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Post by supersquid on Jul 29, 2016 19:29:37 GMT -5
That lineup would be fun to watch but panda will be DH next year and I'm hoping he comes back with a chip on his shoulder.Problem is , he'd eat that too.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 29, 2016 20:07:55 GMT -5
The Red Sox will have a big hole to replace once Ortiz retires. Those 30-35 home runs are not going to be found in house, which leads me to believe that the Sox will make almost certainly make a splash in free agency. Encarnacion is the name being tossed around a lot. Assuming it is Encarnacion, I see the lineup looking something like this at the start of the season:
RF Betts 2B Pedroia SS Bogaerts DH Encarnacion CF Bradley 1B Hanley 3B Shaw C Swihart/Vazquez LF Benintendi
Maybe Moncada forces his way in mid-season or early season if he tears it up in Spring Training.
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Post by texs31 on Jul 29, 2016 20:28:12 GMT -5
We should get the guy who hit 30 for KC last year. Or maybe one of the guys who hit 30 in the 3 Giants WS Championship years. They would come much cheaper.
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fenwayfaithful
Rookie
A prospect is fun to watch, but trading him for a sure thing in the Majors is never a losing deal.
Posts: 114
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Post by fenwayfaithful on Jul 30, 2016 3:41:27 GMT -5
That lineup would be fun to watch but panda will be DH next year and I'm hoping he comes back with a chip on his shoulder.Problem is , he'd eat that too. 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
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Post by cambos174 on Jul 30, 2016 6:58:59 GMT -5
I would be interested in giving Beltran a shot as Ortiz's replacement. Would presume he'd be cheaper and on a shorter contract than Encarnacion.
I think the sox most likely see where Panda is at in 3-4 months and gauge if they need to make a move or replace Ortiz within.
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Post by cto94 on Jul 30, 2016 10:14:25 GMT -5
I would be interested in giving Beltran a shot as Ortiz's replacement. Would presume he'd be cheaper and on a shorter contract than Encarnacion. I think the sox most likely see where Panda is at in 3-4 months and gauge if they need to make a move or replace Ortiz within. I'd be a little gun shy on Beltran, most of his power is to the pull side as a lefty and Yankee Stadium has probably gifted him a bunch of his homers this year that likely would've been outs in Fenway www.hittrackeronline.com/detail.php?id=2016_983&type=hitterMakes it look like he'd have lost at least a handful of those bombs if he were playing in Boston. I'd honestly much rather get Encarnacion if we can without an entirely unreasonable deal, he's always raked against the Sox, especially at Fenway
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Post by sarasoxer on Jul 30, 2016 11:25:35 GMT -5
I would be interested in giving Beltran a shot as Ortiz's replacement. Would presume he'd be cheaper and on a shorter contract than Encarnacion. I think the sox most likely see where Panda is at in 3-4 months and gauge if they need to make a move or replace Ortiz within. I'd be a little gun shy on Beltran, most of his power is to the pull side as a lefty and Yankee Stadium has probably gifted him a bunch of his homers this year that likely would've been outs in Fenway www.hittrackeronline.com/detail.php?id=2016_983&type=hitterMakes it look like he'd have lost at least a handful of those bombs if he were playing in Boston. I'd honestly much rather get Encarnacion if we can without an entirely unreasonable deal, he's always raked against the Sox, especially at Fenway I agree with you here. And speaking of Panda, have there been any sightings in the wild? Any reports on his progress?
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Post by barney27 on Jul 30, 2016 11:30:13 GMT -5
Guys the idea is to discuss devers and moncada not dh potential guys. devers is at least 2 years away probably 3. 269 in high A is not exactly tearing it up. BUT, not bad. What does he do when he gets to AA is the key. Moncada is in AA and striking out 40% of the time. Seems to me that he stays in AA this year and part of next. Moves up to AAA next year and see from there. Pedy blocks him at second. So he moves to 3rd or outfield. Big adjustment, so If all goes well end of next year he comes up. Great athlete but maybe not great fielder. Time will tell. Looks like beni is the closest. Do not trade any of the 3, unless you get something special. Definitely only one of them and you are looking at sales or trout type players. Maybe archer with the rays.
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Post by telson13 on Jul 30, 2016 12:09:57 GMT -5
That lineup would be fun to watch but panda will be DH next year and I'm hoping he comes back with a chip on his shoulder.Problem is , he'd eat that too. Mmmm...chips. Think-cut salt and vinegar, please.
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Post by barney27 on Jul 30, 2016 12:15:58 GMT -5
Problem is , he'd eat that too. Mmmm...chips. Think-cut salt and vinegar, please. I think unless panda makes a HUGE improvement in weight and work etic that come late winter early spring he gets moved some where and the sox eat a bunch of salary. He blocks potentially moncada, devers and travis. So he has to show he is worth the spot on the roster.
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Post by soxjim on Jul 30, 2016 12:19:04 GMT -5
Guys the idea is to discuss devers and moncada not dh potential guys. devers is at least 2 years away probably 3. 269 in high A is not exactly tearing it up. BUT, not bad. What does he do when he gets to AA is the key. Moncada is in AA and striking out 40% of the time. Seems to me that he stays in AA this year and part of next. Moves up to AAA next year and see from there. Pedy blocks him at second. So he moves to 3rd or outfield. Big adjustment, so If all goes well end of next year he comes up. Great athlete but maybe not great fielder. Time will tell. Looks like beni is the closest. Do not trade any of the 3, unless you get something special. Definitely only one of them and you are looking at sales or trout type players. Maybe archer with the rays. In the past I have read on here that early on many of Devers struggles were that he was hitting right at people. Lately he has been terrific. OFC he is just a prospect and could bust but I wouldn't use his .269 as a barometer either. It could very well be that his latest surge is what he is.
I wouldn't look to trade any either unless I'm getting something extremely special. And I wouldn't push hard for a DH because Hanley or early on if their bats way-far-ahead of their gloves - one of Moncada or Devers could fill that void too. So while the discsussion of others of DH such as EE is not directly relevant - indirectly it is. I would "pass" on the DH as long as I have questions regarding an early call-up of Devers and Moncada if their defense is weak but offense is strong.
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Post by barney27 on Jul 30, 2016 12:34:15 GMT -5
Guys the idea is to discuss devers and moncada not dh potential guys. devers is at least 2 years away probably 3. 269 in high A is not exactly tearing it up. BUT, not bad. What does he do when he gets to AA is the key. Moncada is in AA and striking out 40% of the time. Seems to me that he stays in AA this year and part of next. Moves up to AAA next year and see from there. Pedy blocks him at second. So he moves to 3rd or outfield. Big adjustment, so If all goes well end of next year he comes up. Great athlete but maybe not great fielder. Time will tell. Looks like beni is the closest. Do not trade any of the 3, unless you get something special. Definitely only one of them and you are looking at sales or trout type players. Maybe archer with the rays. In the past I have read on here that early on many of Devers struggles were that he was hitting right at people. Lately he has been terrific. OFC he is just a prospect and could bust but I wouldn't use his .269 as a barometer either. It could very well be that his latest surge is what he is.
I wouldn't look to trade any either unless I'm getting something extremely special. And I wouldn't push hard for a DH because Hanley or early on if their bats way-far-ahead of their gloves - one of Moncada or Devers could fill that void too. So while the discsussion of others of DH such as EE is not directly relevant - indirectly it is. I would "pass" on the DH as long as I have questions regarding an early call-up of Devers and Moncada if their defense is weak but offense is strong.
I agree with you. Do not trade any of them. Lets not rush them. AA is the break point as far as I can see. Big jump in pitching quality from A. Right now 40% strikeout rate for moncada shows he needs some work. Slow things down a little for him. Eastern league Portland is considered a pitcher's league. A high strikeout rate tells me he may be a little over matched at the moment. Lets see if he adjusts. devers lets see what he does when he gets to AA. It sounds like that AA will not be until next year.
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Post by barney27 on Jul 30, 2016 12:37:11 GMT -5
In the past I have read on here that early on many of Devers struggles were that he was hitting right at people. Lately he has been terrific. OFC he is just a prospect and could bust but I wouldn't use his .269 as a barometer either. It could very well be that his latest surge is what he is.
I wouldn't look to trade any either unless I'm getting something extremely special. And I wouldn't push hard for a DH because Hanley or early on if their bats way-far-ahead of their gloves - one of Moncada or Devers could fill that void too. So while the discsussion of others of DH such as EE is not directly relevant - indirectly it is. I would "pass" on the DH as long as I have questions regarding an early call-up of Devers and Moncada if their defense is weak but offense is strong.
I agree with you. Do not trade any of them. Lets not rush them. AA is the break point as far as I can see. Big jump in pitching quality from A. Right now 40% strikeout rate for moncada shows he needs some work. Slow things down a little for him. Eastern league Portland is considered a pitcher's league. A high strikeout rate tells me he may be a little over matched at the moment. Lets see if he adjusts. devers lets see what he does when he gets to AA. It sounds like that AA will not be until next year. No DH money either. The forecasted payroll for next year is already near 180. Between craig and Castillo they have 23 mil in dead money. If dd spends it needs to be on pitching not a DH.
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Post by soxjim on Jul 30, 2016 14:15:40 GMT -5
I agree with you. Do not trade any of them. Lets not rush them. AA is the break point as far as I can see. Big jump in pitching quality from A. Right now 40% strikeout rate for moncada shows he needs some work. Slow things down a little for him. Eastern league Portland is considered a pitcher's league. A high strikeout rate tells me he may be a little over matched at the moment. Lets see if he adjusts. devers lets see what he does when he gets to AA. It sounds like that AA will not be until next year. No DH money either. The forecasted payroll for next year is already near 180. Between craig and Castillo they have 23 mil in dead money. If dd spends it needs to be on pitching not a DH. Just wondering if salaries will rise next year because of a new cba?
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Post by sox fan in nc on Jul 30, 2016 14:47:26 GMT -5
There is literally no free-agent pitching available next year.
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Post by jimed14 on Jul 30, 2016 15:06:30 GMT -5
There is literally no free-agent pitching available next year. With Price, Porcello, Wright, Pomeranz and ERod, thankfully we don't need to waste money on the leftovers. And the word literally is literally not the word to use in that sentence.
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Post by telson13 on Jul 30, 2016 15:39:44 GMT -5
I agree with you. Do not trade any of them. Lets not rush them. AA is the break point as far as I can see. Big jump in pitching quality from A. Right now 40% strikeout rate for moncada shows he needs some work. Slow things down a little for him. Eastern league Portland is considered a pitcher's league. A high strikeout rate tells me he may be a little over matched at the moment. Lets see if he adjusts. devers lets see what he does when he gets to AA. It sounds like that AA will not be until next year. No DH money either. The forecasted payroll for next year is already near 180. Between craig and Castillo they have 23 mil in dead money. If dd spends it needs to be on pitching not a DH. How are you deriving that figure? Ortiz ($17m), Buchholz ($13m), and Koji (I forget but it's not insignificant) are all gone.
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TearsIn04
Veteran
Everybody knows Nelson de la Rosa, but who is Karim Garcia?
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Post by TearsIn04 on Jul 30, 2016 15:48:54 GMT -5
I'm in no hurry to get Beni or Moncada up before a couple hundred AAA ABs. First, we saw with JBJ what can happen when a player is rushed. And just as importantly, why start the FA clock before the player is productive? Don't get me going on how we're going to miss out on Xander's 2020 season because the RS kept him up for all of his 2014 (83 OPS-plus, .3 b-Ref WAR) season.
By keeping Beni and/or Moncada in the minors for the start of their rookie season, you stall off FA for a full season.
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Post by mredsox89 on Jul 30, 2016 16:29:47 GMT -5
No DH money either. The forecasted payroll for next year is already near 180. Between craig and Castillo they have 23 mil in dead money. If dd spends it needs to be on pitching not a DH. How are you deriving that figure? Ortiz ($17m), Buchholz ($13m), and Koji (I forget but it's not insignificant) are all gone. Sox are at $148 right now for next year, but Rusney/Craig don't count towards the tax if I'm not mistaken, so they have plenty of money to work with. Koji, Ziegler, Taz are FA's. Everyone else is ARB or a year away from arbitration. Not that there's even a pitcher worth it on the FA market, but would the Sox really go after a top end guy as a FA? Price/Porcello/Pomeranz/Wright/E-Rod would be the current starting 5 next season. Don't think they're moving any of those guys to the pen, so unless they trade one of them all I see them going after is depth in the rotation in the FA market. Now if they wanted to pull of a Sale type trade, gotta figure E-rod would be in that package
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jimoh
Veteran
Posts: 3,948
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Post by jimoh on Jul 30, 2016 16:31:58 GMT -5
How are you deriving that figure? Ortiz ($17m), Buchholz ($13m), and Koji (I forget but it's not insignificant) are all gone. Sox are at $148 right now for next year, but Rusney/Craig don't count towards the tax if I'm not mistaken, so they have plenty of money to work with. Koji, Ziegler, Taz are FA's. Everyone else is ARB or a year away from arbitration. Not that there's even a pitcher worth it on the FA market, but would the Sox really go after a top end guy as a FA? Price/Porcello/Pomeranz/Wright/E-Rod would be the current starting 5 next season. Don't think they're moving any of those guys to the pen, so unless they trade one of them all I see them going after is depth in the rotation in the FA market. Now if they wanted to pull of a Sale type trade, gotta figure E-rod would be in that package $148 is only for eight or so guys, right? Before six guys in the first or second year of arbitration, and a handful of pre-arg guys. docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hyYtQVBNP7yQFgBn0zwUyu07VaX79ZEYVXynrnUVwh8/pubhtml
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Post by barney27 on Jul 30, 2016 16:32:05 GMT -5
No DH money either. The forecasted payroll for next year is already near 180. Between craig and Castillo they have 23 mil in dead money. If dd spends it needs to be on pitching not a DH. How are you deriving that figure? Ortiz ($17m), Buchholz ($13m), and Koji (I forget but it's not insignificant) are all gone. On a site called mlb teams baseball encyclopedia. Forecasts salaries. Not gospel but close. 148 in guantees, options plus abitri, and dead money.
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Post by barney27 on Jul 30, 2016 16:36:24 GMT -5
Everyone is right with the 148. If the dead money does not count against cap that helps. But you have roughly 40 mil to sign 17 more players plus free agents. I do not think dd would spent 20 or half of the available money on a dh.
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Post by barney27 on Jul 30, 2016 16:37:54 GMT -5
You are looking at one probably two lefty relief.
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Post by jimed14 on Jul 30, 2016 16:41:39 GMT -5
The tax threshold is probably going way up this winter.
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Post by barney27 on Jul 30, 2016 17:39:04 GMT -5
The tax threshold is probably going way up this winter. Really that will help. Has anyone heard what the new number might be? It looks like Pablo and hanley would come off in line with when xb, mookie and jbj come up for contracts .beni, moncada and devers all come in about the same time at the low end. erod, drew p, wright, cb, and swihart can all fit in with the salary numbers as well. That is if they are all on the team 3 yrs from now.
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