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Post by grandsalami on Aug 23, 2017 21:27:12 GMT -5
Yeah this is why people hate on John Farrell for bullpen mismanagement. This is a game where Kimbrel should be sitting. He is doing exactly what Tito did. You get hot in the pen you go into the game. Plus kimbrel was hit while it was a save situation. So he had to pitch.
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Post by jrffam05 on Aug 23, 2017 21:27:20 GMT -5
I wonder how many of us honestly think Sox can win 2 of the next 3? At this point I'm thinking 1 win is the best-case scenario. I think we'll take at least two. QFT
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Post by manfred on Aug 23, 2017 21:28:26 GMT -5
Not to get old school, but is Pomeranz 3rd in the AL in wins, 4th in ERA? Might be time to start looking at that trade as a steal for the Sox.
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Post by soxfan06 on Aug 23, 2017 21:29:44 GMT -5
FWIW, Farrell is far from the only manager in the game to do this. It's common for a closer to be warm, his team scores 2-3 runs to take away the save situation, and the closer comes in anyway. Not 100% sure of the reason. Maybe it just doesn't make sense to have two pitchers warm with a comfortable lead. But Farrell is not alone in this approach we saw tonight. Just because he isn't the only manager to do it doesn't mean it isn't dumb. Just thinking back to game 1, this is a 3-0 series lead with Chris Sale going tomorrow if not for bullpen mismanagement. Hell he butchered that game so bad they had to put the pitcher on the DL with a phantom injury.
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Post by soxfan06 on Aug 23, 2017 21:30:34 GMT -5
I think we'll take at least two. QFT Good call, I'm not sure which is more impressive....thinking they win the Fister game ahead of time or thinking they beat Kluber.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Aug 23, 2017 21:40:39 GMT -5
Hot Damn. I fell asleep during the 8th and looky here. Great job by the guys. Get em tomorrow.
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Post by dirtdog on Aug 23, 2017 21:41:57 GMT -5
Not to get old school, but is Pomeranz 3rd in the AL in wins, 4th in ERA? Might be time to start looking at that trade as a steal for the Sox. Not to mention the whole TJ surgery in SD.
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Post by dirtdog on Aug 23, 2017 21:44:51 GMT -5
So Reed has proven to be homerun prone so far.... WHIP under 1 and ERA over 5. Dont see that stat line often.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Aug 23, 2017 21:44:59 GMT -5
FWIW, Farrell is far from the only manager in the game to do this. It's common for a closer to be warm, his team scores 2-3 runs to take away the save situation, and the closer comes in anyway. Not 100% sure of the reason. Maybe it just doesn't make sense to have two pitchers warm with a comfortable lead. But Farrell is not alone in this approach we saw tonight. You know what they say: Foolishness loves company.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Aug 23, 2017 21:46:29 GMT -5
Nunie trying to Wally Pipp Pedey?
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Post by marrcus on Aug 23, 2017 21:46:52 GMT -5
I hope someone asked Corey Kluber about the hit on Nunez. Let him have to say it 'just got away from me.'
Devers getting down the line breaks up the hitless streak and maybe he'll be mashing again soon.
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Post by station13 on Aug 23, 2017 21:47:15 GMT -5
Pitching really good again.
Good be nice if Betts and Xander start pummeling the ball aganin.
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Post by grandsalami on Aug 23, 2017 21:50:35 GMT -5
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 23, 2017 21:52:22 GMT -5
FWIW, Farrell is far from the only manager in the game to do this. It's common for a closer to be warm, his team scores 2-3 runs to take away the save situation, and the closer comes in anyway. Not 100% sure of the reason. Maybe it just doesn't make sense to have two pitchers warm with a comfortable lead. But Farrell is not alone in this approach we saw tonight. Just because he isn't the only manager to do it doesn't mean it isn't dumb. Just thinking back to game 1, this is a 3-0 series lead with Chris Sale going tomorrow if not for bullpen mismanagement. Hell he butchered that game so bad they had to put the pitcher on the DL with a phantom injury. I get what you're saying. My only point is that warm up pitches matter too. We don't see it as fans, but as far as wear and tear on an arm during the season, warm up pitches count too. In a perfect world, the Sox would have scored four in the 8th to prevent Kimbrel from warming at all. But that didn't happen. You have a guy warm already. Not sure it makes sense to warm a second one. Kimbrel hadn't pitched in three days. He should be available tomorrow. I'm not losing any sleep on this one.
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Post by soxfan06 on Aug 23, 2017 21:58:17 GMT -5
Just because he isn't the only manager to do it doesn't mean it isn't dumb. Just thinking back to game 1, this is a 3-0 series lead with Chris Sale going tomorrow if not for bullpen mismanagement. Hell he butchered that game so bad they had to put the pitcher on the DL with a phantom injury. I get what you're saying. My only point is that warm up pitches matter too. We don't see it as fans, but as far as wear and tear on an arm during the season, warm up pitches count too. In a perfect world, the Sox would have scored four in the 8th to prevent Kimbrel from warming at all. But that didn't happen. You have a guy warm already. Not sure it makes sense to warm a second one. Kimbrel hadn't pitched in three days. He should be available tomorrow. I'm not losing any sleep on this one. That was the exact point I made. Warm up pitches count. As a result, there is no reason to waste more pitches and actually bring him into the game.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 23, 2017 22:02:05 GMT -5
If you feel the need to throw in Kimbrel because he was warming up and you didn't have enough time to warm a second pitcher after the Sox scored with 2 outs in the 9th, then okay....
Pitch Kimbrel for a out and pull him right after that. That second pitcher should be warm after the half inning change and then after Kimbrel gets the first out.
No harm, no foul. Instead, he throws 21 pitches and now your hoping tomorrow is a blowout because you'd rather stay away from Kimbrel. It just makes zero sense to have him keep throwing meaningless pitches.
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Post by soxfando on Aug 23, 2017 22:13:05 GMT -5
Just because he isn't the only manager to do it doesn't mean it isn't dumb. Just thinking back to game 1, this is a 3-0 series lead with Chris Sale going tomorrow if not for bullpen mismanagement. Hell he butchered that game so bad they had to put the pitcher on the DL with a phantom injury. I get what you're saying. My only point is that warm up pitches matter too. We don't see it as fans, but as far as wear and tear on an arm during the season, warm up pitches count too. In a perfect world, the Sox would have scored four in the 8th to prevent Kimbrel from warming at all. But that didn't happen. You have a guy warm already. Not sure it makes sense to warm a second one. Kimbrel hadn't pitched in three days. He should be available tomorrow. I'm not losing any sleep on this one. if he pitches tomorrow though, then he'll most likely be unavailable friday. and if it plays out that his services are needed in both games, then this errant decision will be amplified (like it was in game one of this cleveland series) i understand he's already warm or whatever, but you often see relief pitchers get warm in the bullpen for just in case scenarios and not enter the game. consider it like a bullpen session that starting pitchers usually have between starts.
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Post by James Dunne on Aug 23, 2017 22:36:02 GMT -5
It's been said a lot, but many pitchers don't like warming and then not pitching. And unlike the whole closer/9th-inning mentality, there's an actual physical aspect to it. It was a big deal for Uehara, who had a pretty intense workout routine.
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Post by Don Caballero on Aug 23, 2017 22:38:55 GMT -5
Just thinking back to game 1, this is a 3-0 series lead with Chris Sale going tomorrow if not for bullpen mismanagement. This seriously needs to stop. It was a ONE run game and there were six outs to go. Reed gave up a run tonight. Workman gave up a run that night. Someone had to take the other 3 outs and even Kimbrel could give that lead up. It was not an automatic win, it was not this sure thing that the manager fumbled, it was a tough situation where he tried to gauge which one of his guys was better conditioned to deliver.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Aug 23, 2017 22:53:29 GMT -5
What? Why do they need an 8-man pen? Holt should be starting in LF, so why is an 8th reliever more useful than the only reserve INF on the bench? If this means they plan to play Davis in CF and Benny in LF versus RHP while JBJ is out, I'm very skeptical of that. It's true that Davis hit .333 / .397 / .530 in 73 PA from July 5 to August 8, but he had a .571 OPS before that and is .523 since, in 22 PA. Unless he did something the evening of July 4 to set off the subsequent fireworks, what he's done since then has no special predictive value. Of course, I might have said the same thing about Nunez hitting .246 / .275 / .306 in 142 PA through May 12 and .357 / .383 / .506 in 176 PA from then until the trade. But he was still white-hot when we traded for him, and the hot streak was much longer. He is, BTW, now at .337 / .368 / .584 in 106 PA in a Sox uni. Overall starting 5/14, he's .349 / .377 / .535 in 281 PA.
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Post by dirtdog on Aug 23, 2017 23:17:35 GMT -5
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Post by grandsalami on Aug 23, 2017 23:27:05 GMT -5
What? Why do they need an 8-man pen? Holt should be starting in LF, so why is an 8th reliever more useful than the only reserve INF on the bench? If this means they plan to play Davis in CF and Benny in LF versus RHP while JBJ is out, I'm very skeptical of that. It's true that Davis hit .333 / .397 / .530 in 73 PA from July 5 to August 8, but he had a .571 OPS before that and is .523 since, in 22 PA. Unless he did something the evening of July 4 to set off the subsequent fireworks, what he's done since then has no special predictive value. Of course, I might have said the same thing about Nunez hitting .246 / .275 / .306 in 142 PA through May 12 and .357 / .383 / .506 in 176 PA from then until the trade. But he was still white-hot when we traded for him, and the hot streak was much longer. He is, BTW, now at .337 / .368 / .584 in 106 PA in a Sox uni. Overall starting 5/14, he's .349 / .377 / .535 in 281 PA.
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Post by James Dunne on Aug 23, 2017 23:32:50 GMT -5
Being a .500 team in games where one of your top two pitchers doesn't start sounds really good to me, actually. Last year's team was 45-23 when Porcello or Price pitched, 48-46 the rest of the time. The 2004 team (with an amazing offense) was 44-21 when Schilling or Pedro pitched, 54-43 the rest of the time. And that 2004 team only had five starts made by people not in their regular top 5: three by Byung-hyun Kim, one by Abe Alvarez, and Pedro Astacio on the last day of the regular season.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 23, 2017 23:57:05 GMT -5
Another strong start by Pomeranz. Ever since that blowup with Farrell he's been something.
It's funny - I wanted Todd Frazier because I felt the Sox needed power at 3b, so since they didn't get Frazier, they "acquired" 2 guys that have hit 14 homers between them. And since they both can't play 3b at the same time Devers plays 3b, and conveniently Pedroia is injured so Nunez plays 2b.
It's amazing how much impact Nunez and Devers had on a sleeping offense. A couple of days off did wonders for Benintendi and somehow Vazquez is hot again.
So for the cost of Shaun Anderson and Gregory Santos the Red Sox jumpstarted their offense instead of having to trade any major prospects. I had no idea Nunez would do what he did or that Devers would be so unphased. Kudos to Dombrowski. He was the real winner at the trade deadline as it has turned out.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 24, 2017 2:03:04 GMT -5
Come on people, Pomeranz vs. Kluber is a marquee matchup, no sarc. Nailed.
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