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Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 25, 2021 17:49:49 GMT -5
For 8 million he’s an expensive backup as a worst case. If anyone was going to give you a real prospect for him, I’d move him, but there’s no way that’s happening.
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Post by bosoxnation on Aug 25, 2021 18:01:15 GMT -5
100% Extend Him. Options are slim and we’re in no position to have Wong come up and hit .200-.215. Our division is loaded so we need to keep him.Him and E-arod aren’t having the stellar year I predicted so they will be affordable.
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Post by voiceofreason on Aug 25, 2021 19:27:38 GMT -5
As bad as everyone perceives CVs season to be his BA is better than both Kikés and Hunters and the vast majority of all catchers in MLB. His defense and game calling is above average. As fans sometimes it is easy to overlook guys who seem to be one thing in a vacuum but in all actuality they are better than league average by quite a bit. He is definitely worth the price of his contract and will be for the short term of a reasonable contract. The Sox are lucky to have a guy like that who wants to play here and be a valuable piece to the team.
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Aug 25, 2021 20:01:37 GMT -5
Not sure his defense is above average anymore and I don’t really care about a hollow .250. I’d rather have Zunino and his .190 with pop and glove
It’s also disturbing how far his heads been up his butt lately. Effort problems and mental errors
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radiohix
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'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
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Post by radiohix on Aug 25, 2021 22:27:17 GMT -5
I agree that they should/will pick it up, but it is close in terms of $$. He is at .5 fWAR right now, and given how grueling a season he’s had, I’m not confident he’s going to add that much to that. He’s at .9 bWAR. So call him a 1.5 WAR guy — who will be a 31-year old catcher. That could be a tight squeeze if you expect 1 WAR for $8 million (that’s the going rate, right)? But… reservations aside, it is worth that risk. ZiPS projects .266/.315/.419 and 2.0 WAR next year and Steamer projects .255/.309/.411 and 2.6 WAR next year. Remember, Vazquez is coming off two excellent seasons in 2019-2020 (.278/.327/.472 slash, combined 4.9 fWAR in 710 PAs (prorates out to 3.1 WAR per 450 PAs)), so the projections give him a big bump despite the poor season so far. That's still pretty much a slam dunk, even if you weigh 2021 a bit more heavily than those systems do. How much of that power (.194 IsoP) is a product of the juiced ball?
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Post by soxfaninnj on Aug 25, 2021 23:29:05 GMT -5
After numerous bone headed base running plays this year and watching him swing at a clear ball 4 and make an out on a weakly hit ball dozens of time and especially after that extremely dumb AB tonight i would trade him for anything i can get.
Zunino is someone who would be a nice upgrade and i dont think he would be super expensive. Buster posey is a free agent but prob a pipe dream. Even a plaweki/wong platoon would be ok.
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manfred
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Post by manfred on Aug 25, 2021 23:32:33 GMT -5
After numerous bone headed base running plays this year and watching him swing at a clear ball 4 and make an out on a weakly hit ball dozens of time and especially after that extremely dumb AB tonight i would trade him for anything i can get. Zunino is someone who would be a nice upgrade and i dont think he would be super expensive. Buster posey is a free agent but prob a pipe dream. Even a plaweki/wong platoon would be ok. Not that Posey is even possible, but the last thing I want is to spend *more* than the $8 mill they could give CVaz on a different catcher.
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Post by soxfaninnj on Aug 26, 2021 0:04:03 GMT -5
The rays hold an option on Zunino which becomes 7m with 15 more games played. Thats prob too rich for the rays especially if you consider Mejia is ready to take over. I think u can get him for something like 2/20ish at that price I rather have zunino and whatever prospect package you get for vazquez than vazquez for 7 million
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Post by incandenza on Aug 26, 2021 0:20:55 GMT -5
As bad as everyone perceives CVs season to be his BA is better than both Kikés and Hunters and the vast majority of all catchers in MLB. His defense and game calling is above average. As fans sometimes it is easy to overlook guys who seem to be one thing in a vacuum but in all actuality they are better than league average by quite a bit. He is definitely worth the price of his contract and will be for the short term of a reasonable contract. The Sox are lucky to have a guy like that who wants to play here and be a valuable piece to the team. $8 million is reasonable, and I like Vazquez okay, but he's ranked 37th among major league catchers in fWAR. That is, notably, more guys ahead of him than there are teams.
I'm skeptical of WAR for catchers, but he's also 28th out of 36 among catchers with 200+ PAs in wRC+. I would say he's below average this season.
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Post by juanpena on Aug 26, 2021 13:51:44 GMT -5
Vazquez is really hurting his case with me. On his bunt on Monday -- a very good bunt, I give him credit for that -- he was jogging so slowly to first, where if the second baseman had been able to pick up the throw after dropping it, he would have been out. And not know how many outs there were last night is inexcusable especially just after a players meeting where the message was to play smarter.
He also looks heavier and less athletic to me this year.
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Post by henry on Aug 26, 2021 15:39:05 GMT -5
The rays hold an option on Zunino which becomes 7m with 15 more games played. Thats prob too rich for the rays especially if you consider Mejia is ready to take over. I think u can get him for something like 2/20ish at that price I rather have zunino and whatever prospect package you get for vazquez than vazquez for 7 million I would think at the very least the Rays will pick up the option and trade him for a lottery ticket prospect. 1/7 is certainly a positive value contract, so not sure why they would leave positive value on the table, even if it means trade.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 29, 2021 15:42:24 GMT -5
As bad as everyone perceives CVs season to be his BA is better than both Kikés and Hunters and the vast majority of all catchers in MLB. His defense and game calling is above average. As fans sometimes it is easy to overlook guys who seem to be one thing in a vacuum but in all actuality they are better than league average by quite a bit. He is definitely worth the price of his contract and will be for the short term of a reasonable contract. The Sox are lucky to have a guy like that who wants to play here and be a valuable piece to the team. $8 million is reasonable, and I like Vazquez okay, but he's ranked 37th among major league catchers in fWAR. That is, notably, more guys ahead of him than there are teams.
I'm skeptical of WAR for catchers, but he's also 28th out of 36 among catchers with 200+ PAs in wRC+. I would say he's below average this season.
Yeah, WAR for catchers is crap. I don't have a BP sub anymore, but I like their catcher stats which includes framing.
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