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Post by gregblossersbelly on May 12, 2015 22:22:02 GMT -5
We're headed to our 3rd last place finish in 4 years with a Top 5 payroll. That's unacceptable. He made some good moves in 2013. But, he inherited; Lester, Lackey and Buchholz. He lucked into Koji after trying Melancon and Hanrahan.
He is absolutely clueless at identifying pitching. We have one of the worst pitching staffs in baseball. In order to contend. We have to improve it dramatically. I simply don't believe he's qualified to identify the pitchers needed to keep this sinking ship afloat.
The next GM will benefit from the influx of talent we have as position players. But, it is what it is. Ben wouldn't be able to put together a staff around them. We need to can him now. Take Amiel Sawdaye with ya too. Don't trust him either.
I want to do it before the draft. I don't want Trey Ball II as our 1st round pick either.
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ianrs
Veteran
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Post by ianrs on May 12, 2015 22:30:33 GMT -5
Red Sox are losing by a lot to the A's, fire Ben immediately!
lol
There will be in-season roster changes in reaction to the team's performance, and we can judge Ben based on further evidence. This team is far from a finished product.
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Post by sibbysisti on May 12, 2015 22:31:04 GMT -5
So, after 31 games, you're ready to throw in the towel? Looks like a long season for you.
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Post by gregblossersbelly on May 12, 2015 22:35:00 GMT -5
Red Sox are losing by a lot to the A's, fire Ben immediately lol There will be in-season roster changes in reaction to the team's performance, and we can judge Ben based on further evidence. This team is far from a finished product. We're 28th in pitching. We are going to be a last place team. We have maybe one reliable starter in Porcello. Yet, Future Boy Cherington is gonna summon the younguns and fix it...LOL He's had chances to identify pitching. He's incapable of doing it. |
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Post by mainesox on May 12, 2015 22:43:34 GMT -5
Is this performance art?
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Post by redsox4242 on May 12, 2015 22:44:30 GMT -5
Red Sox are losing by a lot to the A's, fire Ben immediately lol There will be in-season roster changes in reaction to the team's performance, and we can judge Ben based on further evidence. This team is far from a finished product. We're 28th in pitching. We are going to be a last place team. We have maybe one reliable starter in Porcello. Yet, Future Boy Cherington is gonna summon the younguns and fix it...LOL He's had chances to identify pitching. He's incapable of doing it. Hahahaha |
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Post by mgoetze on May 12, 2015 22:44:59 GMT -5
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ianrs
Veteran
Posts: 2,409
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Post by ianrs on May 12, 2015 22:45:26 GMT -5
We're 28th in pitching. We are going to be a last place team. We have maybe one reliable starter in Porcello. Yet, Future Boy Cherington is gonna summon the younguns and fix it...LOL He's had chances to identify pitching. He's incapable of doing it. Do you remember the 2013 Dodgers? 31-42 on June 21. That's 73 games. They finished the season 92-70. There are other examples of these types of turnarounds as well. Not including tonight, the Red Sox have gone 15-17 and played 32 games. That's such a small part of the season. Yes, there are problems. But I believe that they will be fixed. Brian Johnson & Eduardo Rodriguez are on this team because of Ben, too. And I have a feeling they'll be a bit better than Masterson. Oh, there's also that Rusney guy. And Barnes who was just added to the team. And JBJ. Ben built depth for a reason. That's not to mention potential trades. Ben also did not tear Vazquez' throwing elbow or smash Hanigan's fingers. That's another big factor; managing the pitching staff, that nobody had control over but bad luck. Like I said, only the season will tell. But to give up hope now is premature, and a product of being spoiled from 2004-2013. Assuming you are serious... |
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Post by soxfan2015 on May 12, 2015 22:45:46 GMT -5
Already saying a last place finish? In the middle of May? A bit of an overreaction
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Post by ethanbein on May 12, 2015 22:46:16 GMT -5
This thread is my favorite
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Post by grandsalami on May 12, 2015 22:46:55 GMT -5
Joke thread?
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Post by redsox4242 on May 12, 2015 22:50:08 GMT -5
This thread is my favorite Agreed. Hilarious |
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Post by wskeleton76 on May 12, 2015 22:58:23 GMT -5
Right now some still disagree with firing Ben but over time more will agreee. Ben sucks.
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Post by hkredsox on May 13, 2015 6:46:41 GMT -5
The WS in 2013 was ridiculous mix of luck and clutch but we should have lost to Detroit. Cherington has made some good moves but there's some mystifying moves (Lackey trade) and non-moves (Why are Nava, Craig and Victorino still here ?). If Ben is to blame you might even further ask why keep Farrell ? He was a pitcher and pitching coach himself, yet can't seem to get the most out of what we have. Even in 2013 I thought it was won inspite of him, not really because of. On day to day basis I don't see inspired management and in games seems makes wrong call too often. Guess he's better than Grady but not by a lot..
Its a shame but the almost unanimous opinion in offseason was RS needed more pitching. Cherington implied he wasn't going to be pressured into a trade. Missing on Shields was poor. After watching few games its clear Masterson should be released and Miley and Kelly need to improve to stay in rotation. Discarding Vavaro and Mujica is not getting to the root cause. You build any championship calibre team about 5 starters. That's most of baseball. If you have the deep pockets of the RS, not aiming for the best rotation in baseball is unforgivable. Who cares whether Cherington can identify good pitching himself, he's not working in a vacuum or with no money. You could give Kevin McHale the job and get a better result.
Outside of the pitching, after amassing such a large talent pool and touting the batting, the team is averaging around .230 and is abysmal with RISP. It should be clear by now that last year's team was arguably better than this one at similar point in the season. The pitching certainly was not that bad and if Ramirez is injured don't get too excited about the batting.
As you rightly point out for the money spent, this is a ridiculous return.
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Post by ctfisher on May 13, 2015 9:49:37 GMT -5
The WS in 2013 was ridiculous mix of luck and clutch but we should have lost to Detroit. Cherington has made some good moves but there's some mystifying moves (Lackey trade) and non-moves (Why are Nava, Craig and Victorino still here ?). Its a shame but the almost unanimous opinion in offseason was RS needed more pitching. Cherington implied he wasn't going to be pressured into a trade. Missing on Shields was poor. After watching few games its clear Masterson should be released and Miley and Kelly need to improve to stay in rotation. Discarding Vavaro and Mujica is not getting to the root cause. You build any championship calibre team about 5 starters. That's most of baseball. If you have the deep pockets of the RS, not aiming for the best rotation in baseball is unforgivable. Who cares whether Cherington can identify good pitching himself, he's not working in a vacuum or with no money. You could give Kevin McHale the job and get a better result. Outside of the pitching, after amassing such a large talent pool and touting the batting, the team is averaging around .230 and is abysmal with RISP. It should be clear by now that last year's team was arguably better than this one at similar point in the season. The pitching certainly was not that bad and if Ramirez is injured don't get too excited about the batting. Do you think any GM in baseball could unload Allen Craig or Victorino right now? They're both overpaid and either constantly injured or haven't yet recovered from a serious injury. That being said, without Victorino, the Sox don't win in 2013, and if Craig gets back to 75% of his former self, he's a good value at ~$8mil per season. The Lackey trade was a gamble that so far looks terrible, but we have 2(3?) more years of Joe Kelly on his rookie contract, so I'm not ready to call that a loss yet. Briefly on the other points: Cherington completely revamped the rotation in the offseason, to the point that most people were pretty satisfied with what he'd done. I think Shields, on the deal he eventually signed, would've been a good get, but pitching in Fenway, I don't think he'd be anything like the fix some people might imagine. Would he be better than Masterson? Yes. But Cherington's not working in a vacuum, and it looked like Shields was going to get a lot more when he signed Masterson for the last rotation spot, and at that stage, he was working with limited money. As to the rest of your points, have you ever heard of small sample size? That's really all there is to say: even the pitching peripherals are much better than the actual numbers, and the team BABIP is .256. If you really think that's going to hold up all year, that's your prerogative, but the numbers really don't support that idea |
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