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Guidas
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Post by Guidas on Dec 11, 2021 12:40:28 GMT -5
Funny to me the link says he "shunned" the Red sox. It's stupid social media it likely means nothing. If anything it's probably a response to last week when some were pointing out how he was only following the Red sox. Guess with the lockout folks are going to try and drum up stories though. No, the social media thing is overblown. Still, I know he's supposedly earmarked for the Red Sox given the clean fit, but it's one of those things I won't believe until I see it. This is Bloom's first go around with trying to compete for a high profile free agent that's not of the bargain basement variety. I wonder how far he'll go to secure the player. I just remember the competition between the Sox and Yankees for players like Jose Contreras, Alex Rodriguez, Mark Teixeira, and Anthony Rizzo that looked bound for Boston but wound up in pinstripes instead. In some cases it was just as well. The only one that went Boston's way that I can remember is when the Sox got Moncada over the Yankees. I dont recall the Yankees having a great interest in Daisuke Matsuzaka.Doesn't mean Suzuki won't wind up in Boston, and I know there is a different Boston GM and different Yankee ownership, but I'm not going to count my chickens.. I do: www.nytimes.com/2006/11/14/sports/baseball/14chass.htmlabcnews.go.com/Business/IndustryInfo/story?id=2652117&page=1www.wthr.com/article/sports/red-sox-bid-511-million-for-matsuzaka/531-401e4523-25e7-4b11-98e7-a27a5a5579a4
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Dec 11, 2021 12:44:29 GMT -5
No, the social media thing is overblown. Still, I know he's supposedly earmarked for the Red Sox given the clean fit, but it's one of those things I won't believe until I see it. This is Bloom's first go around with trying to compete for a high profile free agent that's not of the bargain basement variety. I wonder how far he'll go to secure the player. I just remember the competition between the Sox and Yankees for players like Jose Contreras, Alex Rodriguez, Mark Teixeira, and Anthony Rizzo that looked bound for Boston but wound up in pinstripes instead. In some cases it was just as well. The only one that went Boston's way that I can remember is when the Sox got Moncada over the Yankees. I dont recall the Yankees having a great interest in Daisuke Matsuzaka.Doesn't mean Suzuki won't wind up in Boston, and I know there is a different Boston GM and different Yankee ownership, but I'm not going to count my chickens.. I do: www.nytimes.com/2006/11/14/sports/baseball/14chass.htmlabcnews.go.com/Business/IndustryInfo/story?id=2652117&page=1www.wthr.com/article/sports/red-sox-bid-511-million-for-matsuzaka/531-401e4523-25e7-4b11-98e7-a27a5a5579a4Ah...my memory failed. I remember they blew away the field with a 51.111 million dollar bid plus the posting fee. Thanks for the correction.
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Post by bosoxnation on Dec 11, 2021 17:23:16 GMT -5
If he’s signed we’re going to have almost no money left for our bullpen, i’m guessing everyone here is ok with that?
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Post by jimed14 on Dec 11, 2021 17:28:24 GMT -5
If he’s signed we’re going to have almost no money left for our bullpen, i’m guessing everyone here is ok with that? If they were going to have almost no money left, then they would not have bought prospects for JBJ's contract. Why would you assume that no one in the Red Sox organization can set up a budget and make an offseason plan to follow? They will go well beyond the previous luxury tax threshold or else Bloom would have a 0% job approval rating and be instantly fired. Can we give him the benefit of the doubt that he's not a total moron?
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Dec 11, 2021 17:31:19 GMT -5
If he’s signed we’re going to have almost no money left for our bullpen, i’m guessing everyone here is ok with that? How do you know what their budget is or what the luxury tax limit, if there is one, will be after the new CBA is ratified? They're not going to leave their bullpen unaddressed. Bloom has already mentioned the need for a couple of short relievers, so he'll get them eventually. Doubt he'd spend that much on them regardless. It's not like he's going to spend big bucks on Jansen. Doubt he trades for Kimbrel. It will be lower profiled, cheaper guys. It is likely that regardless if they sign Suzuki or not.
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Dec 11, 2021 17:49:30 GMT -5
If he’s signed we’re going to have almost no money left for our bullpen, i’m guessing everyone here is ok with that? If they were going to have almost no money left, then they would not have bought prospects for JBJ's contract. Why would you assume that no one in the Red Sox organization can set up a budget and make an offseason plan to follow? They will go well beyond the previous luxury tax threshold or else Bloom would have a 0% job approval rating and be instantly fired. Can we give him the benefit of the doubt that he's not a total moron? ^this. If Bloom had another mandate to stay under the luxury tax he would have non tendered renfroe or traded him for a bag of balls instead of buying two interesting lotto tickets to take jbj back. If somehow he does have that mandate than Bloom should be run out of town for the jbj/renfroe deal. How much money he actually does have to spend is anyone's guess but I'll take a stab at it and figure he's got another 30-35ish million to spend. Suzuki/other OF acquisition and two relievers should be attainable for that amount of money. It won't be a Jansen or a Kimbrel though.
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Post by bosoxnation on Dec 11, 2021 17:52:43 GMT -5
If he’s signed we’re going to have almost no money left for our bullpen, i’m guessing everyone here is ok with that? If they were going to have almost no money left, then they would not have bought prospects for JBJ's contract. Why would you assume that no one in the Red Sox organization can set up a budget and make an offseason plan to follow? They will go well beyond the previous luxury tax threshold or else Bloom would have a 0% job approval rating and be instantly fired. Can we give him the benefit of the doubt that he's not a total moron? I think Bloom thinks that we can get JBJ who is equal to Renfroe while a little more expensive so grab 2021s 3rd round pick since we lost our 2nd rounder is a no brainer.
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Dec 11, 2021 18:00:39 GMT -5
If they were going to have almost no money left, then they would not have bought prospects for JBJ's contract. Why would you assume that no one in the Red Sox organization can set up a budget and make an offseason plan to follow? They will go well beyond the previous luxury tax threshold or else Bloom would have a 0% job approval rating and be instantly fired. Can we give him the benefit of the doubt that he's not a total moron? I think Bloom thinks that we can get JBJ who is equal to Renfroe while a little more expensive so grab 2021s 3rd round pick since we lost our 2nd rounder is a no brainer. If Bloom thinks that then he didn't pay any attention to jbj this last year because he was one of if not the worst hitter in baseball. Therefore I don't believe that Bloom is going to bet on JBJ being anything more than a 4th OF health permitting for the rest of OF.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Dec 11, 2021 18:00:43 GMT -5
If they were going to have almost no money left, then they would not have bought prospects for JBJ's contract. Why would you assume that no one in the Red Sox organization can set up a budget and make an offseason plan to follow? They will go well beyond the previous luxury tax threshold or else Bloom would have a 0% job approval rating and be instantly fired. Can we give him the benefit of the doubt that he's not a total moron? I think Bloom thinks that we can get JBJ who is equal to Renfroe while a little more expensive so grab 2021s 3rd round pick since we lost our 2nd rounder is a no brainer. I dont think that Bloom thinks that. He probably figures that JBJ gives them a guy they can put in CF if Hernandez is needed at 2b. Doubt he thinks that Renfroe and JBJ are equals. It's not a slam dunk. It's a gamble, because if he doesn't get Suzuki or Schwarber, then it's possible they've downgraded from Renfroe to some lesser outfielder and perhaps the prospects amount to very little so they're on the hook for 17.5 million of a washed up JBJ. I'm not saying the above is going to happen, that Bloom can't upgrade RF and/or the prospects cant develop, particularly Binelas, who is the key to the deal, but to suggest that it's a no brainer seems ludicrous to me. I think the trade will work out, coupled with a RF upgrade, but it's not hard to see how it could fail or amount to very little.
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Post by baseball3 on Dec 11, 2021 20:00:27 GMT -5
If he’s signed we’re going to have almost no money left for our bullpen, i’m guessing everyone here is ok with that? I know it's the unpopular opinion because of bad results in the past, but I think it's more likely that the high end reliever the Sox get is through trade. Meaning he'll be cheaper than a free agent. The free agent market isn't great for bullpen options this year.
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Post by jmei on Dec 11, 2021 22:03:47 GMT -5
Let’s not rehash the Renfroe trade discussion in this thread. Thanks.
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Post by jimed14 on Dec 12, 2021 14:31:14 GMT -5
If they were going to have almost no money left, then they would not have bought prospects for JBJ's contract. Why would you assume that no one in the Red Sox organization can set up a budget and make an offseason plan to follow? They will go well beyond the previous luxury tax threshold or else Bloom would have a 0% job approval rating and be instantly fired. Can we give him the benefit of the doubt that he's not a total moron? I think Bloom thinks that we can get JBJ who is equal to Renfroe while a little more expensive so grab 2021s 3rd round pick since we lost our 2nd rounder is a no brainer. He would have gotten someone much cheaper than JBJ if he was worried about money.
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Post by jmei on Dec 12, 2021 14:36:43 GMT -5
Let’s not rehash the Renfroe trade discussion in this thread. Thanks.
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Post by jimed14 on Dec 12, 2021 14:57:45 GMT -5
Where can we talk about Suzuki, Bloom, Renfroe and JBJ then?
It's literally impossible to have conversations with people while hoping they bounce from thread to thread based on the topic even though they are all completely related.
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Post by jmei on Dec 12, 2021 15:04:52 GMT -5
There is a 22 page Renfroe/JBJ thread and, somehow, a separate 4 page thread. If you want to talk about that trade, do so there. You don’t have to reply to every opinion that you disagree with, especially in an unrelated thread.
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Post by baseball3 on Dec 14, 2021 5:13:17 GMT -5
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Post by baseball3 on Dec 16, 2021 23:24:01 GMT -5
Add another heavy spender to the Suzuki list. A West Coast team to boot. Huge geography advantage (and weather advantage). The Sox lost out to Kim last year to the Padres because of the weather and geography.
So yeah, going to be a bidding war for this guy.
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Post by baseball3 on Dec 17, 2021 0:00:13 GMT -5
If the Giants go 5 years 75-80 million for Suzuki, probably a good chance they land him. Makes a ton of sense for them too. Buster Posey right handed power replacement in the line-up.
I hope the Sox aren't banking on signing Suzuki.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Dec 17, 2021 1:20:11 GMT -5
If the Giants go 5 years 75-80 million for Suzuki, probably a good chance they land him. Makes a ton of sense for them too. Buster Posey right handed power replacement in the line-up. I hope the Sox aren't banking on signing Suzuki. I worry about that too. I think there's a lot of pressure on the Sox to sign him, but I don't see them going over the top in a frantic bidding war for Suzuki, which is what I expect to be the case. Wouldn't be shocked if the bidding got near or even reached 100 million. Other than Schwarber, none of the other options are that appealing. I don't see them spending big bucks on Bryant. Then you get to the level of guys who are about equal to Renfroe 2021 or potentially worse. I mean it's good to have two CF, but the idea of say JBJ in CF playing regularly and Kiké in RF isn't appealing, even if they spent the money on Story to play 2b (or have him at SS with X at 2b). I guess we'll see how far Bloom is willing to go (and if Suzuki is amenable to playing on the East coast in a cold weather environment) and if he's willing to outbid all those other teams. I think he's willing to go high, but I don't think it will be at all costs. Somewhere he has his limit.
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Post by baseball3 on Dec 17, 2021 2:20:00 GMT -5
If the Giants go 5 years 75-80 million for Suzuki, probably a good chance they land him. Makes a ton of sense for them too. Buster Posey right handed power replacement in the line-up. I hope the Sox aren't banking on signing Suzuki. I worry about that too. I think there's a lot of pressure on the Sox to sign him, but I don't see them going over the top in a frantic bidding war for Suzuki, which is what I expect to be the case. Wouldn't be shocked if the bidding got near or even reached 100 million. Other than Schwarber, none of the other options are that appealing. I don't see them spending big bucks on Bryant. Then you get to the level of guys who are about equal to Renfroe 2021 or potentially worse. I mean it's good to have two CF, but the idea of say JBJ in CF playing regularly and Kiké in RF isn't appealing, even if they spent the money on Story to play 2b (or have him at SS with X at 2b). I guess we'll see how far Bloom is willing to go (and if Suzuki is amenable to playing on the East coast in a cold weather environment) and if he's willing to outbid all those other teams. I think he's willing to go high, but I don't think it will be at all costs. Somewhere he has his limit. Yeah I just got confused by the confidence in this board when it came to signing Suzuki in the first place. Yeah trading Renfroe could lead you to that point, but Bloom wasn't hired to make big risks on questionable calls (Sale, Sandoval, Hanley, Rusney Castillo as examples). Suzuki falls into the later of a big risk with a questionable call at 100 million. I keep pushing for Correa, but at 300 million at age 27, that's less questionable. We know what Correa is. Plus, I know there's a 90 percent chance it won't happen. I'm in lala land sometimes when it comes to it. I just think it's a perfect fit. I like the idea of Suzuki, but even I would have my limits about him. Unless the Sox are 1000 percent sold on him being a impact MLB player, that's a lot of dough. We only knew about 2 other suiters at the time of the Suzuki interest at first. Now it's starting to leak out that a lot more teams are intrigued by 27 year old in his prime outfielder, with impact power (potentially). None of this was a slam dunk. Hope the Sox can land him at the best price, if they're sure of him.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Dec 17, 2021 2:44:03 GMT -5
It has been said before, by someone who goes by the call sign jerrygarciaparra, the love for Suzuki on this board is due in part to the current state of the team's outfield and the very misplaced notion that our GM is very smart and won't start the season with JBJ as a starting outfielder.
The actual risk of this player performing well in the major leagues is not mentioned very often. As has been said before, because the board is freaking out at JBJ being a starting outfielder for the club (an understandable reaction).
As has been said before, I would proceed with caution on this player based on the very direct evidence that great players from Japanese leagues are no gaurantee of success in MLB. That isn't a knock on their talent, but just commentary on how good MLB players are.
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Post by baseball3 on Dec 17, 2021 2:46:41 GMT -5
There's been 5 high profiled Asian players to come to the MLB that were able to pick the teams they wanted to go. Ichiro. Dice-K. Darvish were all forced to sign with the team that posted the highest amount in the old post system.
Ohtani. Kim. Matsui.
Matsui was signed when George Steinbrenner was throwing around money like candy back then.
Kim and Ohtani picked west coast teams. So the advantage there is definitely real.
I might be missing one signing somewhere in my memory, but the point still stands.
Add- Yup, I missed 2 signings. Yusei Kikuchi. Ryu.
One picked the Mariners. The other picked the Dodgers. West Coast teams. Again.
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Post by baseball3 on Dec 17, 2021 3:23:33 GMT -5
It has been said before, by someone who goes by the call sign jerrygarciaparra, the love for Suzuki on this board is due in part to the current state of the team's outfield and the very misplaced notion that our GM is very smart and won't start the season with JBJ as a starting outfielder. LOL ya last post of the night, but I get the feeling here that Bloom will be a genius even if JBJ is your starting RF. I'm saying this as a Bloom fan so far of his work, but not gullible or blind to Red Sox loyalty.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Dec 17, 2021 7:24:33 GMT -5
It has been said before, by someone who goes by the call sign jerrygarciaparra, the love for Suzuki on this board is due in part to the current state of the team's outfield and the very misplaced notion that our GM is very smart and won't start the season with JBJ as a starting outfielder. LOL ya last post of the night, but I get the feeling here that Bloom will be a genius even if JBJ is your starting RF. I'm saying this as a Bloom fan so far of his work, but not gullible or blind to Red Sox loyalty. I think it reasonable to think that JBJ could have a bounce back year. After all, it is hard to be much worse than he was last year. I see a situation, if the Suzuki thing doesn't work out, where JBJ gets the starts against left handed pitchers and Hernandez against righties to start the year. He can patiently see where the market goes during the season. The offense will still be good, you can overcome one lineup hiccup. My larger point is that, despite the nostradamus like qualities of the board, it isn't guaranteed that Bloom has to fill the spot left by Renfroe with another body, thereby making JBJ a 4th outfielder. It is a terrible use of resources to pay the 4th OF the millions of dollars he is getting, even understanding that that money was ostensibly for prospects not so much JBJ's talent. If JBJ somehow bounces back to league average and he got two prospects, you would have to classify that as a good trade. It is risky, JBJ has been awful for a long time at the plate. As far as Suzuki, I am all for getting good players. At the current market prices being quoted, well, that is a big step for Bloom. MY concern, as has been said before, is that transition into the ML game. It is very tough, as everyone knows.
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Post by greenmonster on Dec 17, 2021 9:08:40 GMT -5
For those who are more familiar with the terms of the lockout...
While Suzuki's signing window has been paused for the lockout, are negotiations still able to continue but just no formal signing? If teams are unable to negotiate with current MPBPA members, might Suzuki be seeing increased interest as a result since he is essentially the only player anyone can talk to, or did all of the recently rumored interest actually take place prior to the lockout?
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