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Where are they now?: The former Sox thread
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Post by James Dunne on Aug 24, 2017 10:14:04 GMT -5
Anyone know what has happened with Pat Light? His K rate was down to 17.1% with Indianapolis. He was waived, picked up by the Mariners, and it's cratered even more at Tacoma to 9.6%. For reference, Edilson Batista has the lowest K rate in the Sox system of anyone with 20 or more innings, at 9.9%. Light's always been enigmatic, but I didn't think he would just stop striking guys out entirely.
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Post by Nick Rabasco2 on Sept 3, 2017 11:37:23 GMT -5
Will Middlebrooks batting 8th and playing first base for Texas today. First MLB game since 7/24/16
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ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,911
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Post by ericmvan on Sept 4, 2017 14:51:27 GMT -5
Jamie Calllahan debuted for the Mets on Saturday versus the Astros, entering in the bottom of the 7th down 3 runs. He have up hits to his first three batters, then should have gotten the next three (including Springer), but a throwing error led to another, unearned run, and his exit. He averaged 96.9 on his FB and 90.0 on his slider.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 6, 2017 12:16:40 GMT -5
So just for reference, Travis Shaw in the second half: .234/.315/.449, 9 HR.
Might be confirmation bias, but that sounds a lot more to me like the player he's likely to be going forward than the superstar he was in the first half. Maybe a little more average, but something like that (as it also kind of squares with his MLB numbers entering the year).
That is a useful player, for sure, but if Thornburg comes back next year and is the player the club thought it was acquiring, that trade would no longer look nearly as terrible if that's what Shaw is going forward, and we'll remember the first half of 2017 as the waiting period for Devers.
Now, that said, having Shaw to play FIRST base going forward wouldn't be awful...
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Post by Guidas on Sept 6, 2017 14:56:00 GMT -5
So just for reference, Travis Shaw in the second half: .234/.315/.449, 9 HR. Might be confirmation bias, but that sounds a lot more to me like the player he's likely to be going forward than the superstar he was in the first half. Maybe a little more average, but something like that (as it also kind of squares with his MLB numbers entering the year). That is a useful player, for sure, but if Thornburg comes back next year and is the player the club thought it was acquiring, that trade would no longer look nearly as terrible if that's what Shaw is going forward, and we'll remember the first half of 2017 as the waiting period for Devers. Now, that said, having Shaw to play FIRST base going forward wouldn't be awful... If Pablo had that line in the first half he'd still be on this team.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 6, 2017 15:28:26 GMT -5
So just for reference, Travis Shaw in the second half: .234/.315/.449, 9 HR. Might be confirmation bias, but that sounds a lot more to me like the player he's likely to be going forward than the superstar he was in the first half. Maybe a little more average, but something like that (as it also kind of squares with his MLB numbers entering the year). That is a useful player, for sure, but if Thornburg comes back next year and is the player the club thought it was acquiring, that trade would no longer look nearly as terrible if that's what Shaw is going forward, and we'll remember the first half of 2017 as the waiting period for Devers. Now, that said, having Shaw to play FIRST base going forward wouldn't be awful... If Pablo had that line in the first half he'd still be on this team. True. What's your point though? The team would arguably be in worse shape, as they'd have a better record potentially but have an inferior player at 3B going forward for this year. Like I said, that's a useful player. But my point was just that if Thornburg gets back to being, say, a 1.0-WAR reliever, you're probably ok with that deal, whereas a month and a half ago everyone thought it was the next Slocumb trade.
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Post by soxfando on Sept 6, 2017 16:08:18 GMT -5
in ten fewer games, Jose Iglesias now has one more double, 2 fewer home runs, 10 fewer errors and 1.3 more WAR than Xander. They've also got the same batting average and number of rbi's. Anyone see that coming?
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Post by Guidas on Sept 6, 2017 16:36:23 GMT -5
If Pablo had that line in the first half he'd still be on this team. True. What's your point though? The team would arguably be in worse shape, as they'd have a better record potentially but have an inferior player at 3B going forward for this year. Like I said, that's a useful player. But my point was just that if Thornburg gets back to being, say, a 1.0-WAR reliever, you're probably ok with that deal, whereas a month and a half ago everyone thought it was the next Slocumb trade. I agree the team would be in worse shape if Pablo stayed, but would've been better if they kept a guy with Shaw's flexibility just to post that line. You can always pick up a reliever for cash. MLB ave position players with his flexibility are more valuable and have the potential to contribute in more games. Translation - I hate trading guys off the 25 man roster for relievers, in general, and the flexible guys even more. Lowrie, Reddick, and Shaw come to mind immediately.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 6, 2017 16:47:03 GMT -5
in ten fewer games, Jose Iglesias now has one more double, 2 fewer home runs, 10 fewer errors and 1.3 more WAR than Xander. They've also got the same batting average and number of rbi's. Anyone see that coming? Well, Fangraphs has them equal at 2.2. And in both cases, Iglesias's value is tied pretty much entirely to his defense, so that's exactly as expected. He's become the best reasonable projection of him - among the game's elite defensive shortstops, does enough at the bat that you're comfortable hitting him 8th or 9th and he won't completely kill you. Arguably the most interesting thing to me was that Iglesias has 100 fewer PA's than Bogaerts, but has only played 10 fewer games. I'd assumed Iglesias was hurt again, but he's been healthy all year. Just the effect of where they hit in their respective orders.
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Post by jmei on Sept 6, 2017 17:03:43 GMT -5
So just for reference, Travis Shaw in the second half: .234/.315/.449, 9 HR. Might be confirmation bias, but that sounds a lot more to me like the player he's likely to be going forward than the superstar he was in the first half. Maybe a little more average, but something like that (as it also kind of squares with his MLB numbers entering the year). That is a useful player, for sure, but if Thornburg comes back next year and is the player the club thought it was acquiring, that trade would no longer look nearly as terrible if that's what Shaw is going forward, and we'll remember the first half of 2017 as the waiting period for Devers. Now, that said, having Shaw to play FIRST base going forward wouldn't be awful... To be fair, selectively looking at only half of Travis Shaw's season is how we got into this mess in the first place. Not sure it's fair to view the second half 2017 Travis Shaw as the "real" Travis Shaw and compare that guy to peak Thornburg. For what it's worth, Fangraphs depth charts (half ZiPS, half Steamer) projects Shaw to hit .256/.326/.471 and be a 2.0 WAR per 600 PA player going forward. Even if he comes back at full strength, tough to see Thornburg matching that production, and that's not to mention that (a) Shaw had/has more team control and (b) the Red Sox also included Mauricio Dubon (who hit .272/.320/.420 in 244 AAA PAs this year) and Josh Pennington (injured much of the year, but an 8.6 K/9, 2.4 BB/9 and 2.97 ERA/3.67 xFIP in 30.1 low-A innings) as part of that deal. Even with rose-colored glasses on, hard to see that deal as anything other than a disaster right now (with the caveat that there is still plenty of time for that to change).
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 6, 2017 17:12:53 GMT -5
So just for reference, Travis Shaw in the second half: .234/.315/.449, 9 HR. Might be confirmation bias, but that sounds a lot more to me like the player he's likely to be going forward than the superstar he was in the first half. Maybe a little more average, but something like that (as it also kind of squares with his MLB numbers entering the year). That is a useful player, for sure, but if Thornburg comes back next year and is the player the club thought it was acquiring, that trade would no longer look nearly as terrible if that's what Shaw is going forward, and we'll remember the first half of 2017 as the waiting period for Devers. Now, that said, having Shaw to play FIRST base going forward wouldn't be awful... To be fair, selectively looking at only half of Travis Shaw's season is how we got into this mess in the first place. Not sure it's fair to view the second half 2017 Travis Shaw as the "real" Travis Shaw and compare that guy to peak Thornburg. For what it's worth, Fangraphs depth charts (half ZiPS, half Steamer) projects Shaw to hit .256/.326/.471 and be a 2.0 WAR per 600 PA player going forward. Even if he comes back at full strength, tough to see Thornburg matching that production, and that's not to mention that (a) Shaw had/has more team control and (b) the Red Sox also included Mauricio Dubon (who hit .272/.320/.420 in 244 AAA PAs this year) and Josh Pennington (injured much of the year, but an 8.6 K/9, 2.4 BB/9 and 2.97 ERA/3.67 xFIP in 30.1 low-A innings) as part of that deal. Even with rose-colored glasses on, hard to see that deal as anything other than a disaster right now (with the caveat that there is still plenty of time for that to change). Well, to be fair, I said that the deal "would no longer look nearly as terrible," not that it'd be a win for the Red Sox or anything. I think you're arguing against a point I didn't make here. The idea that he settles in as a Role 5 guy sounds right to me. Really, we just hadn't heard anything on Shaw in a while since Devers came up, so I was curious how he was doing. At the very least, he's come back down to earth from the stud he was in the first half. (And yes, part of the curiosity is that I was duped into trading for Shaw in my fantasy league as part of a last-ditch effort to acquire some power...... damn you, Cundall.....)
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Post by soxfando on Sept 6, 2017 19:03:49 GMT -5
in ten fewer games, Jose Iglesias now has one more double, 2 fewer home runs, 10 fewer errors and 1.3 more WAR than Xander. They've also got the same batting average and number of rbi's. Anyone see that coming? Well, Fangraphs has them equal at 2.2. And in both cases, Iglesias's value is tied pretty much entirely to his defense, so that's exactly as expected. He's become the best reasonable projection of him - among the game's elite defensive shortstops, does enough at the bat that you're comfortable hitting him 8th or 9th and he won't completely kill you. Arguably the most interesting thing to me was that Iglesias has 100 fewer PA's than Bogaerts, but has only played 10 fewer games. I'd assumed Iglesias was hurt again, but he's been healthy all year. Just the effect of where they hit in their respective orders. yeah, i get it. flashy defense is just fun to watch though
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Post by jimed14 on Sept 6, 2017 19:13:15 GMT -5
If Iglesias and Bogaerts swapped their health this year, I'd estimate that Bogaerts would have 5 more WAR than Iglesias.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 7, 2017 10:46:02 GMT -5
Well, Fangraphs has them equal at 2.2. And in both cases, Iglesias's value is tied pretty much entirely to his defense, so that's exactly as expected. He's become the best reasonable projection of him - among the game's elite defensive shortstops, does enough at the bat that you're comfortable hitting him 8th or 9th and he won't completely kill you. Arguably the most interesting thing to me was that Iglesias has 100 fewer PA's than Bogaerts, but has only played 10 fewer games. I'd assumed Iglesias was hurt again, but he's been healthy all year. Just the effect of where they hit in their respective orders. yeah, i get it. flashy defense is just fun to watch though Iglesias' defense was fun to watch. I still remember him rehabbing in Lowell and essentially screwing around on defense (not in a bad way if you catch my drift - maybe there's better phrasing I could use) because the level was just way too easy for him on that side of the ball. The hands were just unbelievably fast, the ball would come in and be coming back out in a way that was tough to comprehend.
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Post by jimed14 on Sept 7, 2017 12:01:13 GMT -5
yeah, i get it. flashy defense is just fun to watch though Iglesias' defense was fun to watch. I still remember him rehabbing in Lowell and essentially screwing around on defense (not in a bad way if you catch my drift - maybe there's better phrasing I could use) because the level was just way too easy for him on that side of the ball. The hands were just unbelievably fast, the ball would come in and be coming back out in a way that was tough to comprehend. He has a little Ozzie Smith in him.
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Post by widewordofsport on Sept 7, 2017 12:33:35 GMT -5
So just for reference, Travis Shaw in the second half: .234/.315/.449, 9 HR. Might be confirmation bias, but that sounds a lot more to me like the player he's likely to be going forward than the superstar he was in the first half. Maybe a little more average, but something like that (as it also kind of squares with his MLB numbers entering the year). That is a useful player, for sure, but if Thornburg comes back next year and is the player the club thought it was acquiring, that trade would no longer look nearly as terrible if that's what Shaw is going forward, and we'll remember the first half of 2017 as the waiting period for Devers. Now, that said, having Shaw to play FIRST base going forward wouldn't be awful... I don't think Travis Shaw is going to be the player he was in the first half going forward.... BUT he did have a pretty stressful life event in June that may have affected him (depending if you believe outside events even really affect performance, I won't get into that). Apparently they knew (?) about it before she was born, but his daughter was born with hypoplastic left heart in June, and will need 3+ pretty high risk surgeries in the first few years of life, as well as almost a crappy long-term prognosis without a heart transplant... She will have the second surgery around November/December, and so he may be in a better place come next Spring.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 7, 2017 14:18:33 GMT -5
Didn't know all that, and it's definitely relevant.
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Post by widewordofsport on Sept 14, 2017 8:37:38 GMT -5
Not sure what's been reported on these guys, but I was bored, so...
Chih Hsien Chiang continue to tear up the four team (!) CPBL - .402/0.455/0.738 last year, .335/.379/.590 this year. He had played a while with Che Hsuan Lin who now with Fubon is hitting 0.296/0.375/0.405 (3 HR this year down from 22 last year). The CPBL is weird.
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Post by James Dunne on Sept 14, 2017 14:30:13 GMT -5
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 14, 2017 14:37:10 GMT -5
His agent is named Burton Rocks. That's almost as good as Bean Stringfellow in terms of agent names.
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Post by widewordofsport on Sept 15, 2017 7:13:08 GMT -5
1.04 WHIP and 226 K in 227 IP at AA over two years, and similar to Nava, in now 28 so if he becomes useful, he's super cheap through/past his prime as a pitcher. What a great deal for MIL. As playoff contenders, the Red Sox just can't let those guys develop either because they need the 40 man space for contributors/backups now, or can't give them a shot at MLB level because they're in a playoff race. (MIL actually 2.5 out of second WC).
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Post by natesp4 on Sept 15, 2017 17:45:48 GMT -5
Update on a couple of guys who I liked following while they were in the system:
The Sad News:
Jose Vinicio, CWS, AA/AAA (23): .231/.254/.329
Luis Alejandro Basabe, ARI, A (20): .229/.318/.337
Jason Garcia, BAL, AA (24): 75.1 IP 5.26 ERA 40 BB 74 K
Sean Coyle, BAL, AA (25): .187/.273/.306
The Happy News:
Jeremy Hazelbaker, ARI, AAA/MLB (29): .280/.344/.492 (193 AB) and .318/.412/.477 (44 AB)
Josh Reddick, HOU, MLB (30): .313/.359/.482 13HR 4.1 bWAR
And lastly the obligatory check for how many of this year's A's used to be Red Sox's: A measly 5 (Down from 6 in 2016 and 2015 and 7 in 2014. The last time it was under 5 was 2011 in a year that ironically had 8 players who would later go to the Red Sox.)
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 15, 2017 22:52:54 GMT -5
And lastly the obligatory check for how many of this year's A's used to be Red Sox's: A measly 5 (Down from 6 in 2016 and 2015 and 7 in 2014. The last time it was under 5 was 2011 in a year that ironically had 8 players who would later go to the Red Sox.) Who've played for them this year? I count 6: Lowrie, Alcantara, Chris Smith on the current roster, plus Ryan LaMarre, Montas, Lavarnway.
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Post by natesp4 on Sept 16, 2017 9:03:49 GMT -5
And lastly the obligatory check for how many of this year's A's used to be Red Sox's: A measly 5 (Down from 6 in 2016 and 2015 and 7 in 2014. The last time it was under 5 was 2011 in a year that ironically had 8 players who would later go to the Red Sox.) Who've played for them this year? I count 6: Lowrie, Alcantara, Chris Smith on the current roster, plus Ryan LaMarre, Montas, Lavarnway. I missed Chris Smith and I'm not even going to pretend it was just a goof. I had no idea he even existed. That also bumps 2016 up to 7.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 16, 2017 15:21:09 GMT -5
Considering that he was last in the Red Sox system in 2008, we'll give you a pass.
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