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John Tomase to WEEI, Speier to Globe
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Post by grandsalami on Jan 1, 2015 18:40:55 GMT -5
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TearsIn04
Veteran
Everybody knows Nelson de la Rosa, but who is Karim Garcia?
Posts: 2,810
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Post by TearsIn04 on Jan 1, 2015 19:08:32 GMT -5
Wow, it sure is. They could have hired CHB if they wanted someone that unpopular. I'm amused, however, that in the paragraph where Tomase lists columnists he admires he lists just about everybody in town except CHB.
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Post by adiospaydro2005 on Jan 1, 2015 21:38:04 GMT -5
Here's a link to story about Tomase's mistake which is a cardinal sign as a reporter. The fact that this story was published the day before the Patriots were to play the Giants in the Super Bowl made it even worse. Listing Borges, who has faced a number of plagarism allegations, as someone he looks up to isn't going to endear him with any Patriots' fan, particularly given his anti-Patriot slant. sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3398828
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Jan 2, 2015 10:06:30 GMT -5
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Post by flasox on Jan 2, 2015 10:14:17 GMT -5
I don't understand why anybody would give credence to anything Tomase prints. His reputation from his days as the beat writer for the Pats is well established as being without journalistic integrity.
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Post by Jonathan Singer on Jan 2, 2015 11:14:44 GMT -5
To me it will always be apart of him as a writer no matter what he does. One is lucky is have been still employed by the Herald after that piece and two he is lucky he was not sued by the Patriots for defamation.
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Post by mattpicard on Jan 2, 2015 12:15:44 GMT -5
I don't understand why anybody would give credence to anything Tomase prints. His reputation from his days as the beat writer for the Pats is well established as being without journalistic integrity. That's kind of harsh to completely write the guy off as a bum, however terrible the spygate/Patriots mistake was. Since switching to covering the Sox, he's been a decent writer/reporter (you could do a hell of a lot worse), and he's a pretty good guy with a great sense of humor. Also, Speier and Bradford wouldn't be so full of praise for him (or, in Bradford's case, he wouldn't have hired him) if he was just some hack.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Jan 2, 2015 13:01:08 GMT -5
I don't understand why anybody would give credence to anything Tomase prints. His reputation from his days as the beat writer for the Pats is well established as being without journalistic integrity. That's kind of harsh to completely write the guy off as a bum, however terrible the spygate/Patriots mistake was. Since switching to covering the Sox, he's been a decent writer/reporter (you could do a hell of a lot worse), and he's a pretty good guy with a great sense of humor. Also, Speier and Bradford wouldn't be so full of praise for him (or, in Bradford's case, he wouldn't have hired him) if he was just some hack. FWIW, Tomase started by covering the Red Sox (he was at the Tribune when I was, although I literally never met him - he worked out of Boston and was rarely in North Andover). When he moved to the Herald was when they put him on the Pats beat. But he's been a baseball writer for much longer.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Jan 2, 2015 13:22:36 GMT -5
he is lucky he was not sued by the Patriots for defamation. Not true at all. They'd have had to show actual malice on his part. As for losing his job, he had a source and ran with it. It's likely that an editor at the Herald was satisfied with his reporting enough to green-light the piece. Huge mistake, but not one I'd say is worth firing him on for his first offense. It's not like he made the thing up from whole cloth.
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Post by flasox27 on Jan 2, 2015 13:37:05 GMT -5
I guess your defense of Tomase is from the perspective of solely a Sox fan rather than the perspective of a Boston sports fan like myself. I was never a reader of the suburban Boston papers only the Globe, Herald and Record so my only exposure to him was in the Herald. When he broke the entirely unsupported and erroneous story about the Pats at eve of the Superbowl in order to make his name,he destroyed what ever journalistic credibility he had or would ever have in the minds of most Boston sports fans. I enjoy reading your site for Sox information but in my opinion the Herald and WEEI have made a serious mistake in affiliating themselves with in a likelihood the most despised writer in Boston.
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Post by mattpicard on Jan 2, 2015 13:47:08 GMT -5
I guess your defense of Tomase is from the perspective of solely a Sox fan rather than the perspective of a Boston sports fan like myself. I was never a reader of the suburban Boston papers only the Globe, Herald and Record so my only exposure to him was in the Herald. When he broke the entirely unsupported and erroneous story about the Pats at eve of the Superbowl in order to make his name,he destroyed what ever journalistic credibility he had or would ever have in the minds of most Boston sports fans. I enjoy reading your site for Sox information but in my opinion the Herald and WEEI have made a serious mistake in affiliating themselves with in a likelihood the most despised writer in Boston. Well, you're right in that I'm a die-hard baseball guy, where as I follow the NFL by far the least of the big four sports. But, everyone concedes how catastrophic of a whiff that move was by Tomase. I'm not saying it should simply be excused as a rookie mistake, and yes, he's quite fortunate that he was kept on at the Herald and got to continuing covering a major sport, but it was also 8+ years ago. Does it permanently render him an unethical, scummy, POS journalist? Combining my unwillingness to judge someone's entire character by one incident with having followed him over the years with the Sox, I just think a complete dismissal of him is unfair and misguided. ADD: And every journalist seeks to "make a name" for him or herself. It's not like he proved to be some selfish, awful person by badly wanting to break a huge story. He saw an opportunity, and struggled to balance his fact checking with the ability for a career-breakthrough opportunity. Yes, it's a good journalists job to achieve that balanced, and in this one instance, he failed miserably in what was a massive spotlight due to the magnitude of the event he was reporting on. Still, it doesn't make him a terrible guy, or a perpetually terrible journalist.
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Post by flasox27 on Jan 2, 2015 13:51:49 GMT -5
he is lucky he was not sued by the Patriots for defamation. Not true at all. They'd have had to show actual malice on his part. As for losing his job, he had a source and ran with it. It's likely that an editor at the Herald was satisfied with his reporting enough to green-light the piece. Huge mistake, but not one I'd say is worth firing him on for his first offense. It's not like he made the thing up from whole cloth. I must disagree with you here. Every other paper had the same information and did not consider the souirce reliable. He ran the story to make himself a reputation and he certainly received earned. The fact that he was retained by the Herald is just a reflection on the lack of journalistic integrity for the newspaper. For those old enough to remember the Record newspaper in Boston, the Herald is just a less credible version.
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Post by flasox27 on Jan 2, 2015 14:08:11 GMT -5
I guess your defense of Tomase is from the perspective of solely a Sox fan rather than the perspective of a Boston sports fan like myself. I was never a reader of the suburban Boston papers only the Globe, Herald and Record so my only exposure to him was in the Herald. When he broke the entirely unsupported and erroneous story about the Pats at eve of the Superbowl in order to make his name,he destroyed what ever journalistic credibility he had or would ever have in the minds of most Boston sports fans. I enjoy reading your site for Sox information but in my opinion the Herald and WEEI have made a serious mistake in affiliating themselves with in a likelihood the most despised writer in Boston. Well, you're right in that I'm a die-hard baseball guy, where as I follow the NFL by far the least of the big four sports. But, everyone concedes how catastrophic of a whiff that move was by Tomase. I'm not saying it should simply be excused as a rookie mistake, and yes, he's quite fortunate that he was kept on at the Herald and got to continuing covering a major sport, but it was also 8+ years ago. Does it permanently render him an unethical, scummy, POS journalist? Combining my unwillingness to judge someone's entire character by one incident with having followed him over the years with the Sox, I just think a complete dismissal of him is unfair and misguided. ADD: And every journalist seeks to "make a name" for him or herself. It's not like he proved to be some selfish, awful person by badly wanting to break a huge story. He saw an opportunity, and struggled to balance his fact checking with the ability for a career-breakthrough opportunity. Yes, it's a good journalists job to achieve that balanced, and in this one instance, he failed miserably in what was a massive spotlight due to the magnitude of the event he was reporting on. Still, it doesn't make him a terrible guy, or a perpetually terrible journalist. I guess we are just going to disagree about Tomase. IMO, once a person shows he sacrifices his integrity in order further his career, it cannot be recaptured. You may think that the Boston sports fans have forgotten and forgiven Tomase, I can assure you that is not the case. Just read the response to him on the WEEI site.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Jan 2, 2015 15:45:51 GMT -5
Moved some more Tomase tangent posts in here. Sorry if things don't line up great time-wise.
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Post by knuckledown on Jan 2, 2015 20:54:23 GMT -5
I guess your defense of Tomase is from the perspective of solely a Sox fan rather than the perspective of a Boston sports fan like myself. I was never a reader of the suburban Boston papers only the Globe, Herald and Record so my only exposure to him was in the Herald. When he broke the entirely unsupported and erroneous story about the Pats at eve of the Superbowl in order to make his name,he destroyed what ever journalistic credibility he had or would ever have in the minds of most Boston sports fans. I enjoy reading your site for Sox information but in my opinion the Herald and WEEI have made a serious mistake in affiliating themselves with in a likelihood the most despised writer in Boston. Well that's a relief. Now I can continue pretending I don't care. -Dan Shaughnessy
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Post by flasox27 on Jan 3, 2015 7:28:50 GMT -5
The CHB is just generically obnoxious in my mind and I don't read his column in the Globe. The fat slob Tomase is completely without journalistic integrity and responsible for one the most egregious stories in Boston Sports history. He was employed by a bird cage liner which matched his level of intergrity. Now WEEI will be contaminated by his presence.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jan 3, 2015 8:07:46 GMT -5
Obviously people hate Shaughnessy and I used to be one of them but he's one of the if not the best writer in town. He gets overbearing with pessimism which is too bad because he's phenomenal at times and has a wealth of Boston Sports historical knowledge. I'm not saying he should be all sunshine but he doesn't have to be so negative. At least he's not Minehane obnoxious. DS bangs out some masterpieces along the way, especially when he writes something about less mainstream things like HS sports, college stuff or something else outside the 4 major sports. He's not perfect and makes me hate him but he also touches other emotions which is what a writer should do. He's a columnist not a reporter and he's great at it. Those of you blinded by hatred, probably mostly due to it being the in thing versus really reading a lot of his different work, are missing a legitimate talent.
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Post by adiospaydro2005 on Jan 3, 2015 9:19:02 GMT -5
To me journalistic integrity is important. You either have or you do not. Tomase's reputation will always be tainted by the unfounded spygate reporting, just like Borges' and Barnicle's reputations will be forever tainted by plagiarism.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jan 3, 2015 9:43:31 GMT -5
Pardon my ignorance but my understanding is that he retracted because of insufficient evidence not that it's definitely not true. I have not heard that his source has retracted his statement, but perhaps he/she has...
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Post by flasox27 on Jan 3, 2015 11:50:54 GMT -5
The bottom line is that his source could not substantiate his statements and was totally discredited. Other writers and newspapers had the same information and would not run the story because it could not be verified. They had journalistic standards that the fat slob Tomase and his rag of a newspaper didn't. Consequently, he has no credibility for most Boston sports fans regardless of what sport he covers. There will always be a few dupes that still believe his stories but then they are not real Boston sports fans. Feel free to turn to the WEEI and see the reception Tomase is receiving.
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Post by moonstone2 on Jan 3, 2015 13:07:28 GMT -5
The Boston Globe Sunday notes section is a legendary space. It's one of the largest baseball columns in the country and one of the first to feature real information as opposed to just scores or a local sports writers opinions.
I am sure I am not the only one here who spent childhood Sunday's waiting for the Globe while devouring the column in their room. I loved hearing what Gammons had to say about Kevin Kennedy's "fire drill" bullpen or the latest prospect.
The column has unfortunately for years had the wrong caretaker in one Nick Cafardo. Cafardo is a lazy reporter who uses the column to promote his friends, or drive the narrative of the month. His opinions are inconsistent, and often unsupported. When he does bother to use actual "facts" they are often incomplete or just plain wrong.
Spier is one of the best writers in town. Unlike many of his current colleagues his articles are well researched and often offer a unique perspective as opposed to a tired narrative. It is my hope that his move to the Globe is a first step to restore and improve upon what Peter Gammons built and Nick Cafardo has tried his best to ruin.
If he does then maybe I might make it a point to read the Globe again.
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Post by flasox27 on Jan 3, 2015 16:02:56 GMT -5
The Boston Globe Sunday notes section is a legendary space. It's one of the largest baseball columns in the country and one of the first to feature real information as opposed to just scores or a local sports writers opinions. I am sure I am not the only one here who spent childhood Sunday's waiting for the Globe while devouring the column in their room. I loved hearing what Gammons had to say about Kevin Kennedy's "fire drill" bullpen or the latest prospect. The column has unfortunately for years had the wrong caretaker in one Nick Cafardo. Cafardo is a lazy reporter who uses the column to promote his friends, or drive the narrative of the month. His opinions are inconsistent, and often unsupported. When he does bother to use actual "facts" they are often incomplete or just plain wrong. Spier is one of the best writers in town. Unlike many of his current colleagues his articles are well researched and often offer a unique perspective as opposed to a tired narrative. It is my hope that his move to the Globe is a first step to restore and improve upon what Peter Gammons built and Nick Cafardo has tried his best to ruin. If he does then maybe I might make it a point to read the Globe again. Couldn't agree more, Spier is a real baseball writer.
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Post by bighead on Jan 3, 2015 16:35:57 GMT -5
The Boston Globe Sunday notes section is a legendary space. It's one of the largest baseball columns in the country and one of the first to feature real information as opposed to just scores or a local sports writers opinions. I am sure I am not the only one here who spent childhood Sunday's waiting for the Globe while devouring the column in their room. I loved hearing what Gammons had to say about Kevin Kennedy's "fire drill" bullpen or the latest prospect. The column has unfortunately for years had the wrong caretaker in one Nick Cafardo. Cafardo is a lazy reporter who uses the column to promote his friends, or drive the narrative of the month. His opinions are inconsistent, and often unsupported. When he does bother to use actual "facts" they are often incomplete or just plain wrong. Spier is one of the best writers in town. Unlike many of his current colleagues his articles are well researched and often offer a unique perspective as opposed to a tired narrative. It is my hope that his move to the Globe is a first step to restore and improve upon what Peter Gammons built and Nick Cafardo has tried his best to ruin. If he does then maybe I might make it a point to read the Globe again. Cafardo plugged Johnny Damon as a potential free agent last week. Enough said.
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Post by James Dunne on Jan 4, 2015 11:49:48 GMT -5
Cafardo plugged Johnny Damon as a potential free agent last week. Enough said. Wait. You mean for this season? That is embarrassing.
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Post by moonstone2 on Jan 4, 2015 12:24:33 GMT -5
Cafardo plugged Johnny Damon as a potential free agent last week. Enough said. Wait. You mean for this season? That is embarrassing. He also called for MLB to restrict shifting versus lefty sluggers and wrote incorrectly that the Red Sox and Yankees could not sign Yoan Monacada before July 2 because they are over the cap. He's lazy and an embarrassment. Alex needs to write that column.
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