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Post by Don Caballero on Oct 12, 2016 23:43:46 GMT -5
I'm very confused by the way they are going about this. Its like they are trying to convince the fans that they think JF is their guy. But if he actually was, why wouldn't they just commit to him? Don't hang him out to dry in a contract year. Either fire him, or extend him. Dont play this in-between game BS. Very much agree with this, it's really poor form by the FO. It crossed my mind that they're maybe going to fire him, but are avoiding to do so right now because it would look like they're throwing him under the bus. Or maybe they really want to fire him but after Papi's glowing remarks are afraid of putting added pressure on Lovullo. Or maybe it's just sheer incompetence, at least pick his option and fire him after next year if it doesn't work.
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Post by Coreno on Oct 13, 2016 0:29:47 GMT -5
I'm very confused by the way they are going about this. Its like they are trying to convince the fans that they think JF is their guy. But if he actually was, why wouldn't they just commit to him? Don't hang him out to dry in a contract year. Either fire him, or extend him. Dont play this in-between game BS. Very much agree with this, it's really poor form by the FO. It crossed my mind that they're maybe going to fire him, but are avoiding to do so right now because it would look like they're throwing him under the bus. Or maybe they really want to fire him but after Papi's glowing remarks are afraid of putting added pressure on Lovullo. Or maybe it's just sheer incompetence, at least pick his option and fire him after next year if it doesn't work. Yeah, I mean, even if they picked up the option, it's not like that would tie their hands if they decided it wasn't working out midseason. It's just really, really odd.
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Post by Don Caballero on Oct 13, 2016 16:29:04 GMT -5
Yeah, I mean, even if they picked up the option, it's not like that would tie their hands if they decided it wasn't working out midseason. It's just really, really odd. Agreed. And I get that it's a "business decision", and from a business standpoint they're not obligated to pick up his option early. However, from a competitive standpoint I think they are. Once you dish you that contract with the club option and you get this close to it and you still want to ride the guy, you might as well just look at the option as sunk cost. It's better than lame ducking him.
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Post by amfox1 on Oct 13, 2016 16:36:54 GMT -5
I'm confused. Now all the posters who wanted Farrell fired want him to have his option exercised? And isn't this normally done in ST, not a week after the season ends, especially with someone with past health issues?
It looks like talk radio escaped into this thread.
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Post by jmei on Oct 13, 2016 16:40:41 GMT -5
I'm confused. Now all the posters who wanted Farrell fired want him to have his option exercised? And isn't this normally done in ST, not a week after the season ends, especially with someone with past health issues? It looks like talk radio escaped into this thread. It is pretty reasonable to have your rank order of preferences be (1) fire Farrell, (2) exercise the option so he's not a lame duck, (3) let him be a lame duck. Exercising the option doesn't make it more difficult to fire him, it just removes the lame duck perception.
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Post by amfox1 on Oct 13, 2016 16:57:54 GMT -5
It's October. Why would I ever exercise the option before spring training, unless there was a player decision which might depend on it?
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Post by jmei on Oct 13, 2016 17:06:21 GMT -5
Decisions on managers are regularly made early in the offseason. It reduces uncertainty for the manager, rest of the coaching staff and players, and it's not like you're going to get any additional information over the course of the offseason that would affect your decision-making process.
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Post by soxcentral on Oct 13, 2016 21:00:57 GMT -5
I'm confused. Now all the posters who wanted Farrell fired want him to have his option exercised? And isn't this normally done in ST, not a week after the season ends, especially with someone with past health issues? It looks like talk radio escaped into this thread. Not all of us. I'd fully expect a change next year if they get off to a slow start. Also, I'd be surprised if the option is picked up even in ST.
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Post by Guidas on Oct 14, 2016 16:38:03 GMT -5
I don't want him, but since they've committed they should exercise the option to signal to the team that he's the front office's guy. If they can him in June the payout is relatively smaller compared to other expenditures. Price of doing business.
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Post by klostrophobic on Oct 14, 2016 16:49:46 GMT -5
I'm very confused by the way they are going about this. Its like they are trying to convince the fans that they think JF is their guy. But if he actually was, why wouldn't they just commit to him? Don't hang him out to dry in a contract year. Either fire him, or extend him. Dont play this in-between game BS. Very much agree with this, it's really poor form by the FO. It crossed my mind that they're maybe going to fire him, but are avoiding to do so right now because it would look like they're throwing him under the bus. Or maybe they really want to fire him but after Papi's glowing remarks are afraid of putting added pressure on Lovullo. Or maybe it's just sheer incompetence, at least pick his option and fire him after next year if it doesn't work. Or Dombrowski is saving the 'fire Farrell' chip to play when things go wrong. If he fires him now, the honus to win will fall on his construction of the organization. If he keeps Farrell, he can say, "hey, I put quality players onto the team, the guy who was under contract when I showed up just failed to use them properly." May as well save that chip to use until you are required to play it from a strictly self-serving POV. Or it's all just lip service and they'll fire him in a month when they have a succession plan. Kind of impossible to say at this point. Maybe they have their eyes on someone who is on Dusty Baker's staff and they're waiting for Baker and his coaches to get thrown out of Washington at this point.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Oct 15, 2016 14:08:51 GMT -5
If Farrell is so good at getting the most from his players, why is it that virtually every year he under-performs the pre-season win estimates,usually significantly, every place he's been ?
From the outside looking in, it appears that Pedroia and Ortiz have had a bigger effect there.
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Post by sibbysisti on Oct 16, 2016 19:36:13 GMT -5
Chris. Gasper the latest scribe to endorse Dombrowski's decision to retain Farrell.
Today's Boston Globe.
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Post by grandsalami on Dec 5, 2016 17:25:59 GMT -5
To extend
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Post by DesignatedKyle on Dec 5, 2016 17:29:59 GMT -5
sigh.
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Post by jmei on Dec 5, 2016 17:51:39 GMT -5
Doesn't really mean that much. It is accepted dogma that managers should not enter the last year of their contracts because it creates the perception that he is a lame duck and players will walk all over him. Teams generally do not hesitate to fire managers with a year+ on their deals because manager salaries are generally insignificant.
That said, I genuinely think that Dombrowski thinks John Farrell is a fine manager. That may change, but I'd be surprised if it changed anytime soon.
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Post by thursty on Dec 5, 2016 18:48:57 GMT -5
And like so much of baseball dogma, it's probably bunk
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Post by rookie13 on Dec 5, 2016 19:40:30 GMT -5
John Farrell may not be a great manager, and hell, he may not even be a decent one. But he's managing a team that, despite all our criticisms towards him, just finished in 1st place. While I personally think he is not a good manager, we could certainly have worse. This team is good enough to win, even when he makes in game decisions that are obviously poor.
And as stated above, not many teams let their manager get to just one year left. Do any of us want to hear a year of reporters asking Farrell about his contract situation, and if he'll be managing the team next year?
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Post by sibbysisti on Dec 5, 2016 22:43:00 GMT -5
Coaches to remain. Hopefully Bannister with more responsibility.
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Post by sibbysisti on Dec 5, 2016 22:47:15 GMT -5
See below.
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Post by sibbysisti on Dec 5, 2016 22:48:28 GMT -5
Good news on John. He may not be a Torre, LaSorda or even Francona, but he carries the respect of his players who give him their best efforts. Stability is important for any chance of success.
It may be time to change the thread title.
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Post by Don Caballero on Dec 5, 2016 22:58:16 GMT -5
The John Farrell Intangibles Club of Awesomeness approves this one.
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Post by soxjim on Apr 20, 2017 21:25:21 GMT -5
Good news on John. He may not be a Torre, LaSorda or even Francona, but he carries the respect of his players who give him their best efforts. Stability is important for any chance of success. It may be time to change the thread title. Last year he deserved to be fired. Don't know why the thread title should change. His blunders from last year were real. Just because those want to pretend it didn't happen doesn't make it true.
Good for him if he learned.
Odd that this thread gets bumped. We really want to rehash his last year blunders again?
We're looking good this year so far - and this thread gets bumped -- and that other thread of DD -- all the negative -- very odd. Whatever.
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Post by jimed14 on Apr 21, 2017 6:59:47 GMT -5
Good news on John. He may not be a Torre, LaSorda or even Francona, but he carries the respect of his players who give him their best efforts. Stability is important for any chance of success. It may be time to change the thread title. Last year he deserved to be fired. Don't know why the thread title should change. His blunders from last year were real. Just because those want to pretend it didn't happen doesn't make it true.
Good for him if he learned.
Odd that this thread gets bumped. We really want to rehash his last year blunders again?
We're looking good this year so far - and this thread gets bumped -- and that other thread of DD -- all the negative -- very odd. Whatever.
Odd that you complained about bumping it when quoting a post from December.
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Post by soxjim on Apr 21, 2017 7:16:12 GMT -5
Last year he deserved to be fired. Don't know why the thread title should change. His blunders from last year were real. Just because those want to pretend it didn't happen doesn't make it true.
Good for him if he learned.
Odd that this thread gets bumped. We really want to rehash his last year blunders again?
We're looking good this year so far - and this thread gets bumped -- and that other thread of DD -- all the negative -- very odd. Whatever.
Odd that you complained about bumping it when quoting a post from December. Ohh damn I didn't even notice that. Second time I've done that. It appeared up near the top.
I'm sorry to everyone. Damn-- I messed up.
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Post by dnfl333 on Apr 21, 2017 20:34:10 GMT -5
Nothing has changed.. Farrell still sux and he proved it yesterday by not letting Sale finish a gem..
Every move is the wrong move.. thanks Dave
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