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Coronavirus thread tangent
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Post by rjp313jr on Apr 10, 2020 14:14:24 GMT -5
I don't get why someone would want Trump over Biden for the purpose of resetting in 2024. Biden is a one term President, if he even makes it one term. Does anyone really think he's not suffering from some sort of dementia at this point? The guy can't even talk for more than 3 minutes at a time.
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manfred
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Post by manfred on Apr 10, 2020 14:22:08 GMT -5
I don't get why someone would want Trump over Biden for the purpose of resetting in 2024. Biden is a one term President, if he even makes it one term. Does anyone really think he's not suffering from some sort of dementia at this point? The guy can't even talk for more than 3 minutes at a time. It does seem to be a race between two very diminished minds. And neither was ever the brightest bulb, so.... |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 10, 2020 14:28:37 GMT -5
I'm really getting tired of politics, maybe it's because Bernie has officially lost and the DNC is setting us up for "just settle for Joe" (whose been accused of sexual assault after the party championed being on the side of women and tore down a Supreme Court nominee and Trump) vs Trump who had a great economy going for him (and remarkably, has rebounded nicely despite still being in crisis), but is appallingly disrespectful, spreads disinformation, and was woefully underprepared for this virus. To me, the plus side to voting for Trump is to, once again, try again in 4 years with a new progressive candidate rather than wait 8 years. The aspect of that makes me want to poke my eyes out. Not even so much because of Trump. The unreasonable love and hate for him is so over the top it's frustrating. I want to see both sides lose and hate the idea one of them are going to be declared a winning in November. If I had to hedge my bets, the DNC picking Joe as the most "electable candidate" is incredibly devoid of better judgement. Biden can't invigorate a base like Trump can and the whole message being pushed is, "don't vote for Trump". It's never, "Biden is our guy! We need Biden's vision and policy!" It's a campaign based on fear mongering with no forward direction. Now, we're getting into the conversation of abortion in a coronavirus thread. To which, I say, it's no my body, it's not my soul, I wouldn't favor it, but I'm not going to tell someone else what they can and can't do. I'm not religious, the world already has too many people, unwanted children have much staggering number of homelessness and lower education. It's rare you see an unadopted child go on to becoming a world class surgeon or doctor. I think there should be limitations as to what that is. A woman whose a week away from having a baby and starts having second thoughts shouldn't be allowed to go in and get one. Whatever the reasonable length of time is to figure out you're pregnant, give about 2-3 weeks after that and then if you haven't decided by then, that's your own fault. I think anyone who calls the morning after pill an abortion is frankly, bat poop insane. That's my personal two cents on the matter. I do find it ironic that there's a large group of "pro-lifers" that are willing to sacrifice the elderly and the immune compromised in the name of the economy. I think I just needed to vent. You and I likely overlap a lot, except I really bristle at the argument that the DNC or some other cabal shut out Bernie. He has run twice, and twice he has gotten creamed in a democratic process. He, like Trump, has a firm grip on a solid minority. But even more than Trump, he has failed to convince the non-converts to go along with him. I was a Warren supporter, and I am far left. I like AOC. I would NEVER support Bernie. I think he is myopically focused on a few issues (that matter!) but he overlooks too many others. But worst of all, he seems entitled. Last cycle, he did well with some groups in the Dem tent, but really failed with others, like African Americans. In the four years since, he did nothing to expand his appeal. He never contacted Jim Clyburn, for example. That is arrogant, and it demonstrates really poor leadership. In the end, Bernie gas been around forever, and he has never accomplished anything. If we want progressive goals, we need people who can convince non-progressives. He couldn’t even convince all progressives! Biden is a big snooze, but I’ll take competence right now. Hopefully he picks a strong VP, elevates her to prominence, and charts a path towards the future. Really? Sanders was leading, polls predicted him to win Super Tuesday. Then right before two candidates drop out and endorse Biden, who then wins big. I kept saying why drop out right before if you went that far and already spent the money. The answer became very clear, so Biden could win against Sanders. I also have to laugh at someone who says he like AOC and Warren, but not Sanders. Those are the two closest Democrats to Sanders in Congress. He's the teacher and they're his students! Nevermind AOC is maybe the least qualified person in the History of Congress. She has an opinion on everything, yet litterally knows nothing! |
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Post by rjp313jr on Apr 10, 2020 14:32:15 GMT -5
People dropping out doesn't amount to fixing things against Sanders. The DNC actively working against Sanders and making super delagates vote against him in 2016 was fixing things. This year that wasn't the case. It's like complaining it was unfair because Sanders can't beat Biden head to head he can only beat him if other people strip votes away from Biden.
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manfred
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Post by manfred on Apr 10, 2020 14:35:18 GMT -5
You and I likely overlap a lot, except I really bristle at the argument that the DNC or some other cabal shut out Bernie. He has run twice, and twice he has gotten creamed in a democratic process. He, like Trump, has a firm grip on a solid minority. But even more than Trump, he has failed to convince the non-converts to go along with him. I was a Warren supporter, and I am far left. I like AOC. I would NEVER support Bernie. I think he is myopically focused on a few issues (that matter!) but he overlooks too many others. But worst of all, he seems entitled. Last cycle, he did well with some groups in the Dem tent, but really failed with others, like African Americans. In the four years since, he did nothing to expand his appeal. He never contacted Jim Clyburn, for example. That is arrogant, and it demonstrates really poor leadership. In the end, Bernie gas been around forever, and he has never accomplished anything. If we want progressive goals, we need people who can convince non-progressives. He couldn’t even convince all progressives! Biden is a big snooze, but I’ll take competence right now. Hopefully he picks a strong VP, elevates her to prominence, and charts a path towards the future. Really? Sanders was leading, polls predicted him to win Super Tuesday. Then right before two candidates drop out and endorse Biden, who then wins big. I kept saying why drop out right before if you went that far and already spent the money. The answer became very clear, so Biden could win against Sanders. I also have to laugh at someone who says he like AOC and Warren, but not Sanders. Those are the two closest Democrats to Sanders in Congress. He's the teacher and they're his students! Nevermind AOC is maybe the least qualified person in the History of Congress. She has an opinion on everything, yet litterally knows nothing! Yes, people dropped out to support Biden. Why is that cheating? Why should candidates without a chance stay in? It is funny: people see a conspiracy because people dropped out. And people see a conspiracy in Warren staying in. Can’t it just be the way this works? I mean, Buttegieg was going to support Biden whenever he dropped out, so why NOT make a move that helps him? If the argument is that one part of the Democrats worked partly in coordination to beat a different part, I agree. But that is actually how Democracy works, no? I say this as a Warren supporter who probably would have put Bernie and Biden as my bottom two (of real candidates) to start this. |
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Post by incandenza on Apr 10, 2020 14:37:25 GMT -5
I don't get why someone would want Trump over Biden for the purpose of resetting in 2024. Biden is a one term President, if he even makes it one term. Does anyone really think he's not suffering from some sort of dementia at this point? The guy can't even talk for more than 3 minutes at a time. Personally, I would have loved Warren. I would have been happy with Sanders. But I was fully expecting some pretty generic Democrat to win. And there were so many of them! Booker, or Inslee, or Castro, or half a dozen others. Any of them would have been fine. But in their wisdom, the Democratic electorate chose... Well, manfred put it pretty well when he referred to voting for a potato. (One fun thing about Biden is that Obama chose him in 2008 in part because he figured he'd be too old to run for president in 2016 so his own ambitions wouldn't cause him to stir up any drama.) |
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manfred
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Post by manfred on Apr 10, 2020 14:41:10 GMT -5
You and I likely overlap a lot, except I really bristle at the argument that the DNC or some other cabal shut out Bernie. He has run twice, and twice he has gotten creamed in a democratic process. He, like Trump, has a firm grip on a solid minority. But even more than Trump, he has failed to convince the non-converts to go along with him. I was a Warren supporter, and I am far left. I like AOC. I would NEVER support Bernie. I think he is myopically focused on a few issues (that matter!) but he overlooks too many others. But worst of all, he seems entitled. Last cycle, he did well with some groups in the Dem tent, but really failed with others, like African Americans. In the four years since, he did nothing to expand his appeal. He never contacted Jim Clyburn, for example. That is arrogant, and it demonstrates really poor leadership. In the end, Bernie gas been around forever, and he has never accomplished anything. If we want progressive goals, we need people who can convince non-progressives. He couldn’t even convince all progressives! Biden is a big snooze, but I’ll take competence right now. Hopefully he picks a strong VP, elevates her to prominence, and charts a path towards the future. Really? Sanders was leading, polls predicted him to win Super Tuesday. Then right before two candidates drop out and endorse Biden, who then wins big. I kept saying why drop out right before if you went that far and already spent the money. The answer became very clear, so Biden could win against Sanders. I also have to laugh at someone who says he like AOC and Warren, but not Sanders. Those are the two closest Democrats to Sanders in Congress. He's the teacher and they're his students! Nevermind AOC is maybe the least qualified person in the History of Congress. She has an opinion on everything, yet litterally knows nothing! Well, laugh. But the fact is, a huge number of Warren supporters did not support Bernie. Lumping them together because they agree on a number of policies elides significant differences. One is temperament. Is anyone shocked that no one in the Senate like Bernie? Another difference is tactical. As I’ve said before, Warren actually spends time discussing how things work and how she’d fet them done. Bernie heaps program on top of program without any budget plan, and he has spent a career failing to create coalitions. In the end, I’d say Bernie is a campaigner who ignites 30% of the population but shows no sign of ever being able to govern. I actually think Warren could have. |
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manfred
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Post by manfred on Apr 10, 2020 14:44:03 GMT -5
I don't get why someone would want Trump over Biden for the purpose of resetting in 2024. Biden is a one term President, if he even makes it one term. Does anyone really think he's not suffering from some sort of dementia at this point? The guy can't even talk for more than 3 minutes at a time. Personally, I would have loved Warren. I would have been happy with Sanders. But I was fully expecting some pretty generic Democrat to win. And there were so many of them! Booker, or Inslee, or Castro, or half a dozen others. Any of them would have been fine. But in their wisdom, the Democratic electorate chose... Well, manfred put it pretty well when he referred to voting for a potato. (One fun thing about Biden is that Obama chose him in 2008 in part because he figured he'd be too old to run for president in 2016 so his own ambitions wouldn't cause him to stir up any drama.) Man, some of our area governors would have been good: Inslee is a great governor. Bullock could gave been solid. Hickenlooper. But all the blah technocrats/ generic white guys got swamped immediately by Biden’s legacy position and Pete-o-mania. I often look back at 2016 and think the mistake we made was not nominating O’Malley. He was the potato that would have crushed Trump. |
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Post by incandenza on Apr 10, 2020 14:51:56 GMT -5
Personally, I would have loved Warren. I would have been happy with Sanders. But I was fully expecting some pretty generic Democrat to win. And there were so many of them! Booker, or Inslee, or Castro, or half a dozen others. Any of them would have been fine. But in their wisdom, the Democratic electorate chose... Well, manfred put it pretty well when he referred to voting for a potato. (One fun thing about Biden is that Obama chose him in 2008 in part because he figured he'd be too old to run for president in 2016 so his own ambitions wouldn't cause him to stir up any drama.) Man, some of our area governors would have been good: Inslee is a great governor. Bullock could gave been solid. Hickenlooper. But all the blah technocrats/ generic white guys got swamped immediately by Biden’s legacy position and Pete-o-mania. I often look back at 2016 and think the mistake we made was not nominating O’Malley. He was the potato that would have crushed Trump. I've had the thought... what if O'Malley had just stayed in the race? Hillary was getting less and less popular as time went on, and in retrospect a lot of Bernie's vote was just anti-Hillary. If a third option were available, acceptable to numerous factions in the party... |
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Apr 10, 2020 14:52:37 GMT -5
I don't get why someone would want Trump over Biden for the purpose of resetting in 2024. Biden is a one term President, if he even makes it one term. Does anyone really think he's not suffering from some sort of dementia at this point? The guy can't even talk for more than 3 minutes at a time. What if Biden picks Klobuchar, or worse, Hillary Clinton? Even if Biden is a 1-term president, a progressive is facing the potential nightmare of 12 years instead of 4. This is a very confusing time for sure. I think Trump has done well with the economy and I can see some bright spots of his presidency. I refuse to believe he's just this complete villain. We've had very low unemployment and a rising market. I agreed with his trade dealing and combating China. His inaction against this virus caused this to become worse than it should have been, or at least, grown more slowly to give hospitals more time to prepare. I'm a big believe in global climate change and understand that he will destroy the Earth in order to enrich others. As of right now, I'm leaning Vermin Supreme because he's the tyrant I can trust. |
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Apr 10, 2020 14:55:33 GMT -5
Personally, I would have loved Warren. I would have been happy with Sanders. But I was fully expecting some pretty generic Democrat to win. And there were so many of them! Booker, or Inslee, or Castro, or half a dozen others. Any of them would have been fine. But in their wisdom, the Democratic electorate chose... Well, manfred put it pretty well when he referred to voting for a potato. (One fun thing about Biden is that Obama chose him in 2008 in part because he figured he'd be too old to run for president in 2016 so his own ambitions wouldn't cause him to stir up any drama.) Man, some of our area governors would have been good: Inslee is a great governor. Bullock could gave been solid. Hickenlooper. But all the blah technocrats/ generic white guys got swamped immediately by Biden’s legacy position and Pete-o-mania. I often look back at 2016 and think the mistake we made was not nominating O’Malley. He was the potato that would have crushed Trump. And that's why I despise the DNC. It's as if they tried to purposely anoint Hillary Clinton in 2016. The previous president of the DNC became her VP candidate. When she ran, then acting president was a former Hillary Clinton campaign advisor. |
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Post by rjp313jr on Apr 10, 2020 15:17:21 GMT -5
I kind of like Klobuchar so I’d be fine with that. Regardless, she wouldn’t be handed the Democrats nomination in 2024.
Remember when Governors used to be the best choices because they actually had experience running a complex Government? In today’s world of internet and national level politics - senators and congress people make themselves the news cycle setting them up for the popularity contest. It took this crisis to put some of them back on the Map so maybe 2024 will look different.
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manfred
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Post by manfred on Apr 10, 2020 15:26:39 GMT -5
I don't get why someone would want Trump over Biden for the purpose of resetting in 2024. Biden is a one term President, if he even makes it one term. Does anyone really think he's not suffering from some sort of dementia at this point? The guy can't even talk for more than 3 minutes at a time. What if Biden picks Klobuchar, or worse, Hillary Clinton? Even if Biden is a 1-term president, a progressive is facing the potential nightmare of 12 years instead of 4. This is a very confusing time for sure. I think Trump has done well with the economy and I can see some bright spots of his presidency. I refuse to believe he's just this complete villain. We've had very low unemployment and a rising market. I agreed with his trade dealing and combating China. His inaction against this virus caused this to become worse than it should have been, or at least, grown more slowly to give hospitals more time to prepare. I'm a big believe in global climate change and understand that he will destroy the Earth in order to enrich others. As of right now, I'm leaning Vermin Supreme because he's the tyrant I can trust. I believe he is a complete villain. It doesn’t matter if a broken clock is right twice a day. He has seriously diminished our institutions, eroded our place in the world, and, truthfully, he is human filth. He is a truly awful human being. Pathological. And to have Americans support so bad a person depresses me. I obviously have opposed many GOP presidents, but I didn’t think they were vile to the core. W. seems like a sweet guy, in many ways. His dad was a very admirable man on many levels. Reagan was... well... Reagan. Ford? C’mon. Who hates Ford? But having grown up in NY, I have spent a life watching Trump slime his way from fraud to fraud. He is actual scum. |
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Post by fenwaydouble on Apr 10, 2020 15:30:12 GMT -5
I don't get why someone would want Trump over Biden for the purpose of resetting in 2024. Biden is a one term President, if he even makes it one term. Does anyone really think he's not suffering from some sort of dementia at this point? The guy can't even talk for more than 3 minutes at a time. What if Biden picks Klobuchar, or worse, Hillary Clinton? Even if Biden is a 1-term president, a progressive is facing the potential nightmare of 12 years instead of 4. This is a very confusing time for sure. I think Trump has done well with the economy and I can see some bright spots of his presidency. I refuse to believe he's just this complete villain. We've had very low unemployment and a rising market. I agreed with his trade dealing and combating China. His inaction against this virus caused this to become worse than it should have been, or at least, grown more slowly to give hospitals more time to prepare. I'm a big believe in global climate change and understand that he will destroy the Earth in order to enrich others.
As of right now, I'm leaning Vermin Supreme because he's the tyrant I can trust.What alternative could possibly be worse than destroying the earth in order to enrich others? |
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Apr 10, 2020 15:42:17 GMT -5
Because this has now driven completely off the cliff and away from what could've been a viable topic in COVID-19, it is being closed.
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