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Post by jmei on Nov 15, 2014 23:15:48 GMT -5
Yes-- thanks for parsing.
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 16, 2014 8:56:39 GMT -5
I'm not sure we should shoot down ideas just because things haven't been a certain way often in the past. The landscape is changing in baseball so anything is possible. It's not as if it's an outlandish idea.
Last year things were a lot different. Last place teams weren't getting prospects they were getting major leaguers and contenders were trading key veteran pieces off of its MLB team during a pennant race for help somewhere else...
The Braves seem like the sort of team that would make a lateral like change with a Heyward for Cespedes deal in order to get other pieces they want.
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Post by wcsoxfan on Nov 16, 2014 11:46:41 GMT -5
I'm not sure we should shoot down ideas just because things haven't been a certain way often in the past. The landscape is changing in baseball so anything is possible. It's not as if it's an outlandish idea. Last year things were a lot different. Last place teams weren't getting prospects they were getting major leaguers and contenders were trading key veteran pieces off of its MLB team during a pennant race for help somewhere else... The Braves seem like the sort of team that would make a lateral like change with a Heyward for Cespedes deal in order to get other pieces they want. If the Braves were to even consider something like this, they would: A. need to really like Cespedes B. need to get a piece that 'they want' as you mentioned (and it has to be so good it offsets losing the draftpick attached to Heyward) I have no idea about part 'A' but I can't imagine any of the names being mentioned fitting the bill for part B. In this scenario the player the player in part 'B' would be the main piece and Cespedes would be the secondary piece.
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 16, 2014 12:18:43 GMT -5
I wasn't defending the players in the proposal simply disputing that it's not out of the realm of possibilities that veterans at similar positions be moved for one another.
After looking a little at the two players situations, the real issues with a Cespedes for Heyward deal that I see are:
1. Heyward is cheaper 2. Heyward can be offered a QO 3. Heyward is better all around
In order for the Sox to overcome all those areas, it would cost them a lot and you'd be using resources to upgrade something that's not a weakness on a team that's full of weaknesses. They'd also be recreating the power void they got Cespedes to fill, as Heyward isn't much of a power hitter.
There is very little reason for the Red Sox to make a trade for Heyward.
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Nov 17, 2014 12:17:21 GMT -5
Welp, Cards got him. I had a feeling they would go hard for him
Buster Olney ?@buster_ESPN 4m4 minutes ago Jason Heyward and Jordan Walden for Shelby Miller and Tyrell Jenkins. A really nice trade for both teams.
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Post by sibbysisti on Nov 17, 2014 12:28:44 GMT -5
Welp, Cards got him. I had a feeling they would go hard for him Buster Olney ?@buster_ESPN 4m4 minutes ago Jason Heyward and Jordan Walden for Shelby Miller and Tyrell Jenkins. A really nice trade for both teams. Let's go get him next year! Have to give up a draft pick, but worth it if the Cards don't extend him.
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Post by jmei on Nov 17, 2014 14:11:55 GMT -5
The Cardinals don't make this trade unless they think they have a good chance of re-signing Heyward. Maybe they're wrong, but I wouldn't count on Heyward reaching free agency.
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 11,501
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Post by nomar on Nov 17, 2014 19:21:02 GMT -5
Even if he does leave, which I doubt, the loss of Jenkins is mitigated by the draft pick they'd receive. Great deal for STL on paper.
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Post by larrycook on Nov 17, 2014 22:28:33 GMT -5
I am very shocked at how little the cards gave up for Hayward. No disrespect to Shelby miller.
Wonder if there is not something else going on in Atlanta.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Nov 18, 2014 1:36:52 GMT -5
I am very shocked at how little the cards gave up for Hayward. No disrespect to Shelby miller. Wonder if there is not something else going on in Atlanta. You undervalue starting pitching. It's the coin of the realm. If 2 months of Lester can get you a year+ of Cespedes, why shouldn't a few years of Miller get you a year of Howard?
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 18, 2014 9:04:45 GMT -5
Granted his numbers regressed last year but Shelby Miller just turned 24. People are way undervaluing him. His floor is basically what a lot of experts think Owens ceiling is. If he were in the Red Sox, he'd easily be our best young pitcher in terms of current production and future ceiling. Don't let the fact that Stl stupidly protected him in the WS two years ago and his regression (which was still a good season) last year jade how good he is.
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