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8/24-8/26 Red Sox @ White Sox Series Thread
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Post by soxfan1615 on Aug 26, 2015 8:11:46 GMT -5
Brian MacPherson @brianmacp 11m11 minutes ago Lovullo said trying Ramirez out at first base hadn't been discussed before Dombrowski came on board last week. I find this incredible. I mean that in the original sense of the word, that it is so outlandish it's not even credible. Maybe it wasn't discussed with Hanley, so Lovullo says that to make Hanley feel better? Or Lovullo wasn't in on the discussion? Neither of those make much sense either, but moving Hanley to first was such an obvious move I was treating it as a given. How could this not have been discussed? Ben Cherington.
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Post by jrffam05 on Aug 26, 2015 8:16:40 GMT -5
Crazy idea, but I wonder if there have been any discussions of playing Bradley in CF now that DD is here.
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Post by joshv02 on Aug 26, 2015 8:18:59 GMT -5
I think, actually, this is exactly why I like Cherington and why he is so often derided. He moves slowly - he appears to look at data, make a decision, and not get swayed by short term swings (at least excluded RPs). He extends that thought process to drafting, too - he'll still look at players previously well regarded having bad years. I love that way of looking at the world, but I understand people hate it. In general, a player good enough to be a ML IFer should be able to be a ML outfielder. I'd certainly believe a story that said he didn't like a 100 game sample over a 100 year history.
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Post by redsoxrich on Aug 26, 2015 9:01:16 GMT -5
Did anyone find that game bizarre last night? It was like Lovullo was intentionally trying to lose the game or at the very least not trying to win. Seemed the same with Tazawa on Sunday. I can see bringing Miley back for 8th, but once leadoff hitter got on, he should have been hooked. Bad bullpen or not, Ogando had to be better in that situation. It seems to me one of two possibilities: 1) Dombrowski told him to find out what these guys are made of regardless of outcome (maybe to ensure protected draft pick?); or 2) teaching Miley a lesson for showing up Farrell earlier.
I would think some of the veterans who still care about winning would be upset and some of the young guys would be frustrated as they had battled hard to get that lead against a pretty good pitcher.
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Post by threeifbaerga on Aug 26, 2015 9:13:58 GMT -5
I don't see the intent to lose, but Miley should certainly have come out earlier than he did. Only problem being there is one arm in that bullpen that deserves any trust right now. It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation right now. Because everything is terrible.
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Aug 26, 2015 9:24:17 GMT -5
Hanley appeared unable to get his glove all the way down on that ball. I would, too, but have four decades on Hanley and, to quote Don and Gerry, have to contend with a bit of a boiler. Is his Inflexibility due to workout/lifting regimen? He will need some more flexibility to succeed at 1B, and he will have plenty of time over the next 6 months to accomplish that. IMO, If Hanley can play 1B well AND HIT again, he has more overall value to the team than potential targets Chris Davis or Joey Votto. If he plays about 100G at 1B, backed by Shaw, and backed Papi at DH 20-30G, and pinch hit the rest of the way, he could contribute substantially.. He didn't contribute much tonight, but hope springs eternal. Since when is Joey Votto a target? I mean he's great, but he's signed through 2030 practically.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 26, 2015 9:27:08 GMT -5
Brian MacPherson @brianmacp 11m11 minutes ago Lovullo said trying Ramirez out at first base hadn't been discussed before Dombrowski came on board last week. I find this incredible. I mean that in the original sense of the word, that it is so outlandish it's not even credible. Maybe it wasn't discussed with Hanley, so Lovullo says that to make Hanley feel better? Or Lovullo wasn't in on the discussion? Neither of those make much sense either, but moving Hanley to first was such an obvious move I was treating it as a given. How could this not have been discussed? I had the same reaction. All this means is it wasn't discussed with Lovullo. I'd be stunned if Cherington hadn't discussed this with guys like Hazen, Baird, etc., at the very least, if not with the coaching staff.
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danr
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Post by danr on Aug 26, 2015 9:28:17 GMT -5
The impression I am getting from listening to the pre-game radio interviews with Lovullo is that almost everything being done now has little to do with winning now, but setting the stage for what will happen in the off season. It is clear that they want to get a better idea about some players. I think he was trying to see how much they could get out of Miley, in part because there is no one better in the bullpen, but also because his job with the Sox probably is in the balance.
Dombrowski is actively involved in day to day decisions now as evidenced by what has been reported about trying Hanley at 1B. Changes are coming.
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Aug 26, 2015 10:39:07 GMT -5
Nomar, Votto as a potential trade target has recently appeared in a couple of boards. Most recently, someone suggested a Votto/Chapman deal. The responses, if I remember correctly, ranged from "just to it because it fixes two big problems" to "that contract and his age is a deal breaker". I agree with the latter and suspect DDski does too.
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Post by brianthetaoist on Aug 26, 2015 10:52:33 GMT -5
I think, actually, this is exactly why I like Cherington and why he is so often derided. He moves slowly - he appears to look at data, make a decision, and not get swayed by short term swings (at least excluded RPs). He extends that thought process to drafting, too - he'll still look at players previously well regarded having bad years. I love that way of looking at the world, but I understand people hate it. In general, a player good enough to be a ML IFer should be able to be a ML outfielder. I'd certainly believe a story that said he didn't like a 100 game sample over a 100 year history. I generally agree with this ... I liked that about Cherington, too, and it's why I thought bumping him *up* to President and getting a good GM was a viable path forward. He seemed to have an excellent long-term plan and view, made solid choices on the investments that pay off over the long haul, and did a good job of managing the different factions internally, it seemed from the reporting. The organization's in great shape, really, from his time as GM. But he just seemed to have problems managing the things that happen on a quicker timeline, the roster management in-season (like the disastrous Drew panic-signing last year), etc. Or at least the Red Sox did during his reign, which amounts to the same thing for our purposes. Now, again, I just have a hard time believing that Hanley-to-first wasn't even discussed, but the fact of the matter is that it should've been in the works already (or at least extensively discussed in a group that included Lovullo), so unless Lovullo is mischaracterizing this for other reasons (ie "lying"), they were way behind the curve on a very obvious move that needed to happen to prepare for the offseason.
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Post by DesignatedForAssignment on Aug 26, 2015 10:58:57 GMT -5
Is there a good chance that Breslow gets the DFA by Friday? That would give them a few days to trade him and, if unable to do so, he gets released in time to sign with a contender by the Aug 31 deadline.
I cannot believe Breslow could be with the team until October.
EDIT: Maybe today ... countermove to Porcello activated. (yeah, he's taking up a 40-man roster spot.)
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 26, 2015 11:22:18 GMT -5
The impression I am getting from listening to the pre-game radio interviews with Lovullo is that almost everything being done now has little to do with winning now, but setting the stage for what will happen in the off season. It is clear that they want to get a better idea about some players. I think he was trying to see how much they could get out of Miley, in part because there is no one better in the bullpen, but also because his job with the Sox probably is in the balance. Dombrowski is actively involved in day to day decisions now as evidenced by what has been reported about trying Hanley at 1B. Changes are coming. To me it seems that he's doing everything he can to honor John Farrell's managing style. He has done nothing that Farrell would not have done.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 26, 2015 11:23:59 GMT -5
Is there a good chance that Breslow gets the DFA by Friday? That would give them a few days to trade him and, if unable to do so, he gets released in time to sign with a contender by the Aug 31 deadline. I cannot believe Breslow could be with the team until October. Does it matter at this point? I doubt they could get a career minor leaguer who is the same age as him.
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Post by James Dunne on Aug 26, 2015 12:09:28 GMT -5
he gets released in time to sign with a contender by the Aug 31 deadline. There have been too many "is this sarcastic" comments on the forum in the last month but... is this sarcastic? Do you think that if a contender wanted Breslow in exchange for a pack of gum they wouldn't have traded for him already? Do you think he hasn't cleared waivers and isn't already eligible to be traded? Do you think he is good enough to be on any playoff team's roster? As one of the few on this board who actually thought bringing back Breslow was a sensible idea (I thought his '14 struggles were related to him being worked pretty hard down the stretch in '13), even I have to admit he's one of the worst pitchers in the majors at this point. Any team who wants him can have him right now for the old PTBNL/cash with a simple phone call.
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Post by ethanbein on Aug 26, 2015 12:15:32 GMT -5
I find this incredible. I mean that in the original sense of the word, that it is so outlandish it's not even credible. Maybe it wasn't discussed with Hanley, so Lovullo says that to make Hanley feel better? Or Lovullo wasn't in on the discussion? Neither of those make much sense either, but moving Hanley to first was such an obvious move I was treating it as a given. How could this not have been discussed? I had the same reaction. All this means is it wasn't discussed with Lovullo. I'd be stunned if Cherington hadn't discussed this with guys like Hazen, Baird, etc., at the very least, if not with the coaching staff. Yeah, mentioned this in the other thread, but Cherington was asked about Hanley last weekend, and he said something along the lines of "clearly it hasn't worked out, and they'll have to figure out where he plays in the future, whether that's left field or somewhere else, and those are some of the discussions we had started to have"
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Aug 26, 2015 12:46:53 GMT -5
Yeah, mentioned this in the other thread, but Cherington was asked about Hanley last weekend, and he said something along the lines of "clearly it hasn't worked out, and they'll have to figure out where he plays in the future, whether that's left field or somewhere else, and those are some of the discussions we had started to have" This is what I find incredible. Those discussions should've started before he was even acquired. I.e., "If he can't play LF, what's our move(s)?" Someone, a lot of someones, are being disingenuous. I can't stomach the alternative.
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Post by ray88h66 on Aug 26, 2015 14:46:52 GMT -5
Not sure if this has been posted already.
MLB.com reports that Erod's next start is being pushed back. No injury, workload related.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Aug 26, 2015 15:39:15 GMT -5
I think, actually, this is exactly why I like Cherington and why he is so often derided. He moves slowly - he appears to look at data, make a decision, and not get swayed by short term swings (at least excluded RPs). He extends that thought process to drafting, too - he'll still look at players previously well regarded having bad years. I love that way of looking at the world, but I understand people hate it. In general, a player good enough to be a ML IFer should be able to be a ML outfielder. I'd certainly believe a story that said he didn't like a 100 game sample over a 100 year history. I dont know if people are against moving slowly or fast, I think people want to see a purpose and a plan. He certainly checked the box of improving the farm system and he should get a ton of credit for that....but there were some of decisions that seemed very reactionary (Drew.....offensive FA class of 2015...Porcello extension) to name a few. Those decisions were made to improve poor clubs to be sure, but I don't really view his tenure as methodical in its approach.
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Post by ray88h66 on Aug 26, 2015 16:26:03 GMT -5
Mookie, JBJ, and Rusney in the outfield tonight. Shaw at first, Hanley DH. It took a big change but I see a difference.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Aug 26, 2015 18:35:25 GMT -5
he gets released in time to sign with a contender by the Aug 31 deadline. There have been too many "is this sarcastic" comments on the forum in the last month but... is this sarcastic? Do you think that if a contender wanted Breslow in exchange for a pack of gum they wouldn't have traded for him already? Do you think he hasn't cleared waivers and isn't already eligible to be traded? Do you think he is good enough to be on any playoff team's roster? As one of the few on this board who actually thought bringing back Breslow was a sensible idea (I thought his '14 struggles were related to him being worked pretty hard down the stretch in '13), even I have to admit he's one of the worst pitchers in the majors at this point. Any team who wants him can have him right now for the old PTBNL/cash with a simple phone call. I've been thinking about the whole Breslow thing recently. He's managed to keep his performance just above or at the line where you'd release him -- he has 0.2 bWAR. If he's a great clubhouse presence, a mentor to younger pitchers, that would go a long way to explaining how he's kept his job all year. (The other explanations, of course, involve the usual film-noir cliches.)
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Post by larrycook on Aug 26, 2015 18:38:37 GMT -5
Mookie, JBJ, and Rusney in the outfield tonight. Shaw at first, Hanley DH. It took a big change but I see a difference. I just want to say again what someone else said earlier, but this team is so much more enjoyable to watch since the kids started playing more. Hopefully porcello follows kelly down turnaround blvd.
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atzar
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Post by atzar on Aug 26, 2015 19:44:08 GMT -5
Sale is brutal on lefties.
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Aug 26, 2015 19:57:20 GMT -5
Xander walking :0
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Aug 26, 2015 20:06:39 GMT -5
Wow 4th inning, time for ESPN to start warning me about Porcello's perfect game.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 26, 2015 20:32:26 GMT -5
Major screw up for Porcello there, not covering 1st.
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