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5/14-5/16 Red Sox vs. Angels Series Thread
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Post by julyanmorley on May 15, 2021 13:23:05 GMT -5
Everyone knows Franchy played himself out of the big leagues. He's still on the roster because of awkward timing. All the semi-reasonable major league position players on the 40 man roster are already in the majors. Santana is his likely replacement, but the Red Sox are giving him practice ABs in the minors. Munoz is also a reasonable replacement, but you don't want to add him to the 40 man just so Sanatana can take his spot five days later.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on May 15, 2021 13:43:12 GMT -5
I saw 1 game live with Dalbec in AA, was 2019. He was knocking it around the park that day and it was with such ease that I couldn't help but dream. That kind of easy power; just is a riot to watch.
I know there has been some bad luck and underperformance, but i feel like he has to get 1k ML at-bats before any decision is even considered. Short of a Franchy implosion, the Sox need to stick with him. If we end up holding out too long and Cases forces him out and we have no trade value because he never progressed, then I am OK with that.
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cdj
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Post by cdj on May 15, 2021 13:50:50 GMT -5
I mean, you can, it’s just a sign of mental illness if you can’t stop trashing a guy who isn’t playing in a game day thread By all means if he does something in the game then complain away. I don’t fundamentally understand the need to take potshots at the guy when he’s not relevant to the game at hand. It seems like people are actively rooting against him or taking pride in his failures. It’s bizarre. It's a sign of mental illness if you want the best 25 man roster a team can have? No it’s a sign of mental illness to have to dunk on somebody completely irrelevant to the game at hand in a game day thread. This isn’t difficult to comprehend
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Post by soxinsf on May 15, 2021 13:56:39 GMT -5
OK. How about now? Franchy starting in LF, Marwin at 2B, and Chavis sits despite the fact that Franchy needs to go down and Chavis needs constant at bats.
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Post by julyanmorley on May 15, 2021 14:19:06 GMT -5
OK. How about now? Franchy starting in LF, Marwin at 2B, and Chavis sits despite the fact that Franchy needs to go down and Chavis needs constant at bats. I don't think I'll get a lot of support on this, but here on May 15, 2021 I think I'd still rather have Franchy up there vs a RHP than Chavis.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 15, 2021 14:25:30 GMT -5
It's a sign of mental illness if you want the best 25 man roster a team can have? No it’s a sign of mental illness to have to dunk on somebody completely irrelevant to the game at hand in a game day thread. This isn’t difficult to comprehend So wanting at minimum a bench OF that's good at OF D is irrelevant? Someone to take over for Martinez late in games? I don't know about you, yet if I was a coach I'd want to remove Martinez up one run after he just batted for the better D in the 9th. The bench is relevant to any game. Bringing mental illness into this is crazy and frankly totally uncalled for.
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Post by unitspin on May 15, 2021 14:26:23 GMT -5
I saw 1 game live with Dalbec in AA, was 2019. He was knocking it around the park that day and it was with such ease that I couldn't help but dream. That kind of easy power; just is a riot to watch. I know there has been some bad luck and underperformance, but i feel like he has to get 1k ML at-bats before any decision is even considered. Short of a Franchy implosion, the Sox need to stick with him. If we end up holding out too long and Cases forces him out and we have no trade value because he never progressed, then I am OK with that. What? Casas, the guy that only plays 1b and is two years away. Franchy already has no trade value and has imploded already.
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Post by unitspin on May 15, 2021 14:32:16 GMT -5
No it’s a sign of mental illness to have to dunk on somebody completely irrelevant to the game at hand in a game day thread. This isn’t difficult to comprehend So wanting at minimum a bench OF that's good at OF D is irrelevant? Someone to take over for Martinez late in games? I don't know about you, yet if I was a coach I'd want to remove Martinez up one run after he just batted for the better D in the 9th. The bench is relevant to any game. Bringing mental illness into this is crazy and frankly totally uncalled for. It's is uncalled for but it seems the moderators allow ppl like cdj to run around name calling and insulting ppl bcs they have diff takes then them. Maybe its about time they get a little side conference about what is acceptable behavior on the board.
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manfred
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Post by manfred on May 15, 2021 14:52:28 GMT -5
OK. How about now? Franchy starting in LF, Marwin at 2B, and Chavis sits despite the fact that Franchy needs to go down and Chavis needs constant at bats. I mean... it is what it is. Chavis has had enough chance that I haven’t given up but am not burning anything down for sitting him. Is it ok if I just say... Marwin has been good at 2b? This is probably the best defensive alignment they can field? I’m down on Franchy, but I think it is that time when they are fully aware of the issue and will do what they must when they can. Until then, well, this is what we have. Anyway, if Renfroe and Dalbec are hitting — even some — they can afford Franchy. This is not what it was a few weeks ago when 6-9 was virtually an automatic out. All teams have a few weak spots. At the moment the Sox probably have fewer than most.
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Post by Smittyw on May 15, 2021 14:55:58 GMT -5
Ppl not wanting to see an awful player rolled out every couple games and doing nothing is not hate its kind of expected. This is the mlb if you can not cut it you shouldn't be giving the benefit of the doubt so the org can save face on a bad trade. Send him down and if he earns his way back then good if he doesn't bye bye. You really think that's what's going on here?
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Post by soxinjersey on May 15, 2021 15:02:03 GMT -5
OK. How about now? Franchy starting in LF, Marwin at 2B, and Chavis sits despite the fact that Franchy needs to go down and Chavis needs constant at bats. I don't think I'll get a lot of support on this, but here on May 15, 2021 I think I'd still rather have Franchy up there vs a RHP than Chavis. To me, the questions are: how do you treat players? and: What impact does this treatment have on the team as a whole? Chavis has played (moderately well) in a half-dozen games. The Angels are starting Quintana tomorrow, so he knows he will almost certainly start against him. My guess is that this leaves him mentally in a good space. Cordero, meanwhile, is struggling, as everyone knows, but the Sox seem to like him as a person and believe in his talent. Still, he hasn't played in the most recent games and is almost certainly headed to Worcester when Kiké or Arroyo comes off the IL, so today could be his last MLB game for a long while. What does it cost the Sox to give him one last chance before his exile? If he has a poor game, it won't be the first, but if he has a good one, and Chavis is on the top step of the dugout (as I would expect him to be) cheering him on, it will give Franchy, I imagine, a significant emotional boost, and I further imagine that the team as a whole would be energized by it. Managers/coaches take this kind of risk all the time. Players remember them when they pan out.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on May 15, 2021 15:08:01 GMT -5
The only position players you can call up in his place at present are Marcus Wilson and Conner Wong. But I don't disagree with your hypothesis that you're the only person who doesn't realize that. Independent of l’affaire Franchy, I wonder if/when Wilson might get a look? If someone gets hurt, maybe? He is on the 40, and has played ok. I guess I should rephrase: we’ve talked Duran, Santana, Munoz... where in the rotation of OF options does he fit? Just curious, because he was worth a 40 slot, is 24 (not old but at an age to get a shot) and sounds like he has tools that make him potentially valuable even if he struggles at the plate a bit... D, speed. Wilson's bat will have to carry him and there's no speed. He's slower than he looked.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on May 15, 2021 15:25:59 GMT -5
I mean, you can, itâs just a sign of mental illness if you canât stop trashing a guy who isnât playing in a game day thread By all means if he does something in the game then complain away. I donât fundamentally understand the need to take potshots at the guy when heâs not relevant to the game at hand. It seems like people are actively rooting against him or taking pride in his failures. Itâs bizarre. It's a sign of mental illness if you want the best 25 man roster a team can have? Right now the Sox are one man short of a body to construct even a 3-man bench. That's because they have three guys hurt or rehabbing. So, here is your choice: You can continue to let Franchy Cordero sit on his ass unless there's an emergency or big fat blowout (what you would do with him if he's still here), and then send him down to AAA as soon as Kiké or Arroyo are healthy, which would appear to be as soon as Tuesday. OR ... You can send Franchy down now and recall Marcus Wilson, interrupting a promising AAA season, and let him sit on his ass unless there's an emergency or an egregious blowout, and then send him back down to AAA within a matter of days (probably). Obviously the second choice is idiotic.
The thought of explaining this did occur to me, but I didn't think it was necessary, Because Obvious. And you know what? You're smart enough to have figured that out of you'd given it a moment's thought. But you chose not to.
It is true that it's not technically a form of mental illness to be so ruled by your emotions that you take 40 points off your functional IQ.
The only position players you can call up in his place at present are Marcus Wilson and Conner Wong. But I don't disagree with your hypothesis that you're the only person who doesn't realize that. Last time I checked, you could add guys to the 40 man roster. Speaking of which ... so now you're suggesting that we DFA Brandon Brennan and select Munoz, etc, to maybe play a game or two and then be DFA'd, with a solid chance that he'd claimed? Of course you're not suggesting that, because if you'd thought it through you would have seen that it made no sense, either.
Nor can you add Ockimey and then option him. We need to eventually add Santana, Brasier, Sale and Duran to the 40-man. Right now Brennan, Brice, and Brewer are all fungible relievers (what are the alphabetic odds of that?) and Mata can be recalled and placed on the 60-man IL (that's the last move, because at that point he gets MLB salary and it counts against the tax limit). There's no room to have marginal talents on option, not unless there's another 60-day IL trip.
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Post by julyanmorley on May 15, 2021 15:28:09 GMT -5
Bundy is throwing slop up there, how the hell does he have a better than 4-1 K/BB ratio on the year?
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manfred
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Post by manfred on May 15, 2021 15:28:34 GMT -5
Verdugo’s birthday. Maybe he can give us a present? Ahem.
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Post by Jimmy on May 15, 2021 15:31:02 GMT -5
Who asked if Verdugo would give us a birthday present? Wish granted.
Edit: Hat tip Manfred
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Post by Guidas on May 15, 2021 15:54:55 GMT -5
This Cordero infatuation is weird. You'd think this is the first time a marginal player with upside struggled and is likely to be demoted to improve upon his weaknesses. I'm disappointed Cordero hasn't produced, but in the end we're talking about 50 - 100 really bad ABs, not a bigger sample size. I'm not trying to say he hasn't played terribly, but I'm saying other players have come in and stunk up the joint just as bad. I would anticipate that once Santana is ready, Cordero will be headed to Worcester, but the incessant harping on him when he's not even playing is kind of weird. I was hoping he'd develop into a good strong half of a platoon player in LF and it's not out of the question that he might. You never know when a switch can turn something on. It's not like he doesn't have talent. Look at the switch that got turned on for Garrett Richards or Nick Pivetta. Maybe they can figure out something with him that can translate to results, but either way I'm not going to dump on him when he hasn't even played. It's not like he has some police record or attitude issue, or at least one we know about. I'm rooting for this kid to get his act together, get back up to the Red Sox and help out, whether it's him re-claiming an outfield spot or just coming up and contributing a key HR in a big game from off the bench or whatever. .150//.209/.188 is decidedly NOT marginal. It is sub-replacement level. The Sox should theoretically be able to take almost any average or above average AAA OF and get better production.
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jimoh
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Post by jimoh on May 15, 2021 15:57:30 GMT -5
Maybe it's just me, yet if a guy has a 13 OPS+ and a negative defensive bwar, I think you can bitch even if he's just on the bench. For me it depends on whether you think this is a site for insightful discussion of the team or for repetitive inane bitching and moaning.
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Post by Guidas on May 15, 2021 15:59:09 GMT -5
Am I a bad person to say that I would trade all top 10 Sox prospects for Trout?
Not that it would be enough, but still.
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jimoh
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Post by jimoh on May 15, 2021 16:03:27 GMT -5
It's a sign of mental illness if you want the best 25 man roster a team can have? Right now the Sox are one man short of a body to construct even a 3-man bench. That's because they have three guys hurt or rehabbing. So, here is your choice: You can continue to let Franchy Cordero sit on his ass unless there's an emergency or big fat blowout (what you would do with him if he's still here), and then send him down to AAA as soon as Kiké or Arroyo are healthy, which would appear to be as soon as Tuesday. OR ... You can send Franchy down now and recall Marcus Wilson, interrupting a promising AAA season, and let him sit on his ass unless there's an emergency or an egregious blowout, and then send him back down to AAA within a matter of days (probably). Obviously the second choice is idiotic.
The thought of explaining this did occur to me, but I didn't think it was necessary, Because Obvious. And you know what? You're smart enough to have figured that out of you'd given it a moment's thought. But you chose not to.
It is true that it's not technically a form of mental illness to be so ruled by your emotions that you take 40 points off your functional IQ.
Last time I checked, you could add guys to the 40 man roster. Speaking of which ... so now you're suggesting that we DFA Brandon Brennan and select Munoz, etc, to maybe play a game or two and then be DFA'd, with a solid chance that he'd claimed? Of course you're not suggesting that, because if you'd thought it through you would have seen that it made no sense, either.
Nor can you add Ockimey and then option him. We need to eventually add Santana, Brasier, Sale and Duran to the 40-man. Right now Brennan, Brice, and Brewer are all fungible relievers (what are the alphabetic odds of that?) and Mata can be recalled and placed on the 60-man IL (that's the last move, because at that point he gets MLB salary and it counts against the tax limit). There's no room to have marginal talents on option, not unless there's another 60-day IL trip.
I agree with most of this analysis, but why it’s peppered with words like “idiotic,” “Because Obvious,” “you chose not to” (which is never accurate) “mental illness” and “if you thought it through” is a puzzle to me.
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Post by Guidas on May 15, 2021 16:18:57 GMT -5
Need some here.
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Post by Guidas on May 15, 2021 16:26:21 GMT -5
Any one else sick of squanders?
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Post by Guidas on May 15, 2021 16:27:50 GMT -5
Fixed it for ya, y’all.
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Post by Guidas on May 15, 2021 16:29:11 GMT -5
Way to go Franchy.
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Post by unitspin on May 15, 2021 16:34:01 GMT -5
Ppl not wanting to see an awful player rolled out every couple games and doing nothing is not hate its kind of expected. This is the mlb if you can not cut it you shouldn't be giving the benefit of the doubt so the org can save face on a bad trade. Send him down and if he earns his way back then good if he doesn't bye bye. You really think that's what's going on here? The longer they keep him in the lineup, yes I do. He is not in the long-term plans of the team, why else would he be getting starts when he is well below average.
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