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2020 midseason national rankings
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 5, 2020 8:57:19 GMT -5
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 5, 2020 8:58:35 GMT -5
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Post by stevedillard on Aug 5, 2020 9:06:20 GMT -5
Apart from the limited spring training, and then the handful of players who made summer training, has there been any way to evaluate the prospects? For example, are draftees like Yorke and Jordan, or other lower minor leaguers like Jimenez scrimmaging?
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 5, 2020 9:17:36 GMT -5
In their initial article, MLB (Callis) said that because of the limited exposure that they pretty much only added the new players to the existing lists. They specifically said they avoided wholesale changes.
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Post by Addam603 on Aug 6, 2020 10:38:03 GMT -5
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Post by James Dunne on Aug 6, 2020 10:53:18 GMT -5
Having that many names in the near-miss/interesting category is really a testament to how much depth has returned to the system. We currently have Chatham ranked 14th and I don't think his prospect status is particularly different than it was when he ranked 5th, which was around the system's nadir. They aren't as strong as they could be at the very top, but I really do think their 5-14 range is in a pretty good place right now.
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Post by manfred on Aug 6, 2020 11:01:58 GMT -5
Having that many names in the near-miss/interesting category is really a testament to how much depth has returned to the system. We currently have Chatham ranked 14th and I don't think his prospect status is particularly different than it was when he ranked 5th, which was around the system's nadir. They aren't as strong as they could be at the very top, but I really do think their 5-14 range is in a pretty good place right now. This is so true. It is weird... seeing a 7-9 of Duran, Groome, Ward, and Houck screams “great system”! Those are some really exciting prospects. Groome looks like a future starter — whether front or back end, still a really solid rotation guy — Duran has huge upside etc. But then you think, man if that is the bottom half, how strong must 1-5 be... and it is, well, not that strong. I like Casas, but I am not thrilled with idea he is a number #1 guy. Mata may have a touch higher ceiling than Groome, but overall, they seem to be equal bets. Song... is not playing baseball? Really a strange moment for the system.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 6, 2020 11:23:25 GMT -5
Since 2019 sucked at the majors it is easy to forget what a great development year last year was. Guys like Mata and Duran looking like they are poised to take it up a notch, players out of nowhere like Jiminez and Rafaela (remember him ?), great reports from Ben Badler on a lot of our Dominican guys (both hitters and pitchers), Noah Song dominating the Premier 12 while Dalbec was probably the best player of the series and newbies like Lugo and Song.
A shame that we didn't get to see how all that turned out in 2020.
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Post by James Dunne on Aug 6, 2020 12:08:54 GMT -5
Agreed, lots of high-upside guys still in the lower minors who would've had great shots to really establish themselves this year. Even someone like Matthew Lugo, who had a pretty impressive start in the GCL but totally hit the wall in August and kinda got lost in the shuffle in the offseason conversation. Zeferjahn and Murphy had really nice debuts but were kind of overshadowed by Song.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 6, 2020 19:12:10 GMT -5
Add Ward & Aldo Ramirez.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 12, 2020 12:14:46 GMT -5
Alex Speier @alexspeier · 43m At midseason, @baseballamerica ranks the Red Sox with the No. 23 farm system. Casas (75), Dalbec (83), and Downs (93) crack the top 100.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 12, 2020 12:46:14 GMT -5
That's down from 20, apparently based on the draft alone.
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Post by manfred on Aug 13, 2020 10:25:28 GMT -5
Just a broader question about rankings and projections: looking at the updated profile of Noah Song, I am stoked to see a potential plus plus fastball and above average secondaries. But he is listed as a ceiling of 3/4. I don’t necessarily object, since, hell, a legit 3 would be awesome. But with his potential arsenal, I am wondering what it takes to have a ceiling of 1/2? At least two plus-to-better pitches? Again... not a complaint or whining that this guy is undervalued... just a question about how guys are put on the scale.
And just out of curiosity... was Clemens the last Sox prospect who had a 1/2 ceiling?
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Post by fenwaydouble on Aug 13, 2020 10:32:49 GMT -5
Just a broader question about rankings and projections: looking at the updated profile of Noah Song, I am stoked to see a potential plus plus fastball and above average secondaries. But he is listed as a ceiling of 3/4. I don’t necessarily object, since, hell, a legit 3 would be awesome. But with his potential arsenal, I am wondering what it takes to have a ceiling of 1/2? At least two plus-to-better pitches? Again... not a complaint or whining that this guy is undervalued... just a question about how guys are put on the scale. And just out of curiosity... was Clemens the last Sox prospect who had a 1/2 ceiling? People were definitely talking that way about Espinoza a few years ago, albeit with the caveat that he was far away and could get hurt.
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Post by ajs1994 on Aug 13, 2020 11:06:12 GMT -5
Just a broader question about rankings and projections: looking at the updated profile of Noah Song, I am stoked to see a potential plus plus fastball and above average secondaries. But he is listed as a ceiling of 3/4. I don’t necessarily object, since, hell, a legit 3 would be awesome. But with his potential arsenal, I am wondering what it takes to have a ceiling of 1/2? At least two plus-to-better pitches? Again... not a complaint or whining that this guy is undervalued... just a question about how guys are put on the scale. And just out of curiosity... was Clemens the last Sox prospect who had a 1/2 ceiling? People were definitely talking that way about Espinoza a few years ago, albeit with the caveat that he was far away and could get hurt. Buchholz was a top 5-10 prospect in all of baseball, he was considered to have 1/2 potential.
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Post by manfred on Aug 13, 2020 11:18:54 GMT -5
People were definitely talking that way about Espinoza a few years ago, albeit with the caveat that he was far away and could get hurt. Buchholz was a top 5-10 prospect in all of baseball, he was considered to have 1/2 potential. Oh! Good one. That’s right! I’d forgotten about how highly regarded he was. It is also sometimes easy to forget how awesome he was for pretty prolonged stretches.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 13, 2020 11:25:15 GMT -5
Kopech had an Ace ceiling, it's just crazy rare that you'd project that. Projections look at ceiling and floor.
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Post by manfred on Aug 13, 2020 11:33:11 GMT -5
Kopech had an Ace ceiling, it's just crazy rare that you'd project that. Projections look at ceiling and floor. I meant ceiling only. I was just trying to remember guys who were even dreamed to be future aces... and what set them apart.
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Post by James Dunne on Aug 18, 2020 9:27:37 GMT -5
It also depends if you considered Matsuzaka a prospect. But if you're talking ceiling only, then yeah: Buchholz, Kopech, Espinoza, Lester, arguably Groome, Pavano, maybe Rose (though Pavano had passed him in regard by the time their prospect status peaked, it turns out for good reason), Frankie Rodriguez (BA had him #9 overall in '92).
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Post by manfred on Aug 18, 2020 9:35:01 GMT -5
It also depends if you considered Matsuzaka a prospect. But if you're talking ceiling only, then yeah: Buchholz, Kopech, Espinoza, Lester, arguably Groome, Pavano, maybe Rose (though Pavano had passed him in regard by the time their prospect status peaked, it turns out for good reason), Frankie Rodriguez (BA had him #9 overall in '92). Forgot about Pavano. Good one. I was a bit young with Frankie Rodriguez, but I remember the hushed whispers of greatness.
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Post by RedSoxStats on Aug 31, 2020 18:24:27 GMT -5
Seabold was just added to Fangraphs ranking, rating as an arrow up 40 FV.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 31, 2020 20:00:30 GMT -5
He wasn't on their Phillies list. Something tells me multiple people told Longenhagen he was wrong not to have him in there in the first place.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Sept 10, 2020 12:00:33 GMT -5
Q & A with Keith Law on the Sox farm system: theathletic.com/2048383/2020/09/10/keith-law-red-sox-farm-system/?source=dailyemailSome items.. Still views Downs as our top prospect. Didn't mention Casas except in passing Doesn't view Mata or Houck as starters and likes Ward better than either Thinks Duran's power is probably legit because of the swing change but wants to see it live. No list but has Seabold at back of top 10,Rosario back of top 20 and Botts in the low 20's He seems to like Groome, Song and Ward as future legit MLB starters He doesn't see any of the catchers as future starters
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Post by soxin8 on Sept 10, 2020 16:40:38 GMT -5
If Dalbec keeps his rookie status, under 130 plate appearances, I wonder what he might move up to.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 10, 2020 23:27:44 GMT -5
If Dalbec keeps his rookie status, under 130 plate appearances, I wonder what he might move up to. He's at 39. They have 15 games left for him to get 91 plate appearances, so I don' think that's happening. The thing is, while he's homering at about as prodigious a rate as you can hope for, he's also striking out at a nearly 50% rate. Something is going to give one way or another here. The next 15 games will be worth watching to see what direction he trends in.
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