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Post by sarasoxer on Feb 12, 2019 8:05:34 GMT -5
Lol. Speak of angels and hear the flutter of their wings. ....landing on little cat feet.
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Feb 12, 2019 12:23:43 GMT -5
Lol. Speak of angels and hear the flutter of their wings. ....landing on little cat feet. It sits, looking over the city and harbor on silent haunches and then moves on. I hope for much more clarity and performance over a longer period for Chavis.
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Post by ramireja on Mar 4, 2019 17:32:30 GMT -5
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Post by marrcus on Mar 4, 2019 22:22:30 GMT -5
I love it. And I hope that Pearce is the low end of Chavis's off' capabilities. What the high end is --I doubt it's 30 hr unless he goes for them as a priority-- IDK? We may find out...but the more likely course could be trade, for something the club will need, trying to defend AL/WS.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Mar 5, 2019 0:03:15 GMT -5
Interesting. Those averages show he was hardly impacted as he moved up last season. And the final take parallels Hatfield's: a position-tweener who gets his at bats moving around an infield that has at least a few questions. I'm eager to see what the field staffs at AAA and on the Sox can (or can't) impart in the way of defensive intelligence. The bat is likely good enough no matter where they stick him, but settling in at a position with some decent glove work would really change the profile. A word of caution. The writer points out that one of the possible outcomes is trade bait. We'll want to keep enthusiasm at a manageable level. The team has enough third base prospects to fill a pack of minor league bubble gum cards, so moving him isn't out of the question. But he's the only one whose near ready and he can move around, so injuries may very well determine if that comes to pass. Pedroia, Nunez, Holt, and even Bogaerts... all have had issues and a few still do. That bat is a very nice insurance policy, one that can deliver real dividends. May be a busy season for Chavis.
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Post by dmaineah on Apr 18, 2019 22:56:50 GMT -5
Chavis should be playing the Corner Outfield spots as well as 3B & 2B. The active roster needs another outfielder & someone who can hit.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Apr 19, 2019 9:48:46 GMT -5
Chavis should be playing the Corner Outfield spots as well as 3B & 2B. The active roster needs another outfielder & someone who can hit. Can we stop dinking around with top prospects? I get moving him to 2B. He's a terrible 3B and there's a vacancy at 2B. I don't want to screw him up and having him move all over the place. He's new to 2B, the Sox have a need at 2B. Let him get his reps at the position. If they can start winning games then they can look into corner OF, but really, they have JD and Pearce who can take reps away from JBJ (not the Pearce has been great). If they're going to move a guy around, I wouldn't mind seeing Josh Ockimey get some reps at LF since he's a fringe guy anyways, but has power and a good eye (10bb/10k in 36 AB at AAA).
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 19, 2019 10:10:09 GMT -5
I don't think Chavis is any worse than Devers currently is at 3B. Devers has a higher upside there, he can make some plays that have you dreaming about above average D in the future, but overall Devers has been well below average for a long-time now. There's this narrative that Devers is so much better at 3B than Chavis and I just don't think that's true. There both below average.
I don't really care about his D, as long as the guy can make most standard plays. His bat can really change the bottom of our lineup.
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Post by James Dunne on Apr 19, 2019 10:23:49 GMT -5
I don't think Chavis is any worse than Devers currently is at 3B. Devers has a higher upside there, he can make some plays that have you dreaming about above average D in the future, but overall Devers has been well below average for a long-time now. There's this narrative that Devers is so much better at 3B than Chavis and I just don't think that's true. There both below average. I don't really care about his D, as long as the guy can make most standard plays. His bat can really change the bottom of our lineup. This doesn't seem like a comment about how you think Chavis is as good--but that you think Devers isn't good and you can't see how Chavis can be worse. He is. I saw him two weeks ago. Routine play to his left, he double-clutched and threw the ball into the ground. His range is okay but his release is really not, and it's been a few years there now. He's not comfortable at the position and really doesn't have the skills for it, though his raw arm strength is pretty good. Just because "there(sic) both below average" doesn't mean that one isn't better than the other. It's not like everyone who is below average gets put into one category and it's the same value and it all comes out in the wash. Being 15 runs below average at third base is better than being 30 runs below average.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Apr 19, 2019 10:33:24 GMT -5
Chavis should be playing the Corner Outfield spots as well as 3B & 2B. The active roster needs another outfielder & someone who can hit. Can we stop dinking around with top prospects? I get moving him to 2B. He's a terrible 3B and there's a vacancy at 2B. I don't want to screw him up and having him move all over the place. He's new to 2B, the Sox have a need at 2B. Let him get his reps at the position. If they can start winning games then they can look into corner OF, but really, they have JD and Pearce who can take reps away from JBJ (not the Pearce has been great). If they're going to move a guy around, I wouldn't mind seeing Josh Ockimey get some reps at LF since he's a fringe guy anyways, but has power and a good eye (10bb/10k in 36 AB at AAA). Chavis has also only has 120 games in the high minors, spread across three seasons, and only 20 of those in AAA. I'm excited about his start too, but seriously, give him a minute here. I'm not a big believer in the idea that you alter or damage a player by calling him up too soon, I tend to think that whatever talent the player has will eventually express itself one way or another, but man, you couldn't be putting a guy in a worse spot than if you called Chavis up right now. Here kid, you've been playing this position for like three minutes and you're not a great defender to begin with, now save our season in front of 40,000 fans who don't read Sox Prospects and are ready to turn on you in an instant. You want another Blake Swihart situation? Because this is how you get another Blake Swihart situation. Just because "there(sic) both below average" doesn't mean that one isn't better than the other. It's not like everyone who is below average gets put into one category and it's the same value and it all comes out in the wash. Being 15 runs below average at third base is better than being 30 runs below average. That's grim, man.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 19, 2019 11:10:37 GMT -5
I don't think Chavis is any worse than Devers currently is at 3B. Devers has a higher upside there, he can make some plays that have you dreaming about above average D in the future, but overall Devers has been well below average for a long-time now. There's this narrative that Devers is so much better at 3B than Chavis and I just don't think that's true. There both below average. I don't really care about his D, as long as the guy can make most standard plays. His bat can really change the bottom of our lineup. This doesn't seem like a comment about how you think Chavis is as good--but that you think Devers isn't good and you can't see how Chavis can be worse. He is. I saw him two weeks ago. Routine play to his left, he double-clutched and threw the ball into the ground. His range is okay but his release is really not, and it's been a few years there now. He's not comfortable at the position and really doesn't have the skills for it, though his raw arm strength is pretty good. Just because "there(sic) both below average" doesn't mean that one isn't better than the other. It's not like everyone who is below average gets put into one category and it's the same value and it all comes out in the wash. Being 15 runs below average at third base is better than being 30 runs below average. Right now Devers is better, he has a lot more experience, like a ton more and he still makes a ton of stupid errors. Which everyone overlooks and makes comments like you just did. Man look at Chavis error, like Devers doesn't make so many crazy errors. Put Chavis in the majors at 3B, give him major league coaching and I think people will be surprised at the difference between the two players. I don't think he was moved off 3B because he's that bad. More like we have two young 3B guys and they want to find ways to get his bat into the lineup. By that bad I mean you can't play him at 3B, because let's me real Devers has been one of the worst defensive 3B since he hit the majors. I've seen nothing that says if Devers and Chavis both had the same experience, that Devers is twice as good defensively. Which was really my point, the numbers don't back that up given the crazy difference in experience and extra work Devers has had. Everyone looks at his good plays, that yes Chavis can't make, yet overlooks the fact he makes soooo many bad ones. Yet Everytime we talk about Chavis it's he can make bad plays, I know I get it. That isn't news to me. The difference has always been upside, yet Devers hasn't come close to reaching his upside. So yea I think they are a lot closer than you make it sound.
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Post by jimed14 on Apr 19, 2019 11:23:15 GMT -5
Devers has better than average range which makes up for some of the errors. Overall, he's slightly below average so far and only has to clean up mistakes to be quite good. There's no chance in hell that Chavis will ever approach Devers' defensive ability at 3B. He doesn't have the physical skill that is needed.
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Post by James Dunne on Apr 19, 2019 11:23:16 GMT -5
Michael Chavis is 14 months older than Devers and they began their professional careers, both as third basemen, a month apart. You seem to have this idea in your head that Devers has been playing the position for years with no improvement while Chavis is a neophyte, and that doesn't really add up. I am guessing this comes from the fact that you've watched Devers be bad at third base for two years now, whereas you've watched Chavis be bad at the position significantly less often. You're frustrated with Devers' defense, which I suppose is understandable, but you've kind of built up this fable about his experience at the position relative to Chavis's, and that Chavis has all this room to grow into the position while Devers has plateaued as bad.
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Post by jimed14 on Apr 19, 2019 11:25:13 GMT -5
The guy that Chavis replaces perfectly is Pearce.
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Post by grandsalami on Apr 19, 2019 11:31:55 GMT -5
Called up
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 19, 2019 11:39:42 GMT -5
Michael Chavis is 14 months older than Devers and they began their professional careers, both as third basemen, a month apart. You seem to have this idea in your head that Devers has been playing the position for years with no improvement while Chavis is a neophyte, and that doesn't really add up. I am guessing this comes from the fact that you've watched Devers be bad at third base for two years now, whereas you've watched Chavis be bad at the position significantly less often. You're frustrated with Devers' defense, which I suppose is understandable, but you've kind of built up this fable about his experience at the position relative to Chavis's, and that Chavis has all this room to grow into the position while Devers has plateaued as bad. Chavis has had a bunch of injuries, 80 game suspension, and has played a bunch of different positions now, trying to find a position so he can help the Red Sox. Hence a huge difference in experience. Has Chavis not improved at 3B? I never said Devers hasn't improved. Everyone has seen a lot more Devers. In a way I get one player looks the part a lot more than the other one, yet the results have never matched the ones a -30 and one is -15 type stuff either. Devers was never close to twice as good in the minors. Like I see Devers upside at 3B, yet I'm not sure he ever comes close to reaching it.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 19, 2019 11:43:08 GMT -5
Just like that my faith is restored. Could be the type of move that helps turn around our season! Then again I've always been higher on Chavis then most have for years now. Finally some major excitement to watch games again.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Apr 19, 2019 11:44:07 GMT -5
Michael Chavis is 14 months older than Devers and they began their professional careers, both as third basemen, a month apart. You seem to have this idea in your head that Devers has been playing the position for years with no improvement while Chavis is a neophyte, and that doesn't really add up. I am guessing this comes from the fact that you've watched Devers be bad at third base for two years now, whereas you've watched Chavis be bad at the position significantly less often. You're frustrated with Devers' defense, which I suppose is understandable, but you've kind of built up this fable about his experience at the position relative to Chavis's, and that Chavis has all this room to grow into the position while Devers has plateaued as bad. Chavis has had a bunch of injuries, 80 game suspension, and has played a bunch of different positions now, trying to find a position so he can help the Red Sox. Hence a huge difference in experience. Has Chavis not improved at 3B? I never said Devers hasn't improved. Everyone has seen a lot more Devers. In a way I get one player looks the part a lot more than the other one, yet the results have never matched the ones a -30 and one is -15 type stuff either. Devers was never close to twice as good in the minors. Like I see Devers upside at 3B, yet I'm not sure he ever comes close to reaching it. I mean, the fact they're moving him around shows their lack of faith in him at the position. If he was a stud defensively, he'd likely be pushing Devers to explore getting reps at 1B and DH. Excited for Chavis getting called up, but I hope they aren't just going to have him sit on the bench for 10 days and then send him down. If you're going to call him up, play him.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 19, 2019 12:00:06 GMT -5
Chavis has had a bunch of injuries, 80 game suspension, and has played a bunch of different positions now, trying to find a position so he can help the Red Sox. Hence a huge difference in experience. Has Chavis not improved at 3B? I never said Devers hasn't improved. Everyone has seen a lot more Devers. In a way I get one player looks the part a lot more than the other one, yet the results have never matched the ones a -30 and one is -15 type stuff either. Devers was never close to twice as good in the minors. Like I see Devers upside at 3B, yet I'm not sure he ever comes close to reaching it. I mean, the fact they're moving him around shows their lack of faith in him at the position. If he was a stud defensively, he'd likely be pushing Devers to explore getting reps at 1B and DH. Excited for Chavis getting called up, but I hope they aren't just going to have him sit on the bench for 10 days and then send him down. If you're going to call him up, play him. This narrative is getting way off course. I don't think he's a stud defensively. I don't disagree with him switching positions because they have Devers and Dalbec. It makes sense, both have much higher upsides. I just don't buy how bad some people think Chavis is and frankly how good some people think Devers is.
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Post by iakovos11 on Apr 19, 2019 12:50:01 GMT -5
Chavis should be playing the Corner Outfield spots as well as 3B & 2B. The active roster needs another outfielder & someone who can hit. Can we stop dinking around with top prospects? I get moving him to 2B. He's a terrible 3B and there's a vacancy at 2B. I don't want to screw him up and having him move all over the place. He's new to 2B, the Sox have a need at 2B. Let him get his reps at the position. If they can start winning games then they can look into corner OF, but really, they have JD and Pearce who can take reps away from JBJ (not the Pearce has been great). If they're going to move a guy around, I wouldn't mind seeing Josh Ockimey get some reps at LF since he's a fringe guy anyways, but has power and a good eye (10bb/10k in 36 AB at AAA). Uh, no. He's fringe defensive guy and can barely handle first base. He's not the type you start messing around with in LF. He just does not even have the basic athleticism needed to play LF. He's 1B/DH guy and either his bat carries him to the bigs or it doesn't. It's as simple as that. Glad Chavis is getting some looks in Boston. I'm curious how much time at 2B her gets. I'd rather Lin gets regular AB's there and Chavis at 1B (with maybe some time at 2B).
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Apr 19, 2019 16:36:41 GMT -5
Cora told the media that Chavis will be playing 1B and 3B.
In other words, this is a kick in the ass for Devers. I don't hate it.
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Post by iakovos11 on Apr 19, 2019 16:40:46 GMT -5
Cora told the media that Chavis will be playing 1B and 3B. In other words, this is a kick in the ass for Devers. I don't hate it. What I like (a lot) is Lin getting some regular AB's at 2nd, apparently
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 19, 2019 17:12:33 GMT -5
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Apr 19, 2019 17:14:02 GMT -5
OK, I hadn't realized this, but with Pedroia, Holt, Nunez, AND Renda all on the IL, Chavis and Lin were the last non-1b only infielders on the 40. Sounds like Chavis is only up until Holt is back. I mostly retract my prior comment.
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Post by Guidas on Apr 19, 2019 17:14:42 GMT -5
Devers has better than average range which makes up for some of the errors. Overall, he's slightly below average so far and only has to clean up mistakes to be quite good. There's no chance in hell that Chavis will ever approach Devers' defensive ability at 3B. He doesn't have the physical skill that is needed. Maybe on projection, but based on performance it may not be difficult for Chavis to meet or exceed Devers MLB numbers so far: www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=17350&position=3B
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