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Sox sign Stephen Drew 1/9.5mil
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Post by elguapo on Dec 17, 2012 12:38:38 GMT -5
Drew has averaged 3.89 pitches per plate appearance for his career, 4.06 over the last 3, career high 4.28 in 2012.
Personally I still can't fathom why the Sox didn't pick up J.J. Hardy when the Brewers dumped him a couple years ago. What a tragicomedy of errors.
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Post by larrycook on Dec 17, 2012 13:36:32 GMT -5
I like this signing as well.
My question is what happens in June 2013 when it's time to bring Bogaerts up and Iglisias is only hitting 230 and Drew is hitting pretty good for us in Boston?
Do the Sox move Iglisias to 2nd or Bogaerts to 3rd and/or a corner OF spot?
PS: you'd think the Drews would name a kid or two after John Henry for as much money as he has thrown at that family.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Dec 17, 2012 13:39:34 GMT -5
You can say this is a typical 2012-2013 offseason signing. It upgrades a position from awful to mediocre/average. Most great teams are filled with a few stars and a bunch of league average players. The Sox are filled with a bunch of mediocre to league average players and too few excellent players which is why I have them in the 75 - 85 win range.
The move fits in with the offseason's MO. Would I have done it? Yup. I don't trust Iglesias's bat, but then again unless Drew hits a good deal which he hasn't in awhile, he might wind up being replaced by Iglesias anyways - if Drew's range is suspect and his bat superiority doesn't make up for Iglesias's defensive superiority. Either way, the Sox need to have a safety net in place better than Ciriaco and they do.
Would I have made the moves the Sox made this offseason? Yeah, I think so with the exception of the Victorino signing - I think that one is a headscratcher. I also think the Sox could have cashed in some of their chips to improve their farm system and used the saved money to try to dumpsterdive for a bargain this offseason.
My best hope for this transaction is that Drew gets healthy, has a nice year, nice enough the Sox make him a qualifying offer - he turns it down and the Sox get a draft pick out it while he signs with somebody else for 2014 and beyond.
My guess is he'll get hurt somewhere along the line and Iglesias will wind up with the job evenutally anyways - but it wouldn't hurt Iglesias to get more ABs in Pawtucket. He hasn't exactly conquered that level with his bat anyways.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Dec 17, 2012 13:40:46 GMT -5
I like this signing as well. My question is what happens in June 2013 when it's time to bring Bogaerts up and Iglisias is only hitting 230 and Drew is hitting pretty good for us in Boston? I suppose that could happen, but I'd be surprised if it did. I wouldn't think they'd jump Bogaerts THAT fast. It certainly would be a great problem to have.
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Post by ramireja on Dec 17, 2012 13:41:46 GMT -5
for all the 'mediocre' pickups this offseason.....I think this offense has a real chance to surprise the naysayers.
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wcp3
Veteran
Posts: 3,814
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Post by wcp3 on Dec 17, 2012 13:44:44 GMT -5
I like this signing as well. My question is what happens in June 2013 when it's time to bring Bogaerts up and Iglisias is only hitting 230 and Drew is hitting pretty good for us in Boston? Maybe we should cross then bridge when we get there? Bogaerts is going to start the year in Portland. It's pointless to make any predictions about when he's going to be major league ready.
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Post by pedroelgrande on Dec 17, 2012 14:09:04 GMT -5
This move doesn't impact Bogaerts at all. He's a Boras client so its better to keep him down in the farm as long as they can. If it was a 3 year deal or more then yes it would impact him but at a 1-year deal I don't see how it impacts him.
As for Iglesias I don't think it says anything earth chartering about him. It say what we know, that he's not ready, and it would have been erroneous to expose him like that at the big league level.
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Post by soxcentral on Dec 17, 2012 14:13:10 GMT -5
This move doesn't impact Bogaerts at all. He's a Boras client so its better to keep him down in the far as long as they can. If it was a 3 year deal or more then yes it would impact him but at a 1-year deal I don't see how it impacts him. As for Iglesias I don't think it says anything earth chartering about him. It say what we know, that he's not ready, and it would have been erroneous to expose him like that at the big league level. I don't think this necessarily says anything negative about Iglesias at all. It is simply smart depth to pick up a veteran on a 1 year deal with money we had available. It also speaks to the fact that both Iglesias and WMB did not play full seasons last year, and there should be more than enough AB's for all 3 if necessary. It is never a bad thing to force a rookie to earn their spot, and until this Iglesias really had no competition for the job at all.
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Post by brianthetaoist on Dec 17, 2012 18:53:45 GMT -5
This is a good signing, solid upside to it, and it fills a very important position because I don't think Iglesias is ready to face major league pitching every day.
Incidentally, this is another example of why I think young international FAs should shy away from doing major league contracts. It's likely that Iglesias would benefit from a slower development timetable to give him more time to develop his hitting ... but now he really doesn't have any more time, since next year is his last option year.
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Post by buffs4444 on Dec 17, 2012 22:05:08 GMT -5
Good move IMO. Iglesias is only 22 and OBP'ed .318 last year at AAA. He needs more AB's down on the farm. Really? Iglesias has got 700ABs in AAA. I'm hoping they have a deal for Jose lined up, he really looks like someone who needs to play in the majors every day right now. Sox move looks like a bridge to Xander, but maybe that's just me.
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Post by bjb406 on Dec 17, 2012 23:03:13 GMT -5
I think its kind of funny that some people still think Iglesias is a major league player. I don't care how good his defense is, a .600 OPS is not going to cut it, and based on what we have seen that seems like best-case-scenario to me. Unless we decide to make our pitchers hit and DH for our shortstop instead, he is not going to be more than a defensive replacement.
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Post by jmei on Dec 17, 2012 23:31:12 GMT -5
Omar Vizquel did not crack a .600 OPS until his fourth season in the major leagues but averaged 2 fWAR per 600 PAs in those first three seasons. Brendan Ryan has averaged a .633 OPS in his six MLB seasons but has averaged 2.7 fWAR per 600 PAs. The bar is set very, very low at SS, especially for a player with GG-quality defense.
Also, the SoxProspects scouting reports have consistently been bullish on Iglesias' offensive potential. He might never develop the plate discipline to reach his ceiling, but he has a compact swing and enough bat speed to hit for a much higher average that he showed in the majors last year. Give it time-- he's only 22.
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Post by bluechip on Dec 18, 2012 0:31:08 GMT -5
There really is no downside to this signing, in my opinion. If Iglesias shows improvement hitting during the season, great he can take over for Drew during the season or next season. If Iglesias struggles, well the team has a capable short stop in Drew for this season.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Dec 18, 2012 1:02:50 GMT -5
It's not a move that only a hedge fund manager could love, but it's certainly one that they could feel quite at home with. ... If Drew has a good year we submit a qualifying offer and collect a draft pick. ... We all need to get with the program, here. There's a real method and very little madness to these moves. The goal is to augment the existing strong core - and Ortiz, Pedroia, Middlebrooks, and (a healthy?) Ellsbury are just that - with guys who fill holes and who have, after all, had some success. You want, at the very least, to give that core a chance to compete. That's the long position. But by signing players to one, two, or three years - you also have the option of getting that draft choice for yourself or trading the player and the attached draft choice at the end of the season. The team your trading to has a very manageable contract and they have the option of hedging the player and the pick themselves. That's valuable to them and you should be able to reflect that in the trade negotiations. And if you really tank but the player is doing well, you can trade them in-season and take what you can get. That's the short position and it has options. For me this only reinforces my feeling that the 6+ year contracts are an even bigger mistake than they already were for players sliding out of their prime years. There's little chance that they'll have that added value on the backside of those contracts so you won't want to make them an offer for fear they'll take it. No offer no draft choice. Everyone who sees the MFY's posting ARod when his contract is through so that they can get a draft choice, raise your hands. I know that Lucchino is the ghost who haunts a lot of the posts on this board. But I see someone else's hand in this. When the new CBA was first announced, I wondered how teams like the Sox were willing to buy in. I think i'm starting to get a handle on that.
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Post by beasleyrockah on Dec 18, 2012 1:12:45 GMT -5
It's higher than I thought he'd get but not by much, and this is the offseason of not caring about $2m extra for the '13 payroll.
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Post by marrcus on Dec 18, 2012 1:17:29 GMT -5
For me this was the most predictable move of the OS. Even more than Napoli. I never thought they'd give IglesiasI the ss job. It's pretty likely Drew will be dealt if the record doesn't look so hot in July. I don't see this as a big impediment to Julio and we'll see what happens with his development. Hopefully Drew stays healthy and we see a decent OPS.
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steveofbradenton
Veteran
Watching Spring Training, the FCL, and the Florida State League
Posts: 1,823
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Post by steveofbradenton on Dec 18, 2012 8:21:24 GMT -5
I'm as big a supporter for Iglesias as anyone. Part of me wants Jose to play everyday. But, the Stephen Drew signing tells me they feel they have a good chance to compete this year....and not thinking of (just) 2014.
I hope that we get the Napoli situation done soon. I like what he brings to a line-up that really puts pressure on a pitching staff to throw strikes.
With that said, Drew extends the "congo" line nicely. I have no idea where he ends up batting in the line-up (probably bottom 3rd), but he will contribute quite well to driving up the pitch count. Last year, for many reasons, was miserable to watch. Watching folks like Crawford and Salty swing away was very frustrating. This in turn eventually hurt other players in our line-up as well. They didn't see the other team's bottom 3rd of their staff as frequently because of several player's poor approach.
When you go position by position with the other teams in the AL East, you will find little difference. Actually in several cases, I think we are superior. Yes the Jays look tough, but we should know better than to anoint them champs in December. The East is NOT unattainable. If the stinking Orioles can make that kind of leap, we can too. Which 25 roster would you take between the Sox and O's? I really like our club better!
Drew will help us get to that stinkin 10th or 11th pitcher of a team's staff a lot more. That in itself is going to improve our offensive consistency and ultimately our chances to be a play-off team. If we are reasonably healthy, I bet we are better than a 500 team.
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Post by borisman on Dec 18, 2012 10:19:36 GMT -5
Arizona owner on our new SS. www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/2012/12/18/red-sox-sign-the-other-drew-shortstop-stephen/4FaHNWQXrI0Zty8NJ4xLGL/story.htmlKendrick, in a radio interview in June, thought Drew should have returned much sooner. “You know, I’m going to be real direct about Stephen. I think Stephen should have been out there playing before now. And, frankly, I for one am disappointed. I’m going to be real candid and say I think Stephen and his representatives are more focused on where Stephen is going to be a year from now than going out and supporting the team that’s paying his salary. All you can do is hope that the player is treating the situation with integrity, and, frankly, we have our concerns,” Kendrick said. Ah yes, we know the story all too well.
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Post by elguapo on Dec 18, 2012 10:52:40 GMT -5
Really, the ideal situation is for a team that owns a player's rights to bury him in the minors for as long as possible, game his service time to delay free agency, use and abuse him while under team control, make him play through injuries, trash him in the media if he doesn't go along, and cast his broken husk onto the market.
Not all of that happened in Drew's case, of course, but I don't see the justice of elevating the self-interest of the owner over the self-interest of the player. And the evidence seems to suggest that Drew was far from 100% when he did come back.
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Post by iakovos11 on Dec 18, 2012 10:57:02 GMT -5
Boris - you have to give both sides. Immediately after the part you quoted -
"Agent Scott Boras responded by telling the Arizona Republic, “I think achieving the success that Mr. Kendrick has in his life that he would respect the commitment and focus and the effort of Stephen Drew, who has demonstrated that on the field when he went all out to score for his team from second base and badly injured his ankle at home.
“Consistent with that effort, it’s pretty clear that a person of that ilk like Stephen Drew would do everything he can by going all out to return.”
Boras didn’t care for the comment that Drew’s focus was on free agency.
“If you’re talking about what the best thing Stephen can do for himself, that’s to play baseball and play a lot of it,” Boras said. “I don’t think he wants anything different. That’s the best thing he can do for Stephen and for his team. Why would he not want to play? The guy’s going to be a free agent.”
Boras makes some good points, too. Frankly, the AZ owner just sounds bitter. Maybe he's right, but . . . . .
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Post by Matt Huegel on Dec 18, 2012 11:03:37 GMT -5
Arizona owner on our new SS. www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/2012/12/18/red-sox-sign-the-other-drew-shortstop-stephen/4FaHNWQXrI0Zty8NJ4xLGL/story.htmlKendrick, in a radio interview in June, thought Drew should have returned much sooner. “You know, I’m going to be real direct about Stephen. I think Stephen should have been out there playing before now. And, frankly, I for one am disappointed. I’m going to be real candid and say I think Stephen and his representatives are more focused on where Stephen is going to be a year from now than going out and supporting the team that’s paying his salary. All you can do is hope that the player is treating the situation with integrity, and, frankly, we have our concerns,” Kendrick said. Ah yes, we know the story all too well. This comment was refuted pretty hard by JD Drew in an article by John Tomase. And the stats back it up. bostonherald.com/sports/red_sox_mlb/clubhouse_insider/2012/12/jd_drew_brother_stephens_boston
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Post by honkbal on Dec 18, 2012 11:14:27 GMT -5
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Post by brianthetaoist on Dec 18, 2012 11:18:32 GMT -5
Yeah, total ******* move by that owner, especially considering the problems Drew has had since then. He had a gruesome injury ...
But, no worries, Boston fans never jump to conclusions and call players soft when they don't come back quickly enough from injury.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Dec 18, 2012 11:23:26 GMT -5
Boras is only pointlng out the obvious. Why would a player not want to get back on the field when his line is as crappy as Drew's was last year? Look at the contracts players are pulling down. You don't think Drew would like to have one of those in his pocket? Instead, he has to prove himself all over again, so he's going the Adrian Beltre route. Boras believes in him enough to have him do that. Say what you will about Scott Boras, he always has his clients' interests up front and he treats them like adults, more than you can say about the DB owner. In the great tradition of the Lords of the Realm, he likes to view his players through the prism of indentured servitude. AZ understandably wasn't willing to offer him the $13 million it would have taken to make teams think twice. They gambled and lost. Screw the sour grapes.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Dec 19, 2012 10:57:26 GMT -5
Really, the ideal situation is for a team that owns a player's rights to bury him in the minors for as long as possible, game his service time to delay free agency, use and abuse him while under team control, make him play through injuries, trash him in the media if he doesn't go along, and cast his broken husk onto the market. Not all of that happened in Drew's case, of course, but I don't see the justice of elevating the self-interest of the owner over the self-interest of the player. And the evidence seems to suggest that Drew was far from 100% when he did come back. Yeah, remind me, what where the 2012 Diamondbacks put together to do? Was that team put together to find a cure for AIDS or reduce global poverty? Or were they trying to win some baseball games in oder to bump up their season ticket sales and TV revenue so that the team can be more profitable for it's owner? The owner is basically saying that his self-interest is more important than Drew's self-interest. I fail to see why that's the case.
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