like a nice upgrade for them. Obviously, whatever they had to trade to the Reds might change that. Simon as in ALFREDO SIMON? He isn't an upgrade over Porcello.
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Post by sbones13 on Dec 11, 2014 11:35:45 GMT -5
It's strange to see all of you pump up after obtain Miley & Porcello in different trades. It's not the same situation as we got Pedro Martinez & Curt Schilling (both CY Young winner aces) by the trade. I don't think Miley & Porcello will be difference maker. I also wish we got 2 hall of famers instead of Miley and Porcello...
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badfishnbc
Veteran
Doing you all a favor and leaving through the gate in right field since 2012.
Posts: 410
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Post by badfishnbc on Dec 11, 2014 11:40:05 GMT -5
It's strange to see all of you pump up after obtain Miley & Porcello in different trades. It's not the same situation as we got Pedro Martinez & Curt Schilling (both CY Young winner aces) by the trade. I don't think Miley & Porcello will be difference maker. Pitching, pitching, and more pitching. That's what makes the difference. You need as many proven arms as you can get, and these guys are proven. It wasn't just Pedro and Schilling in 2004 - it was Lowe and Arroyo and Wakefield getting us through the other 3 days.
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Post by ancientsoxfogey on Dec 11, 2014 11:43:15 GMT -5
I think our next move should be to trade Clay and other pieces for a pitching upgrade, because people on this board have so much trouble spelling Buchholz.
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Post by brendan98 on Dec 11, 2014 11:43:44 GMT -5
Looks like Tigers just got Simon from the Reds. Don't know what they gave up yet, but adding Cespedes while switching Porcello for Simon seems like a nice upgrade for them. Obviously, whatever they had to trade to the Reds might change that. Simon as in ALFREDO SIMON? He isn't an upgrade over Porcello. Simon and Cespedes upgrades the Tigers over Porcello alone (have to find out what the Tigers gave up to get Simon though).
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Post by moonstone2 on Dec 11, 2014 11:44:04 GMT -5
I think that he has a lot more risk than you think he does.....but there are indications that they are going to try him out in the rotation at least to start. I think they want to give one spot to a guy who has major league options so they aren't stuck if he doesn't work out. Given that they have a gaggle of starting pitching prospects that are at least ready for AAA that seems like a wise idea. And take your meds....when I skip mine I make even less sense than I normally do Already missing Colbert. All pitchers have risk, risk which is hard to estimate. That's why it's great to have 4 or 5 viable starting candidates stashed in AAA (I haven't given up on Escobar). I think Wright's going to be the long man and spot starter. Great role for him. Yeah the concept of a long-man spot starter doesn't work as well anymore. It used to be that managers wouldn't hesitate to take a guy out in the 2nd or 3rd inning if he didn't have his stuff. Now that only happens if he's absolutely creamed. You can't really have a guy in a bullpen that you don't want to bring in with runners on base and it's hard to do that with a knuckleballer. I really do think they were encouraged by how he pitched in September. He was the only one of the inexperienced pitchers who managed to throw strikes consistently. If he doesn't work out they can option him. I personally think they are done with starters. If they do get another starter, it's because they want to put Joe Kelly in the bullpen, where he'd likely be great by the way.
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Post by sibbysisti on Dec 11, 2014 11:47:03 GMT -5
Worth nothing that Avila is a horrible framing catcher so CV will be an upgrade for Porcello. Hope we extend him. He's from NJ and has reason o want to be in the northeast. Porcello's skillset is underrated and he's so young still. A four or five year extension would only take him through his 30/31 year old season. Read somewhere where he is building a house in Vermont. That's Soxnation.
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Post by hockeypuck2008 on Dec 11, 2014 11:47:15 GMT -5
Exorcising the ghost of Julio Lugo exactly. Finally putting that horrible signing behind us.
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Post by brendan98 on Dec 11, 2014 11:47:47 GMT -5
New report saying the Reds are close to dealing Latos to the Marlins. If this is so, can Cueto be far behind?
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Post by GyIantosca on Dec 11, 2014 11:48:05 GMT -5
So we gave up Cepedes ,Alex Wilson and Gabe Speier. I can live with that.
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Post by awall on Dec 11, 2014 11:48:55 GMT -5
Simon as in ALFREDO SIMON? He isn't an upgrade over Porcello. Simon and Cespedes upgrades the Tigers over Porcello alone (have to find out what the Tigers gave up to get Simon though). from ESPN: The Reds have traded RHP Alfredo Simon to the Tigers for INF Eugenio Suarez and RHP Jonathon Crawford.
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