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Post by philsbosoxfan on Jul 26, 2018 7:00:15 GMT -5
I think DD just outmaneuvered Cashman. Not only did we get a better pitcher, we gave up less to get him.
One other small detail, over the course of the season it's been mentioned that pitching Price after Sale was not good because of their similarities. This gives the Sox an additional non similar pitcher to start the day before Price.
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Post by m1keyboots on Jul 26, 2018 7:10:06 GMT -5
If his clothes line straight fast balls can be hittable b Al teams bad, and good I don't trust him any more than I would trust Brian Johnson.
Then again this is why Dombrowski is paid the big bucks. I would have rather have gotten more of a "winning" pitcher
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Jul 26, 2018 7:12:30 GMT -5
If his clothes line straight fast balls can be hittable b Al teams bad, and good I don't trust him any more than I would trust Brian Johnson. Then again this is why Dombrowski is paid the big bucks. I would have rather have gotten more of a "winning" pitcher That's good because Brian Johnson has been pitching like a #3.
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Post by m1keyboots on Jul 26, 2018 7:17:24 GMT -5
If his clothes line straight fast balls can be hittable b Al teams bad, and good I don't trust him any more than I would trust Brian Johnson. Then again this is why Dombrowski is paid the big bucks. I would have rather have gotten more of a "winning" pitcher That's good because Brian Johnson has been pitching like a #3. Perhaps I'm being picky, but constant meltdowns and arm injuries playing for lesser than teams and the lack of a put-away pitch doesn't excite me much. Especially with teams like the Cardinals possibly shopping, possibly Pittsburgh and Oakland. Two good starts followed by a complete meltdown doesn't excite me for our playoff run. Here's to hoping Joe Kelly can teach him how to make a fastball move even just a little bit
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Jul 26, 2018 7:20:06 GMT -5
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Jul 26, 2018 7:29:25 GMT -5
That's good because Brian Johnson has been pitching like a #3. Perhaps I'm being picky, but constant meltdowns and arm injuries playing for lesser than teams and the lack of a put-away pitch doesn't excite me much. Especially with teams like the Cardinals possibly shopping, possibly Pittsburgh and Oakland. Two good starts followed by a complete meltdown doesn't excite me for our playoff run. Here's to hoping Joe Kelly can teach him how to make a fastball move even just a little bit We're talking about Jalen Beeks here not Sidd Finch. Also, I doubt if the A's are shopping, they are as close to catching the Yankees for a wildcard as the Yankees are to the Red Sox. There's going to be a lot of competition for the likes of Fiers, Happ and Harvey. I also haven't seen any mention of Cardinals or Pirates starters in the trade rumors which means they are going to have to be overwhelmed (like the Mets) to trade one of their starters.
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Post by voiceofreason on Jul 26, 2018 8:09:04 GMT -5
Only time will tell but with the Sox going all in for this season I think it is a good move. At the least it seems like this guy can end up being a beast out of the bullpen. He could end up being very valuable to the Sox this year where as Beeks was not going to be.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Jul 26, 2018 8:11:27 GMT -5
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Post by m1keyboots on Jul 26, 2018 8:12:33 GMT -5
Perhaps I'm being picky, but constant meltdowns and arm injuries playing for lesser than teams and the lack of a put-away pitch doesn't excite me much. Especially with teams like the Cardinals possibly shopping, possibly Pittsburgh and Oakland. Two good starts followed by a complete meltdown doesn't excite me for our playoff run. Here's to hoping Joe Kelly can teach him how to make a fastball move even just a little bit We're talking about Jalen Beeks here not Sidd Finch. Also, I doubt if the A's are shopping, they are as close to catching the Yankees for a wildcard as the Yankees are to the Red Sox. There's going to be a lot of competition for the likes of Fiers, Happ and Harvey. I also haven't seen any mention of Cardinals or Pirates starters in the trade rumors which means they are going to have to be overwhelmed (like the Mets) to trade one of their starters. This is all in good fun but I saw a few days ago ivan Nova was on the Block as well as Felipe Vasquez and krick. They mention the Cardinals as more of if they lose some more games then they might be out of contention contacts. If that makes any sense. Although I never mentioned sidd Finch or beeks, I'd be happy with either of them as number five starters if we didn't have the depth Edit for a $900 phone, the talk text technology sure leaves a lot to be desired
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Post by m1keyboots on Jul 26, 2018 8:14:25 GMT -5
Only time will tell but with the Sox going all in for this season I think it is a good move. At the least it seems like this guy can end up being a beast out of the bullpen. He could end up being very valuable to the Sox this year where as Beeks was not going to be. If he eovaldi can come out of the pen and blow guys away then I'm all for it, and as another poster suggested Nunez being a terrible Defender, there was Heavy talk about Brian Dozier or possibly wanting to go to the sox Edit although, all of this is just gossip from the likes of Eric Burns and Dan plesac. However, I'll take it over certain Boston Sports writers. They seem to want the Red Sox to lose so bad they might as well be working for the Yankees
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 26, 2018 8:42:52 GMT -5
The roster move has to be to option somebody, and the obvious guy is Velazquez, after he possibly piggybacks on Johnson tomorrow.
The really interesting bullpen roster moves would come if they got Dozier or the equivalent and went back to a 4-man bench, or traded for Duke or Diekman to add a true matchup lefty to the pen. Workman's too good and Brasier's too interesting to send down, and Kelly has too much upside to dump. I keep coming back to trading Workman to help restock the system a fraction, if they add a LHR.
I think the Sox option Workman. They already burned his option year and they haven't burned a option year for Velazquez yet. Velazquez is more useful with his multi inning purposes for this team too. They could phantom DL Kelly if the league allows them, I suppose. Yeah, there is that, and there's also the fact that Workman has been their 4th best reliever by adjusted xwOBA, after Kimbrel, Barnes, and Hembree, and their third best reliever by WPA-, after Kimbrel and (SSSS) Brasier. He has a .310 to .335 edge on Velazquez in the former stat and a 29 to 71 edge in the latter. Like I said, he's too good to send down.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 26, 2018 8:55:21 GMT -5
If his clothes line straight fast balls can be hittable b Al teams bad, and good I don't trust him any more than I would trust Brian Johnson. Then again this is why Dombrowski is paid the big bucks. I would have rather have gotten more of a "winning" pitcher 2018 averages:
Nathan Eovaldi has 10.5" of movement on his fastball, which he throws 97.6 MPH.
Craig Kimbrel has 10.5" of movement on his fastball, which he throws 97.5 MPH.
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Post by Addam603 on Jul 26, 2018 11:27:41 GMT -5
Jalen Beeks slots in at #16 on MLB pipeline’s Top 30 for the Rays.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jul 26, 2018 11:44:38 GMT -5
I like the move and will trust that DD doesn't think Beeks will be that good. I was wondering about him and even Crawford. They were either great sell high guys or keepers. Textbook DD trade. Eovaldi has been like Kelly, basically a career under achiever given his stuff. Pitching very well this year minus giving up a ton of HRs. So it seems like a good gamble, maybe its all coming together for him.
DD better not be done!
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Jul 26, 2018 12:25:10 GMT -5
We're talking about Jalen Beeks here not Sidd Finch. Also, I doubt if the A's are shopping, they are as close to catching the Yankees for a wildcard as the Yankees are to the Red Sox. There's going to be a lot of competition for the likes of Fiers, Happ and Harvey. I also haven't seen any mention of Cardinals or Pirates starters in the trade rumors which means they are going to have to be overwhelmed (like the Mets) to trade one of their starters. This is all in good fun but I saw a few days ago ivan Nova was on the Block as well as Felipe Vasquez and krick. They mention the Cardinals as more of if they lose some more games then they might be out of contention contacts. If that makes any sense. Although I never mentioned sidd Finch or beeks, I'd be happy with either of them as number five starters if we didn't have the depth Edit for a $900 phone, the talk text technology sure leaves a lot to be desired The talk on the Cardinals that I've seen is position players not pitchers. Americans are getting ripped off. The same phones are available in the Philippines (except they use a different signal here). My wife buys and sells phones on finance and I've yet to see one over $200. Example that I have in my hand. My!Phone MYA8 DTV Digital TV Phone. $175 including her 20% markup.
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Post by soxin8 on Jul 26, 2018 12:43:54 GMT -5
I’m fine with the trade. It may not work out, but it’s very unlikely that losing this trade sets the franchise back in the years to come. Dombrowski will be forgiven for losing this trade if that’s the way it unfolds. He will not be forgiven for standing pat at the deadline in what could be a historically great season. I appreciate KC's post and everything Eric has written. On 7/25/78 the sox had a 9.5 game lead on NY. On 7/25/07 they had a 6 game lead on NY and held on to win by 2. I don't think anyone here wants to face Paxton in a one game. We received the best available rental without the draft penalty and maybe he will like it here and return.
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Post by soxin8 on Jul 26, 2018 12:52:28 GMT -5
I think DDo cares about the minors more than we give him credit for. He was obviously interested in Britton but wouldn't top the NY offer. This was not Kazmir for Zambrano.
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Jul 26, 2018 12:54:05 GMT -5
I’m fine with the trade. It may not work out, but it’s very unlikely that losing this trade sets the franchise back in the years to come. Dombrowski will be forgiven for losing this trade if that’s the way it unfolds. He will not be forgiven for standing pat at the deadline in what could be a historically great season. I appreciate KC's post and everything Eric has written. On 7/25/78 the sox had a 9.5 game lead on NY. On 7/25/07 they had a 6 game lead on NY and held on to win by 2. I don't think anyone here wants to face Paxton in a one game. We received the best available rental without the draft penalty and maybe he will like it here and return. Or Manaea, who no-hit us.
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Post by telson13 on Jul 26, 2018 13:05:53 GMT -5
This article highlights the changes the Yankees made with Eovaldi, and then it points out the changes the Rays made with him. I think Eovaldi was the best pitcher (not just starter) the Sox could get this deadline. I read that article when they posted it, and it’s very encouraging. It’s a big part of why I didn’t get so pissed when they completed the trade LOL. I think Eovaldi would be a very good offseason sign, with Pomeranz probably out. He’s 28 and entering what’s typically a pitcher’s prime...when they figure out how to pitch and not just throw. If he becomes enamored of the team, and the winning gets them a leg up on extension, he could be a fantastic pickup as a 3/4 who might pitch up to a 2/3.
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Jul 26, 2018 13:07:40 GMT -5
Not looking forward to Pomeranz starting vs Arrieta coming up. That seems like a scheduled loss to me.
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Post by telson13 on Jul 26, 2018 13:22:37 GMT -5
Fwiw, I think the best part of this trade (and I give Dombrowski a TON of credit here) is that they filled TWO needs with one player, at MINIMAL cost. They added arguably the best starter on the market to their rotation at a time when they needed starter depth pretty badly. AND, they added a HUGE power arm to their postseason bullpen (plus a safety net for their rotation). It’s disappointing to lose Beeks, but this was a helluva trade logistically...even before considering that it puts NY in an even tougher/more costly position for finding starter depth, and gives the Sox a first-hand chance to audition a potential Pomeranz and/or Porcello replacement. Add in that they kept their higher-upside pitching prospects, and it’s really a fantastic move in terms of theory. We’ll see how that plays out in practice. But one need look no further than Pomeranz to see that for a fair number of “great stuff” pitchers, 28 is the magical tipping point of figuring it out.
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Post by James Dunne on Jul 26, 2018 13:28:59 GMT -5
Not looking forward to Pomeranz starting vs Arrieta coming up. That seems like a scheduled loss to me. "I'm worried the Red Sox will lose a game next week." A healthy and productive Pomeranz will make the Red Sox better, and getting him work against a non-league opponent while he pitches for a team that's lost like four games in the last month seems like a good opportunity to get him some work in.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 26, 2018 15:12:35 GMT -5
I think the Sox option Workman. They already burned his option year and they haven't burned a option year for Velazquez yet. Velazquez is more useful with his multi inning purposes for this team too. They could phantom DL Kelly if the league allows them, I suppose. Yeah, there is that, and there's also the fact that Workman has been their 4th best reliever by adjusted xwOBA, after Kimbrel, Barnes, and Hembree, and their third best reliever by WPA-, after Kimbrel and (SSSS) Brasier. He has a .310 to .335 edge on Velazquez in the former stat and a 29 to 71 edge in the latter. Like I said, he's too good to send down. It's a numbers game and Workman's option has already been burned.
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Post by ponch73 on Jul 28, 2018 19:32:07 GMT -5
Old friend Jalen Beeks giving up 4 runs to the Orioles in 2 innings of work thus far. 4 hits, 2 walks, 0 K's.
To be fair, Beeks wasn't really giving up a lot of hard contact.
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Post by carmenfanzone on Jul 29, 2018 14:12:33 GMT -5
After the first 7 innings of Eovaldi's Red Sox career, I am going to go out on a limb and say I like the trade! At least it is clear why DD thought the trade was a good idea.
After today, I would be surprised if Eovaldi was not one of the starters should the Red Sox have a playoff series with either New York or Houston and all of their right hand hitters.
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