SoxProspects News
|
|
|
|
Legal
Forum Ground Rules
The views expressed by the members of this Forum do not necessarily reflect the views of SoxProspects, LLC.
© 2003-2024 SoxProspects, LLC
|
|
|
|
|
Forum Home | Search | My Profile | Messages | Members | Help |
Welcome Guest. Please Login or Register.
2016 Non Red Sox playoff thread
|
Post by Don Caballero on Oct 19, 2016 12:31:35 GMT -5
I haven't met Maddon or Farrell, so I have no judgement of what they are like as people. I'm not in high school anymore. I'm happy that you are more mature than me, I like to sit and wonder which managers would win at a fist fight. And yes, Farrell would beat the living crap out of Maddon 10 times out of 10.
|
|
ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,911
|
Post by ericmvan on Oct 19, 2016 13:27:15 GMT -5
This whole postseason is like watching the Red Sox Graduates. on a related note, why didn't we go after Rich Hill a little bit harder last year? The Red Sox had Joe Kelly penciled in as a starter. Between Price, Buchholz, Porcello, Kelly, and E-Rod and depth options like Wright, Owens, Johnson, Elias, who needed to waste any money on Rich Hill? Too bad, who knows, but maybe that might have avoided the need for the Pomeranz deal, although with his injuries it's hard to say? I'd like to tell you that I balked at the premise that with Kelly around the need to guarantee Rich Hill a starting spot was a ridiculous notion, but I didn't. I'd like to have told you that Joe Kelly should not be a starter because he has it in him to be an overpowering reliever (except when Teixeira comes to the plate with a worthwhile celebration on the line), but I didn't. I spent the entire winter arguing as vehemently as possible that we should promise Hill a rotation spot, and I was Wright's biggest champion (calling him a sure #3) and also believed that Kelly had a solid chance to be a #3 as well. If you have a chance to sign a #1 / #2 guy for a fraction of what he's worth (especially since you have a relationship with him already, and he grew up here), and the only concern is his health and ability to give you a lot of innings, but signing him will make you seven deep in the rotation -- that's a no-brainer. It should have been the first thing they did in the off-season. It all depends on whether you thought what Hill showed in those four starts did mean he was a top of rotation starter, and I looked at that, and it very clearly did. And, yes, it would have negated the need for a Pomeranz trade, and probably allowed them to pull the plug on Bad Buchholz earlier than they did.
|
|
|
Post by pedroelgrande on Oct 19, 2016 17:25:42 GMT -5
Andrew Miller: Proven.
|
|
|
Post by DesignatedKyle on Oct 19, 2016 17:57:38 GMT -5
Tito! I love him so much.
|
|
|
Post by southcoastsox on Oct 19, 2016 18:15:37 GMT -5
If my options are Farrell or Maddon, I'm voting 3rd party.
|
|
|
Post by raindelay on Oct 19, 2016 19:09:02 GMT -5
Here's a good one and a little weird. The Dodgers haven't won the WS since 1988. The Cubs haven't won the WS since 1908. The Indians haven't won the WS since 1948, exactly 40 years in front of the Cubs and 40 years behind the Dodgers. Cool.
|
|
|
Post by Oregon Norm on Oct 19, 2016 19:30:44 GMT -5
The High Def TV is excellent for getting every nuance of Lackey's looks-could-kill reaction to not getting the calls at the plate.
|
|
|
Post by mattpicard on Oct 19, 2016 20:03:03 GMT -5
Mind boggling that plays like that don't get overturned. Are they really going to say that was "inconclusive"? If every viewer on TV can conclusively see what happened, how can't the umps in New York?
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Oct 19, 2016 21:47:43 GMT -5
Tito Francona has been one helluva manager. So impressive how he has handled that pitching staff. He knows when to use Miller and Allen. He knows when to get his starters out. He was able to mix and match so well and his teams dominated the "better" teams that they faced.
Hope management saw the managerial clinic that Francona put on. The Red Sox had a HOF manager in their midst and scapegoated him for 2011. I'm glad if the Red Sox had to lose it was to Cleveland and Tito (and Napoli).
Normally if a team knocks the Red Sox out of the playoffs I root for them to get flattened in the next round, but in this case I was really excited for the Indians and hope the Cubs join them (although I'd be cool with Dave Roberts and Vin Scully's team in the Series, too).
And yeah, the Sox should have done what it took to sign back Andrew Miller when they had a chance. Koji as a traditional closer and Miller as a fireman would have been amazingly innovative. Watching Miller reminds me of what it kind of used to look like when guys like Gossage or Fingers or Mike Marshall would come in during the 6th or 7th inning when the starter was in a jam.
The only difference is these guys aren't necessarily finishing up the game and you need a strong closer and a dominant guy who can go multiple innings to make this strategy work.
|
|
|
Post by Don Caballero on Oct 19, 2016 22:03:25 GMT -5
I hope one thing that we can all agree on is that Francona is the best manager in baseball. Smoke the NL Tito.
|
|
|
Post by p23w on Oct 20, 2016 7:53:38 GMT -5
Tito knows when to "release the Kracken".
|
|
|
Post by ray88h66 on Oct 20, 2016 19:43:54 GMT -5
Congrats to Tito and the Indians. Now get it done Cubs. Win or lose I'll take Lester for any big time game.
|
|
|
Post by Don Caballero on Oct 20, 2016 22:20:54 GMT -5
Jon Lester is not an ace.
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Oct 20, 2016 23:23:40 GMT -5
Jon Lester is not an ace. And he's over 30 and certainly not worth his contract!
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Oct 20, 2016 23:27:50 GMT -5
How ironic would it be if it winds up being Andrew Miller AND John Lester as ALCS and NLCS MVP? The two guys the Sox dealt away for ultimately good returns and had chances to re-sign back and came up short on both ends (and then they blew away the field for David Price - to be fair a pitcher I've always thought was fantastic.) They didn't go the extra mile for those two player and lost out on a reliable starting pitcher who's good for 200 plus quality innings per year and has an excellent post-season track record and a rare dominating relief pitcher who can be used at any point in the game in any situation. What lost opportunities they had in that 2014 offseason. It wasn't all bad. It took awhile but they dealt Cespedes, obtained for Lester, for Porcello and signed Hanley to play the wrong position. I won't get into Sandoval.
|
|
|
Post by Don Caballero on Oct 20, 2016 23:29:40 GMT -5
Holy nuts the Dodgers bullpen is atrocious. I knew it was bad, but this is ridiculous.
|
|
|
Post by redsox3in10 on Oct 20, 2016 23:33:22 GMT -5
If you're not excited for the Cubs right now, either you are either a Dodgers, Cards or Tribe fan, or you don't like baseball.
On top of that, Theo will be a absolute God among men if he brings a title home for the Cubbies after bringing one (two!) home for the Red Sox.
Just amazing.
|
|
|
Post by Don Caballero on Oct 21, 2016 0:11:14 GMT -5
If you have to root for someone in a Theo vs. Francona curse breaking World Series, who do you pick? I mean, it's gotta be Tito, right?
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Oct 21, 2016 0:42:03 GMT -5
If you have to root for someone in a Theo vs. Francona curse breaking World Series, who do you pick? I mean, it's gotta be Tito, right? No way. I hate Cleveland and the dumb drum that they march to victory with.
|
|
|
Post by jerrygarciaparra on Oct 21, 2016 2:28:43 GMT -5
I don't know who in the BC front office was the lead stategist on the Lester contract negotiations, but IMHO, it was one of the most egregious tactical mistakes I have seen in my time following the club. I don't totally trust Lester's response on the matter either, but whomever thought it was a good idea to lowball him, apparently never spent any time around the guy. He's a hardass, any way you slice it.
|
|
|
Post by oilcan73 on Oct 21, 2016 3:59:56 GMT -5
I don't know who in the BC front office was the lead stategist on the Lester contract negotiations, but IMHO, it was one of the most egregious tactical mistakes I have seen in my time following the club. I don't totally trust Lester's response on the matter either, but whomever thought it was a good idea to lowball him, apparently never spent any time around the guy. He's a hardass, any way you slice it. Could not agree more. It had to be Lucchino interfering as always and trying to low ball Lester for some stupid reason. The fact that Henry, who made it clear that he wanted Lester back, didn't have the manhood to tell Lucchino to step aside and finish the deal himself is sad. The same can be side for how Henry dealt with Theo. He should have told Lucchino years ago to stay out of the baseball operations and given Theo free reign like he appears to have in Chicago. Theo should be the Sox Pres. of Baseball Op's with Hoyer, Hazen or BC as the GM. Instead we are stuck with Dombrowski and I am scared as heck that he is going to trade the farm after falling short this year in the playoffs.
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Oct 21, 2016 7:10:02 GMT -5
If you have to root for someone in a Theo vs. Francona curse breaking World Series, who do you pick? I mean, it's gotta be Tito, right? In a scenario like that I root for a thrilling seven game series where I have no idea who will win until the last event (out/hit) happens. All this post-season has done has remind me how much I wished we had Theo, allowed to do what he does without inteference, as our GM and Tito as our manager. What a great job both have done for their current franchises. Tito will have another obstacle to maneuver, though. It's tough enough that he has no Brantley, no Gomes, no Salazar, no Carrasco, and probably no Bauer and that beyond Kluber has has only Tomlin, Merritt, and Clevenger to start, but now Tito has to deal with the "rust" factor. His team will not have played in a week while the Cubs or Dodgers (easy to root for Dave Roberts and Vin Scully's team, as well) will still be in rhythm marching toward the World Series. I'd have to think that strongly favors the NL team even if the games start in the AL. I remember how off the Rockies' hitter's timing was against the Red Sox in 2007. They had won 22 of 23 and they had a week off and it totally killed their momentum. One last note on the NLCS - has anybody noticed the starting 1b for the Cubs and Dodgers are both ex-Red Sox who were traded for each other (Rizzo and Gonzo)? And of course the AL champion 1b is former Red Sox Mike Napoli and Coco Crisp hit the homer that sunk the Red Sox season. Meanwhile, with David Ross behind the plate, the Cubs have won all three games Lester and John Lackey have started. And if the Cubs win, Lester has to be the NLCS MVP, right? So that would make it Andrew Miller as the ALCS MVP and Lester as the NL MVP. It's amazing how much this post-season has been about the ghosts of recent Red Sox past.
|
|
|
Post by sox fan in nc on Oct 21, 2016 9:10:56 GMT -5
If you have to root for someone in a Theo vs. Francona curse breaking World Series, who do you pick? I mean, it's gotta be Tito, right? I'm down with this. For some reason that I can't quantify, something inside me cannot let me root for Theo Epstein (or Maddon), It has been 68 years since Cleveland's last WS trophy. For Tito's sake, I hope HE brings them one now.
|
|
ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,911
|
Post by ericmvan on Oct 22, 2016 1:34:42 GMT -5
I don't know who in the BC front office was the lead stategist on the Lester contract negotiations, but IMHO, it was one of the most egregious tactical mistakes I have seen in my time following the club. I don't totally trust Lester's response on the matter either, but whomever thought it was a good idea to lowball him, apparently never spent any time around the guy. He's a hardass, any way you slice it. Could not agree more. It had to be Lucchino interfering as always and trying to low ball Lester for some stupid reason. The fact that Henry, who made it clear that he wanted Lester back, didn't have the manhood to tell Lucchino to step aside and finish the deal himself is sad. The same can be side for how Henry dealt with Theo. He should have told Lucchino years ago to stay out of the baseball operations and given Theo free reign like he appears to have in Chicago. Theo should be the Sox Pres. of Baseball Op's with Hoyer, Hazen or BC as the GM. Instead we are stuck with Dombrowski and I am scared as heck that he is going to trade the farm after falling short this year in the playoffs. For the umpteenth time, we have no idea that the "lowball" offer was in fact that, because we have never heard what the initial offer is in any contract negotiation. They are not made public, because initial offers are not rejected out of hand and then leaked to the press. Lester's side did not make a counter-offer, and instead leaked the Sox initial offer to the press. That means a) he didn''t ever want to sign here, and b) he wanted to make it look like the Sox had screwed up. Stop being such naive suckers, please.
|
|
ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,911
|
Post by ericmvan on Oct 22, 2016 2:25:22 GMT -5
If you have to root for someone in a Theo vs. Francona curse breaking World Series, who do you pick? I mean, it's gotta be Tito, right? Even though Theo was the guy who thought it would be a bad idea if Tito met me as he wanted (not that I knew that at the time), I have to go with the Cubs here. Tito has nothing to prove; what he's done in this post-season just proves his genius at handling pitchers. Really, he and Farrell being BFF is like Albert Einstein being BFF with Paris Hilton. So I have to go with the extra 40 years of agony. I have several friends who are diehard Cubs fan, one of whom (the sf writer Gene Wolfe) is 85.
|
|
|