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8/4-8/5 Red Sox @ Rays Series Thread
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 5, 2020 10:44:01 GMT -5
i get the righty / lefty matchup, but pinch hitting the struggling Chavis is like throwin a dadgum Hail Mary. He gets hits in two straight games, they then sit him. He's yet to face a right handed starter, the guys he did best against last year. We are going to ruin the guy using him like this. This is like Moreland only facing lefty specialist. Chavis isn't some lefty killer. Nevermind were not playing him at 2B, a position were his bat could be above average. It's like our manager never heard of advanced stats or even basic splits.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 5, 2020 11:08:18 GMT -5
i get the righty / lefty matchup, but pinch hitting the struggling Chavis is like throwin a dadgum Hail Mary. He gets hits in two straight games, they then sit him. He's yet to face a right handed starter, the guys he did best against last year. We are going to ruin the guy using him like this. This is like Moreland only facing lefty specialist. Chavis isn't some lefty killer. Nevermind were not playing him at 2B, a position were his bat could be above average. It's like our manager never heard of advanced stats or even basic splits. Roenicke does seem pretty old school. I get the sense that he was hired simply to bridge over until Bloom gets who he really wants. Probably figured some continuity for the clubhouse would be a good thing until he has the restraints taken off of him (by the luxury tax and by the fact that Cora got fired without warning - he didn't take the job expecting to have to let Cora go). I'm probably not telling you anything you don't already know. So I guess he's the perfect guy to help the Red Sox secure a high draft pick. 20-40, here we come.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 5, 2020 11:12:48 GMT -5
Our 3 guys with no control past this year, definitely, for best offer whatever that may be. Workman, Pillar, JBJ. Anyone else traded should be because it's beneficial to the longer term picture. Moreland? Let's see what Chavis can do and get Dalbec some playing time. Agree about Moreland, one year contract. The 3 I mentioned have 5+ years service time. For me, I'd trade Chavis because I don't see him as a long term regular and we have a ton of utility guys. He should bring a fairly decent return because he's cost controlled. That's my opinion though, your mileage probably varies. Lin, Marco, Chatham and/or Munoz would make decent pot sweeteners.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 5, 2020 11:28:44 GMT -5
Moreland? Let's see what Chavis can do and get Dalbec some playing time. Agree about Moreland, one year contract. The 3 I mentioned have 5+ years service time. For me, I'd trade Chavis because I don't see him as a long term regular and we have a ton of utility guys. He should bring a fairly decent return because he's cost controlled. That's my opinion though, your mileage probably varies. Lin, Marco, Chatham and/or Munoz would make decent pot sweeteners. It depends on what you can get. Like Quantrill from the Padres who have a huge hole at 2B and I'm willing to talk. I'm not just trading him to trade him either though. Much rather they actually let him play unless they can get starting pitching for him. We've seen this a million times, it takes some young guys some time to adjust. I still love Chavis upside with his bat, at 2B I think he could be a big weapon. It's different at 1B, the bar is much higher. With Jeter Downs yeah maybe it makes sense to deal him if you get the right offer. We have to get creative.
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Post by manfred on Aug 5, 2020 11:32:23 GMT -5
I like Chavis, and I especially like him if he can field an adequate 2B.... but I am starting to worry a lot about his swinging and missing. He just seems too easy to strike out, too many holes. I am not sure the good results will come enough to make up for it.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 5, 2020 11:56:27 GMT -5
I like Chavis, and I especially like him if he can field an adequate 2B.... but I am starting to worry a lot about his swinging and missing. He just seems too easy to strike out, too many holes. I am not sure the good results will come enough to make up for it. Alright I'm going to give JimEd14 his props here. I now think he was correct about Chavis. I figured he could hit the high fastball in the minors and would just need an adjustment period. I didn't want to be of the mindset that because his numbers sucked re: that in his first taste in the majors that he couldn't adjust. So far I haven't seen much adjustment. Of course, with the erratic way Roenicke is using him we might never find out. Like UMass said, he could be an asset as a 2b, but as a 1b, he probably won't hit well enough to hold down the job on a team that wants to compete for the division.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Aug 5, 2020 12:43:42 GMT -5
If Chavis is not getting the right kind of playing time, I would give people the benefit of the doubt on that argument. However, players need to perform when they are in there. This goes back to last year and absent his torrid start, he hasn't shown he is capable.
On this team, with the state of the franchise state, he should be given as much chance as possible, but he has to hit. It appears as though his defense is adequate. Remember, they had a choice for him at 2B and brought in someone else.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 5, 2020 12:56:15 GMT -5
Chavis hit .809 OPS against RH starters last year, he hit .674 OPS against LH starters. Yet this year it's only LH starters he's facing.
Baseball is about confidence and getting going. Chavis has had epic hot streaks in the minors many times.
The season is just about over, so no reason not to actually let the guy play everyday and see how he does. Give him ABs against the guys he does best against and see what happens.
The guy needs to adjust, yet that only happens with playing time and putting him in situations were he has a good chance of doing well. He's not going to have a .188 BAPIP for the year either.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 5, 2020 13:13:34 GMT -5
Peraza career splits are .663 versus RH, .735 LH. Against RH starters .654 versus LH starters .752
If you wanted a platoon that made sense, you platoon Chavis and Peraza at 2B.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 5, 2020 14:01:13 GMT -5
Chavis hit .809 OPS against RH starters last year, he hit .674 OPS against LH starters. Yet this year it's only LH starters he's facing. Baseball is about confidence and getting going. Chavis has had epic hot streaks in the minors many times. The season is just about over, so no reason not to actually let the guy play everyday and see how he does. Give him ABs against the guys he does best against and see what happens. The guy needs to adjust, yet that only happens with playing time and putting him in situations were he has a good chance of doing well. He's not going to have a .188 BAPIP for the year either. Chavis will never get off the ground if he is the short end of a platoon. He's too young to be pidgeon holed like that. He needs to play every day. He should play 1b against lefties and 2b against righties with Moreland getting 1b against righties and Peraza going against lefties. If then, he doesn't get into a rhythm then you wind up asking yourself will he be part of the next Red Sox team that seriously competes or will he be somebody else's project/treasure? I'd like to see him play 2b the bulk of the time and see if he can bridge it until Downs is ready. With Peraza what you see is what you get. Even if his mechanical adjustments lead to a reasonable batting average the guy will simply still not get on base. He's too hack-tastic for that.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 5, 2020 14:26:51 GMT -5
I agree 100%, just looking for ways that make more sense than the current plan.
Is our GM all about his guys and making moves that make him look good? Long-term it's certainly better for this team to see if Chavis can play 2B than Peraza.
We haven't seen Houck or Shawaryn yet, just guys Bloom brought in. Okay we tried, it didn't work out. Let's see some young guys, they can't be any worse than what we are currently playing. Let's see Chatham and Dalbec when he's ready. It's time to start preparing for the future, not playing to win.
We are now playing to reset and get a high pick.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 5, 2020 14:49:26 GMT -5
Chavis last year: 4/20-5/22: 123 PA, .283/.382/.585, 26.0% K rate 5/23-8/11: 259 PA, .241/.293/.382, 36.7% K rate
He needs to play his way into more playing time than he's getting, if we're being honest. Moreland was brought back specifically because Chavis hadn't earned the full-time 1B gig.
If anything, he's in danger of losing his roster spot to Dalbec (or at the cutdown to 28). I think it speaks volumes that Dalbec was brought to Tampa on the taxi squad.
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Post by alexcorahomevideo on Aug 5, 2020 14:51:09 GMT -5
The offense on this team is actually fine. The pitching staff needs to be blown up. Everyone needs to go. As a result, you're probably looking at trading JD for some talented pitching prospects. I'm not even sure that this season is going to give everyone enough time to make a deal at the deadline. But one thing is for certain, the Sox will be a solid contender for #1 pick.
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Post by manfred on Aug 5, 2020 15:00:02 GMT -5
The offense on this team is actually fine. The pitching staff needs to be blown up. Everyone needs to go. As a result, you're probably looking at trading JD for some talented pitching prospects. I'm not even sure that this season is going to give everyone enough time to make a deal at the deadline. But one thing is for certain, the Sox will be a solid contender for #1 pick. I don’t think the offense is fine. Let’s stipulate Devers should return to stud status. Nonetheless, there are basically four strong spots: X, JDM, Devers, and CVaz. The rest are either known to be meh (Moreland, JBJ, eg) or wait-and-see, especially Benny and Verdugo. As I’ve said before, they badly need to upgrade a few of those 5 positions. Not to be contradictory, but I think trading JDM (if the haul proves good of course) makes a ton of sense. The Devers/X core might go to waste for a couple years, but they are young enough to have a serious 3-year rebuild.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 5, 2020 15:09:58 GMT -5
Chavis last year: 4/20-5/22: 123 PA, .283/.382/.585, 26.0% K rate 5/23-8/11: 259 PA, .241/.293/.382, 36.7% K rate He needs to play his way into more playing time than he's getting, if we're being honest. Moreland was brought back specifically because Chavis hadn't earned the full-time 1B gig. If anything, he's in danger of losing his roster spot to Dalbec (or at the cutdown to 28). I think it speaks volumes that Dalbec was brought to Tampa on the taxi squad. Honestly, I want them to trade Moreland for anything they can and play Chavis and Dalbec regularly. This is another lost season and we need to see if Chavis can turn anything around before year's end. I want to see what we have with Dalbec. Anyone with a modicum of potential should get reps if the team feels they're close to getting a promotion anyways. I don't have much faith in Chavis anymore, but anyone with age on their side I'd like to try while getting value for any veteran they can.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 5, 2020 15:09:59 GMT -5
I think the plan needs to be to compete in 21 and 22.
Bogaerts and Sale have 2022 opt outs.
ERod is a free agent after 2021.
Vazquez, Benintendi, Eovaldi are free agents after 2022. So is JDM if he doesn't opt out.
Devers is a FA after 2023.
Now isn't the time to blow it up. The pitching is bad but that's in large part (not entirely though, for sure) due to rotten luck. 2022 might be, or at least to remake the roster.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 5, 2020 15:15:52 GMT -5
By the way, in case anyone missed it, Shawaryn and Dalbec joined Bandy on the taxi squad for this series and are in St. Pete.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 5, 2020 15:17:03 GMT -5
The offense on this team is actually fine. The pitching staff needs to be blown up. Everyone needs to go. As a result, you're probably looking at trading JD for some talented pitching prospects. I'm not even sure that this season is going to give everyone enough time to make a deal at the deadline. But one thing is for certain, the Sox will be a solid contender for #1 pick. I think the offense is kind of top heavy. I mean, who's above average? There's X, Devers, and JDM, and that's about it. Moreland is a nice platoon player. Vazquez is a good offensive catcher so I guess I should include him. The jury is out on Verdugo at the moment although he could become one. Benintendi hasn't been one for awhile. 2b is a mess. Bradley has always been below average. JDM has an opt out. Hard to think you'd get much value in a trade for him with the possibility that he doesn't play long for the acquiring team. They're not going to get much at the deadline unless somebody does something very, very stupid.
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Post by manfred on Aug 5, 2020 15:23:15 GMT -5
I think the plan needs to be to compete in 21 and 22. Bogaerts and Sale have 2022 opt outs. ERod is a free agent after 2021. Vazquez, Benintendi, Eovaldi are free agents after 2022. So is JDM if he doesn't opt out. Devers is a FA after 2023. Now isn't the time to blow it up. The pitching is bad but that's in large part (not entirely though, for sure) due to rotten luck. 2022 might be, or at least to remake the roster. I’m not sure many of these are so bad. I’d trade JDM before he opts out. I’d chance it with Sale (can’t both hate his contract AND be worried he opts out). Benny is hardly looking irreplaceable. I guess I’d suggest this as a middle ground: I’d make the #1 priority extending X and Devers. Next, I’d try to extend CVaz at a reasonable rate. Then, rebuild. Risk the rest. Edit: oh, and I also don’t mean long term. Could compete in ‘22, potentially. ‘23 for sure. But next season? Hard to imagine how they can fill the pitching holes in a responsible way.
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Post by jdb on Aug 5, 2020 15:55:46 GMT -5
I think the plan needs to be to compete in 21 and 22. Bogaerts and Sale have 2022 opt outs. ERod is a free agent after 2021. Vazquez, Benintendi, Eovaldi are free agents after 2022. So is JDM if he doesn't opt out. Devers is a FA after 2023. Now isn't the time to blow it up. The pitching is bad but that's in large part (not entirely though, for sure) due to rotten luck. 2022 might be, or at least to remake the roster. I’d be open to trading Benintendi for help and signing his replacement or even taking a contract off of a small market team. Ozuna is in Atlanta on a 1 year deal and could be perfect since he wouldn’t cost a pick like Springer would. Maybe Vazquez too but I’m not sure I want to sign a Realmuto to a long term deal and lose a pick but that could be lessened by the CV return. I’d ride out JDM and take his draft slot money if he walks.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 5, 2020 16:10:50 GMT -5
Chavis last year: 4/20-5/22: 123 PA, .283/.382/.585, 26.0% K rate 5/23-8/11: 259 PA, .241/.293/.382, 36.7% K rate He needs to play his way into more playing time than he's getting, if we're being honest. Moreland was brought back specifically because Chavis hadn't earned the full-time 1B gig. If anything, he's in danger of losing his roster spot to Dalbec (or at the cutdown to 28). I think it speaks volumes that Dalbec was brought to Tampa on the taxi squad. I'm kinda over people doing that because month by month tells a much different story. His injury in August tanked his numbers. Everyone wants to take away his hot streak, yet act like him playing injured didn't tank his August numbers. 1.061 OPS, .788, .730, .786 and .456 OPS in August. The only month he didn't hit enough for 2B is August while injured. 1B is a different story, yet given Peraza I don't get that. That guy is going to struggle to even have a .730 OPS for a month. So I agree he's not ready for 1B, but he did prove he can hit enough for 2B, it wasn't just one hot streak and then he sucked. The guy they need to move is Moreland. I get why they signed him, yet we aren't going anywhere and he's 34 years old. Time to get ready for next year.
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Post by DesignatedForAssignment on Aug 5, 2020 16:25:33 GMT -5
Peraza in LF tonite.
The turf is new to him ... and the white roof. I wish him the best.
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Post by manfred on Aug 5, 2020 16:27:05 GMT -5
Peraza in LF tonite. The turf is new to him ... and the white roof. I wish him the best. At least we got, er, his stick in there? Rockin’ the career 80 OPS+!
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 5, 2020 16:35:48 GMT -5
Peraza in LF tonite. The turf is new to him ... and the white roof. I wish him the best. At least we got, er, his stick in there? Rockin’ the career 80 OPS+! I was worried they'd think he's better than he is and play him too much.
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Post by juanfatj on Aug 5, 2020 17:13:08 GMT -5
Pillar CF, Devers 3B, Martinez DH, Bogaerts SS, Vázquez C, Chavis 1B, Verdugo RF, Peraza LF, Araúz 2B
Pérez P
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