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How long should the Red Sox wait on JBJ? (This Year)
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Post by SALNotes on Apr 12, 2019 15:25:53 GMT -5
I would hate to break up this outfield, it's so special defensively. This team is going to score a ton of runs and JBJ will get it going eventually.
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Post by jimed14 on Apr 12, 2019 17:53:26 GMT -5
There are two options. Trolling or outright stupidity.
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Post by Smittyw on Apr 12, 2019 18:32:57 GMT -5
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Apr 12, 2019 21:37:35 GMT -5
demainah - did you see the catch JBJ made tonight? It was a key catch at a key time. The kind of thing that doesn't really show up in a box score but it prevented at least one run. Who knows if Workman would have gotten the next batter? That's the kind of thing JBJ does with regularity that makes him valuable. His hitting is mediocre, but he's as good a CF defensively as I've seen in 40 years of watching this team.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Apr 13, 2019 8:02:31 GMT -5
demainah - did you see the catch JBJ made tonight? It was a key catch at a key time. The kind of thing that doesn't really show up in a box score but it prevented at least one run. Who knows if Workman would have gotten the next batter? That's the kind of thing JBJ does with regularity that makes him valuable. His hitting is mediocre, but he's as good a CF defensively as I've seen in 40 years of watching this team. It didn't look as spectacular, but I thought that catch he made coming straight in on a low line drive was even more impressive. You have to commit so quickly on a play like that, and you can't screw it up or you're playing a single into a triple at least. Lots of guys can cover ground and time a big leap at the warning track, but it's those incredible instant reads on the ball that really separate the great outfielders from the good ones to me.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Apr 13, 2019 8:19:30 GMT -5
demainah - did you see the catch JBJ made tonight? It was a key catch at a key time. The kind of thing that doesn't really show up in a box score but it prevented at least one run. Who knows if Workman would have gotten the next batter? That's the kind of thing JBJ does with regularity that makes him valuable. His hitting is mediocre, but he's as good a CF defensively as I've seen in 40 years of watching this team. It didn't look as spectacular, but I thought that catch he made coming straight in on a low line drive was even more impressive. You have to commit so quickly on a play like that, and you can't screw it up or you're playing a single into a triple at least. Lots of guys can cover ground and time a big leap at the warning track, but it's those incredible instant reads on the ball that really separate the great outfielders from the good ones to me. Agree in general but on that particular play, he had enough time to take an intentional circular route to position himself better.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Apr 18, 2019 10:19:41 GMT -5
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Apr 18, 2019 11:12:03 GMT -5
Who do you want to make your new 3rd outfielder?
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Apr 18, 2019 11:17:36 GMT -5
Who do you want to make your new 3rd outfielder? For this year, at this point, JBJ should be starting (I'd let JD play more OF, but then they have no one to DH). I've been wanting to bench JBJ for awhile now. One potential option is if they call up Chavis they can have some sort of rotation where Devers plays more DH, Chavis alternates between 2B, 3B and DH and Martinez gets more time in the OF.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Apr 18, 2019 12:25:59 GMT -5
Who do you want to make your new 3rd outfielder? For this year, at this point, JBJ should be starting (I'd let JD play more OF, but then they have no one to DH). I've been wanting to bench JBJ for awhile now. One potential option is if they call up Chavis they can have some sort of rotation where Devers plays more DH, Chavis alternates between 2B, 3B and DH and Martinez gets more time in the OF. Replacing Bradley with Martinez in the outfield costs you easily two wins on defense. And your proposed DH replacement has a .255/.315/.437 MLB batting line, and is significantly underperforming that so far this year.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Apr 18, 2019 12:50:32 GMT -5
For this year, at this point, JBJ should be starting (I'd let JD play more OF, but then they have no one to DH). I've been wanting to bench JBJ for awhile now. One potential option is if they call up Chavis they can have some sort of rotation where Devers plays more DH, Chavis alternates between 2B, 3B and DH and Martinez gets more time in the OF. Replacing Bradley with Martinez in the outfield costs you easily two wins on defense. And your proposed DH replacement has a .255/.315/.437 MLB batting line, and is significantly underperforming that so far this year. I admittedly haven't looked up Devers defensive sabermetrics numbers, but he does have 5 errors on the year. He hasn't been good based on the eye test and I don't think he's ever going to be great at the position. Then again, Chavis isn't exactly a stud either. While JD is negative in the field, JBJ currently has a -0.4 WAR which I think should factor against JD's -2 defensive wins. I do also have faith in Devers with the bat, but that could also be wishful thinking. I'm a big believer in both Devers and Chavis with the lumber. This is predicated on Chavis and Devers hitting. Still, it was a move they should have made in the off-season.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 18, 2019 13:52:16 GMT -5
Who do you want to make your new 3rd outfielder? For this year, at this point, JBJ should be starting (I'd let JD play more OF, but then they have no one to DH). I've been wanting to bench JBJ for awhile now. One potential option is if they call up Chavis they can have some sort of rotation where Devers plays more DH, Chavis alternates between 2B, 3B and DH and Martinez gets more time in the OF. It just needs to happen, Chavis needs to be called up sooner than later. You can't bash his D when they keep running out Nunez. Can he really be any worse? Didn't they have Chavis playing in the OF at times also? He's basically had crash courses at almost every position and while he likely won't be very good at any position, his bat could really change the lineup. Cora go with a bigger bench, not an extra bullpen arm! I love Bradley and when he's hot it's crazy fun to watch. Yet year after year he has these ice cold streaks that last months and really hurt the team. If everyone is on fire you can live with it, not when half the lineup is ice cold also. So yea let's try something different maybe some extra rest can get him to breakout of his funk sooner.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 18, 2019 14:46:14 GMT -5
I have to add that we have Castillo, who is by far and away the perfect 4th OF, just wasting away in AAA. Not going to happen over money, but he's been Rock solid for years now. The crazy part is he could very likely earn his contract if given a chance. Not crazy to think he would be a 1 war player.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Apr 18, 2019 15:48:45 GMT -5
It just needs to happen, Chavis needs to be called up sooner than later. You can't bash his D when they keep running out Nunez. Can he really be any worse? Didn't they have Chavis playing in the OF at times also? He's basically had crash courses at almost every position and while he likely won't be very good at any position, his bat could really change the lineup. Cora go with a bigger bench, not an extra bullpen arm! That's fine but if Chavis is replacing Nunez, he's not replacing JBJ.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 18, 2019 16:13:08 GMT -5
It just needs to happen, Chavis needs to be called up sooner than later. You can't bash his D when they keep running out Nunez. Can he really be any worse? Didn't they have Chavis playing in the OF at times also? He's basically had crash courses at almost every position and while he likely won't be very good at any position, his bat could really change the lineup. Cora go with a bigger bench, not an extra bullpen arm! That's fine but if Chavis is replacing Nunez, he's not replacing JBJ. I don't want to fully replace Bradley, just give him some more time off. I wouldn't hand Chavis anything, just use him as a super sub with Holt. Add in Lin and see if someone can earn it. That group has better position flexibility and Chavis has a better bat than Nunez. I fail to see how that isn't the better pairing and it's not like you'll miss Nunez. He's just not the same player after that knee injury.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Apr 18, 2019 16:49:49 GMT -5
Can he really be any worse? Yes. Nunez had made some bad mistakes but Chavis has played 2B for less than 2 months. No. He's never played outfield. I have to add that we have Castillo, who is by far and away the perfect 4th OF, just wasting away in AAA. Not going to happen over money, but he's been Rock solid for years now. Don't know that I'd say he's been "rock solid," at least as it relates to his MLB potential. He had a good year in 2017, for sure, but last year he had a good, but deceptively empty, batting average. He hit .319 but didn't really walk much or hit for much power on a .372 BABIP. Really, he should've been grandfathered in somehow so as not to get trapped by the rule that has now trapped him. The issue is not whether he would otherwise be on the Red Sox, because as constituted, he almost certainly wouldn't be. The issue is whether another MLB team would be more willing to acquire him and give him a shot.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 18, 2019 17:46:17 GMT -5
Can he really be any worse? Yes. Nunez had made some bad mistakes but Chavis has played 2B for less than 2 months. No. He's never played outfield. I have to add that we have Castillo, who is by far and away the perfect 4th OF, just wasting away in AAA. Not going to happen over money, but he's been Rock solid for years now. Don't know that I'd say he's been "rock solid," at least as it relates to his MLB potential. He had a good year in 2017, for sure, but last year he had a good, but deceptively empty, batting average. He hit .319 but didn't really walk much or hit for much power on a .372 BABIP. Really, he should've been grandfathered in somehow so as not to get trapped by the rule that has now trapped him. The issue is not whether he would otherwise be on the Red Sox, because as constituted, he almost certainly wouldn't be. The issue is whether another MLB team would be more willing to acquire him and give him a shot. That is putting it mildly, as Nunez is -15 DRS in his last 85 games at 2B. That is a crazy low bar, basically just don't be the worst defender in Baseball. Crazy small sample size but he hasn't looked that bad at 2B. Was the plan to play him there in fall ball but he didn't because he was injured? Thought I heard they were going to try him there. Well in respects to being a 4th OF, he's hit .314, .319, and .279 the last three years and plays good D. He can play all three OF spots.
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Post by station13 on Apr 18, 2019 18:27:02 GMT -5
I have to add that we have Castillo, who is by far and away the perfect 4th OF, just wasting away in AAA. Not going to happen over money, but he's been Rock solid for years now. The crazy part is he could very likely earn his contract if given a chance. Not crazy to think he would be a 1 war player. If they add him, do they control him for the standard 6 year? It would be sometimes next year.
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Post by dmaineah on Apr 18, 2019 23:18:23 GMT -5
I have to add that we have Castillo, who is by far and away the perfect 4th OF, just wasting away in AAA. Not going to happen over money, but he's been Rock solid for years now. The crazy part is he could very likely earn his contract if given a chance. Not crazy to think he would be a 1 war player. The teams salary is the only reason why he is not on the active roster the past 2 years. If not for the team being up against it he would be active getting the bulk of the playing time at one of the corner Outfield positions with Mookie in CF. And yes JBJ would be the 4th OF.
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Post by James Dunne on Apr 18, 2019 23:22:50 GMT -5
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 18, 2019 23:25:29 GMT -5
I have to add that we have Castillo, who is by far and away the perfect 4th OF, just wasting away in AAA. Not going to happen over money, but he's been Rock solid for years now. The crazy part is he could very likely earn his contract if given a chance. Not crazy to think he would be a 1 war player. The teams salary is the only reason why he is not on the active roster the past 2 years. If not for the team being up against it he would be active getting the bulk of the playing time at one of the corner Outfield positions with Mookie in CF. And yes JBJ would be the 4th OF. Lol dmaineah, ohhhh dmaineah.
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Post by rismith on Apr 19, 2019 7:16:26 GMT -5
I know this is not the plan....but the plan had many worried in that we end up signing a few and losing a few and then we have limited minor league studs in terms of reinforcements. Maybe...while painful....this start ends up a simply bad year and we trade some of these soon to be free agents and try to replenish the system some. I know the way they are playing we won't get top young guys but we may be able to get enough B+ or a few A- guys that we can bolster the system and still sign Mookie. We werent likely to sign Jackie or Porcello. Maybe they yield 2-3 young guys and we dont have such a cliff we are facing at year end.
I would take one bad season to maybe bolster a longer run...
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 19, 2019 9:57:14 GMT -5
I have to add that we have Castillo, who is by far and away the perfect 4th OF, just wasting away in AAA. Not going to happen over money, but he's been Rock solid for years now. The crazy part is he could very likely earn his contract if given a chance. Not crazy to think he would be a 1 war player. If they add him, do they control him for the standard 6 year? It would be sometimes next year. You only need to wait two weeks to get an extra year, so they'd get him this year and six more years after this year. Unless he becomes a super two in which you'd get one less year, but he'd be one of the best young players in Baseball. So service time isn't an issue.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Apr 19, 2019 11:45:11 GMT -5
Was the plan to play him there in fall ball but he didn't because he was injured? Thought I heard they were going to try him there. If you mean outfield, I don't think so. Second base, I think yes.
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Post by jimmydugan on Apr 20, 2019 22:14:49 GMT -5
What exactly was JBJ working with JDM's hitting coach on? It always seemed like he would benefit greatly from either going the other way or getting the ball in the air, two things that JD's great at.
I was JBJ's biggest defender last year, but even i'm losing hope that he'll improve. Looks like he's hitting the ball weaker to the right side of the infield.
Don't get me wrong, I still think he should get the bulk of the playing time in CF. Worst case scenario, he's a solid 4th OF who gets a lot of playing time. It just seems like hasn't done anything (walk/keep K's reasonable/square a ball up) so far at the plate.
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