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Post by philsbosoxfan on Dec 16, 2018 0:05:44 GMT -5
What does it really matter? It was a few million and our draft pick went back 10 spots. The extra depth was well worth it. An extra half million or 1 million in international signings for amateur players too. I think you are dreaming. If a team is in contention, they are unlikely to trade for a player who they 'hope' would return to form. If a team is not in contention, they aren't going to spend money.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Dec 16, 2018 0:11:56 GMT -5
An extra half million or 1 million in international signings for amateur players too. I think you are dreaming. If a team is in contention, they are unlikely to trade for a player who they 'hope' would return to form. If a team is not in contention, they aren't going to spend money. I think a team would've gambled, the Sox did. I'll probably just agree to disagree past this point.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Dec 16, 2018 0:25:04 GMT -5
What does it really matter? It was a few million and our draft pick went back 10 spots. The extra depth was wello worth it. An extra half million or 1 million in international signings for amateur players too. That isn't correct. You only lose international spending money for signing QO free agents. It's the extra tax and draft pick goes back 10 spots.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Dec 16, 2018 0:37:06 GMT -5
An extra half million or 1 million in international signings for amateur players too. That isn't correct. You only lose international spending money for signing QO free agents. It's the extra tax and draft pick goes back 10 spots. You're right, that is only for free agents.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Dec 16, 2018 8:16:34 GMT -5
forum.soxprospects.com/thread/4611/gameday-thread-little-pomeranz-chavis?page=1Made a post about Pomeranz getting traded in July that would have given the Sox the room to get under. Would've saved 4 million. I got blasted for it like usual. It's kind of eye rolling that the difference between getting under was dfaing or trading Pomeranz's salary. The Sox don't always make the best decisions for their future. Pomeranz had nothing at that point in 2018. Either team morale or whatever prevented them from trading Pomeranz. You made this point after a rehab start, Pomeranz's first after being on the DL for a month, in which he gave up 4 HR in 2.2 IP. What on earth makes you think someone wanted Pomeranz? Later in the thread, you admitted that you had no idea what Pomeranz would even be the rest of the year. What're the odds the Red Sox would've been able to unload him without paying some of his salary? Slim, IMO. They also would've gotten under if they'd gotten someone to take all but $3M of Hanley's salary. Doesn't mean that is a reasonable expectation. Harvey was on a 1/5.626M deal, and the only reason the Mets were able to trade him is because the Reds were also trying to unload Mesoraco. The Reds paid the difference in their salaries because Mesoraco made $13M last year, which means the Mets wound up paying Harvey's full salary despite trading him, so he's an awful example that proves the point of those you're arguing with. Later in the thread, you suggested acquiring bullpen arms who would've eaten up any of the salary relief you suggested they free up by dealing Pomeranz and put them over the $237M mark. As James pointed out in that thread, you'd made a similar argument about selling high on Porcello all offseason and he was a crucial part of this year's team, and you also make this argument a lot generally - particularly with bullpen arms (see, e.g., your rotating bullpen avatar). A broken clock is right twice a day. If you suggest at some point that the Red Sox should try and trade every player on the roster, there's likely to be some truth at some point to one of the suggestions. Doesn't mean you deserve credit for that one suggestion. So, yes, you are correct that if they had dealt Drew Pomeranz midseason to a team that would've taken on his salary (unreasonable expectation), that would've gotten them under the $237M threshold - assuming they also wouldn't have used the salary relief to acquire a bullpen arm, which was the entire point of your suggestion. It's pretty disingenuous to isolate that from the myriad other roster moves you suggest they make. If you post hundreds of times a month, you're eventually going to say something that's kind of true. That doesn't mean you were reasonable to say it at the time or that it means you should've been lauded for your wonderful idea at the time.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Dec 18, 2018 19:11:56 GMT -5
forum.soxprospects.com/thread/4611/gameday-thread-little-pomeranz-chavis?page=1Made a post about Pomeranz getting traded in July that would have given the Sox the room to get under. Would've saved 4 million. I got blasted for it like usual. It's kind of eye rolling that the difference between getting under was dfaing or trading Pomeranz's salary. The Sox don't always make the best decisions for their future. Pomeranz had nothing at that point in 2018. Either team morale or whatever prevented them from trading Pomeranz. You made this point after a rehab start, Pomeranz's first after being on the DL for a month, in which he gave up 4 HR in 2.2 IP. What on earth makes you think someone wanted Pomeranz? Later in the thread, you admitted that you had no idea what Pomeranz would even be the rest of the year. What're the odds the Red Sox would've been able to unload him without paying some of his salary? Slim, IMO. They also would've gotten under if they'd gotten someone to take all but $3M of Hanley's salary. Doesn't mean that is a reasonable expectation. Harvey was on a 1/5.626M deal, and the only reason the Mets were able to trade him is because the Reds were also trying to unload Mesoraco. The Reds paid the difference in their salaries because Mesoraco made $13M last year, which means the Mets wound up paying Harvey's full salary despite trading him, so he's an awful example that proves the point of those you're arguing with. Later in the thread, you suggested acquiring bullpen arms who would've eaten up any of the salary relief you suggested they free up by dealing Pomeranz and put them over the $237M mark. As James pointed out in that thread, you'd made a similar argument about selling high on Porcello all offseason and he was a crucial part of this year's team, and you also make this argument a lot generally - particularly with bullpen arms (see, e.g., your rotating bullpen avatar). A broken clock is right twice a day. If you suggest at some point that the Red Sox should try and trade every player on the roster, there's likely to be some truth at some point to one of the suggestions. Doesn't mean you deserve credit for that one suggestion. So, yes, you are correct that if they had dealt Drew Pomeranz midseason to a team that would've taken on his salary (unreasonable expectation), that would've gotten them under the $237M threshold - assuming they also wouldn't have used the salary relief to acquire a bullpen arm, which was the entire point of your suggestion. It's pretty disingenuous to isolate that from the myriad other roster moves you suggest they make. If you post hundreds of times a month, you're eventually going to say something that's kind of true. That doesn't mean you were reasonable to say it at the time or that it means you should've been lauded for your wonderful idea at the time. -Wasn't looking to be lauded. Just thought I had a good point at the time. It's fine to disagree and think Pomeranz doesn't get claimed. -I add relievers normally on my avatar to be different than everyone elses. How many Mookie Betts avatars can one forum have? -I did want to add room for a reliever at the time, but didn't know the Sox were willing to add a reliever at the time regardless (the almost trade of Kelvim Herrera at the deadline). The almost Colton Brewer trade too. It would have been nice to get under even if you couldn't get the reliever the Sox ultimately wanted. -The whole point I wanted to trade Porcello ever is because of financial flexibility. His innings were valuable, but the Sox were most likely winning the world series with or without him last year. Just would need to fill the innings with another arm outside of the organization.
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Post by Guidas on Dec 18, 2018 19:28:51 GMT -5
Askance of nothing, Tony Clark should've been fired by the players for his part in the last CBA. Started off by giving away the farm and went from there. Now there's a lot of bitterness because the billionaire owners took advantage of the myopic player negotiators. Now the players have a lot of ground to get back and while they try to get leverage back in free agency and firm control of their diagnostic wearables data, things like a DH in both leagues, an automated strike zone and perhaps even a better playoff system will likely be left by the wayside. Again. I hope this doesn't lead to another strike or lock-out in a couple years.
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