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Post by blizzards39 on Aug 27, 2022 22:30:34 GMT -5
Who will be Red Sox starting Short Stop next season
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 27, 2022 23:33:21 GMT -5
Bobby Dalbec.
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Post by manfred on Aug 28, 2022 9:15:13 GMT -5
It is funny how the list makes resigning X so clearly vital. Swanson and Turner are staying put. Correa will cost even more. Move Story and you just push the hole to 2b.* I don’t see a good alternative to Xander.
*In theory you could move Story and go with my favorite hit monster, Arroyo. But he hasn’t proven he can make it through the year. And I think the fan base would riot.
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 13,852
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Post by cdj on Aug 28, 2022 9:21:30 GMT -5
It will either be Bogaerts, Story, or Correa imo
I’m thinking Xander returns on a deal a lot cheaper than what we would’ve expected in March
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Post by bellhorndingers21 on Aug 28, 2022 9:28:55 GMT -5
It is funny how the list makes resigning X so clearly vital. Swanson and Turner are staying put. Correa will cost even more. Move Story and you just push the hole to 2b.* I don’t see a good alternative to Xander. *In theory you could move Story and go with my favorite hit monster, Arroyo. But he hasn’t proven he can make it through the year. And I think the fan base would riot. Swanson and Turner staying put would also complicate things for Xander. Unless he's open to a position change or taking a Correa season to season deal with opt outs I'm having a hard time finding a team that could offer him SS and a long term commitment. I hope Xander resigns but I expect Nick Ahmed will be the annual contract with a prospect move.
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Post by keninten on Aug 28, 2022 9:29:22 GMT -5
It is funny how the list makes resigning X so clearly vital. Swanson and Turner are staying put. Correa will cost even more. Move Story and you just push the hole to 2b.* I don’t see a good alternative to Xander. *In theory you could move Story and go with my favorite hit monster, Arroyo. But he hasn’t proven he can make it through the year. And I think the fan base would riot. Why would the Braves resign Swanson with Vaughn Grissom ready?
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Post by manfred on Aug 28, 2022 9:46:48 GMT -5
It is funny how the list makes resigning X so clearly vital. Swanson and Turner are staying put. Correa will cost even more. Move Story and you just push the hole to 2b.* I don’t see a good alternative to Xander. *In theory you could move Story and go with my favorite hit monster, Arroyo. But he hasn’t proven he can make it through the year. And I think the fan base would riot. Why would the Braves resign Swanson with Vaughn Grissom ready? They’ve been in discussions.
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Aug 28, 2022 9:54:50 GMT -5
Why would the White Sox trade Tim Anderson?
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Post by Guidas on Aug 28, 2022 10:02:33 GMT -5
Does anyone legitimately think Swanson will improve or sustain a career-year performance for a 5-year deal? Anyone signing him will be disappointed if they're not expecting a 2.1 or so fWAR player. That's been his profile.
Turner is head and shoulders above him. Over the same period, he's averaged 4.36 fWAR and has been a lot more consistent.
Xander's averaged 3.62 fWAR since 2014, so his sample size is somewhat larger. He's 9 months older than Turner and a year and 4 months older than Swanson.
If Bloom wants to spend money elsewhere, he can move Story to SS and patch together a second baseman from Arroyo and whomever else they can find when Arroyo goes on his annual IL stints (Iglesias?). The shame here is Arroyo, who is one of Bloom's best pick-ups, would likely be an All Star or near All Star if he could put together a healthy season.
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Post by gregblossersbelly on Aug 28, 2022 10:28:11 GMT -5
It is funny how the list makes resigning X so clearly vital. Swanson and Turner are staying put. Correa will cost even more. Move Story and you just push the hole to 2b.* I don’t see a good alternative to Xander. *In theory you could move Story and go with my favorite hit monster, Arroyo. But he hasn’t proven he can make it through the year. And I think the fan base would riot. I would like to keep Xander. No set DH. Try to build a good bench and pinch hit when necessary. I voted no though. Boras will get X more $$$ somewhere else.
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Post by e on Aug 28, 2022 10:38:06 GMT -5
Does anyone legitimately think Swanson will improve or sustain a career-year performance for a 5-year deal? Anyone signing him will be disappointed if they're not expecting a 2.1 or so fWAR player. That's been his profile. Turner is head and shoulders above him. Over the same period, he's averaged 4.36 fWAR and has been a lot more consistent. Xander's averaged 3.62 fWAR since 2014, so his sample size is somewhat larger. He's 9 months older than Turner and a year and 4 months older than Swanson. If Bloom wants to spend money elsewhere, he can move Story to SS and patch together a second baseman from Arroyo and whomever else they can find when Arroyo goes on his annual IL stints (Iglesias?). The shame here is Arroyo, who is one of Bloom's best pick-ups, would likely be an All Star or near All Star if he could put together a healthy season. To add onto the Swanson concerns: pretty bad K%, Whiff%, below average BB%, along with this year being his best offensive season. And this season his offensive numbers are pretty comparable to Xander's career averages.
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steveofbradenton
Veteran
Watching Spring Training, the FCL, and the Florida State League
Posts: 1,823
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Post by steveofbradenton on Aug 28, 2022 10:42:44 GMT -5
I'm biased but I'd hopefully sign Xander for something like 6 years at 25 mill per year and keep him at short for 2-years. Mayer would then take over with Xander understanding he would move to 3rd. Devers HAS TO BE signed and will eventually move around 3rd, 1st, and DH. We may have to go to 8-years with Xander, but I'd rather not. But 8-years for $200 mill may get him signed.
Mayer at short, Story at 2nd, X at 3rd, and Casas at first could be a strong defensive infield. We have to think about Mayer.
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Post by incandenza on Aug 28, 2022 10:48:52 GMT -5
Does anyone legitimately think Swanson will improve or sustain a career-year performance for a 5-year deal? Anyone signing him will be disappointed if they're not expecting a 2.1 or so fWAR player. That's been his profile.
Turner is head and shoulders above him. Over the same period, he's averaged 4.36 fWAR and has been a lot more consistent. Xander's averaged 3.62 fWAR since 2014, so his sample size is somewhat larger. He's 9 months older than Turner and a year and 4 months older than Swanson. If Bloom wants to spend money elsewhere, he can move Story to SS and patch together a second baseman from Arroyo and whomever else they can find when Arroyo goes on his annual IL stints (Iglesias?). The shame here is Arroyo, who is one of Bloom's best pick-ups, would likely be an All Star or near All Star if he could put together a healthy season. You've said this before and it was pointed out that it is quite the spin to say that a guy with 10.8 fWAR since the beginning of 2020 (1465 PAs) is a 2 WAR player. A 2 WAR play is what he was before that, in 2018-2019, his second and third seasons in the league. He's been like a 4.5 WAR player since then and is on pace for a 6+ WAR season this year. There's a decent chance this is his career year, but he can regress a lot and still be better than average. He's also a former 1-1 draft pick, for whatever that's worth.
I think a Story-like contract would be fair for him, and I wouldn't hate that. (Though I'd hate to seee Xander leave.)
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Post by incandenza on Aug 28, 2022 10:58:33 GMT -5
It is funny how the list makes resigning X so clearly vital. Swanson and Turner are staying put. Correa will cost even more. Move Story and you just push the hole to 2b.* I don’t see a good alternative to Xander. *In theory you could move Story and go with my favorite hit monster, Arroyo. But he hasn’t proven he can make it through the year. And I think the fan base would riot. I'm still not sold on Arroyo even beyond the health issues. A 5% walk rate doesn't leave much margin for error when he's not making vicious contact. (Though I will say, WAR is underselling him this year; his 108 innings of -4 OAA/-5 DRS in RF alone probably knock about a full win off the total. It's pretty impressive, actually, that the team cost itself a full win just by having him play defense in RF for 12 games. That's more than JBJ's offense cost them all season.)
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 28, 2022 11:32:11 GMT -5
Just a reminder that averaging anything including 2020 requires prorating 2020 stats (multiply by 2.7). Swanson's 2.2 fWAR is 5.9 prorated over 162 games. Bogaerts' 1.6 is like 4.3, etc.
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Post by Guidas on Aug 28, 2022 12:41:59 GMT -5
Just a reminder that averaging anything including 2020 requires prorating 2020 stats (multiply by 2.7). Swanson's 2.2 fWAR is 5.9 prorated over 162 games. Bogaerts' 1.6 is like 4.3, etc. I agree. In fact, if we could reach consensus, I'd vote for throwing 2020 out. It's a 60 game season with players who played faced substandard competition against many teams because of the guys who decided not to play. Also, Covid created a variety of external factors that were unique to any post WWII season on record. That said, to people wanting to create imaginary start and endpoints. The question remains: do you think Swanson will perform at or near his levels from 2020 forward for the bulk or even the majority of his projected contract? And if so, is the projected contract you propose realistic given market demand?
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Post by Underwater Johnson on Aug 28, 2022 13:30:22 GMT -5
Just a reminder that averaging anything including 2020 requires prorating 2020 stats (multiply by 2.7). Swanson's 2.2 fWAR is 5.9 prorated over 162 games. Bogaerts' 1.6 is like 4.3, etc. I agree. In fact, if we could reach consensus, I'd vote for throwing 2020 out. It's a 60 game season with players who played faced substandard competition against many teams because of the guys who decided not to play. Also, Covid created a variety of external factors that were unique to any post WWII season on record. That said, to people wanting to create imaginary start and endpoints. The question remains: do you think Swanson will perform at or near his levels from 2020 forward for the bulk or even the majority of his projected contract? And if so, is the projected contract you propose realistic given market demand? I think it's better to just express it as "X WAR since 2018" or whatever starting point you want to use. This accommodates 2020 without ballooning a hot couple months into a crazy good year. It also rewards guys for staying on the field, accumulating WAR. I suppose a straight average WAR would also do this but if a guy who is often hurt had a great 2020 by playing 1/3 of a season without getting hurt, he's going to look that much better than he probably is if you just prorate 2020. Of course, the more forward-looking way to go is to sum 0.6*(this year's WAR) + 0.3*(last year's WAR) + 0.1*(2020's WAR) and just compare those. Is what anyone did in 2019 or before really relevant to what they're likely to do from 2023-27? (Do not answer this question if you're Brian "King of the 5-years-ago All-Star Teams" Cashman.) .
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Post by blizzards39 on Aug 28, 2022 17:54:36 GMT -5
Why would the White Sox trade Tim Anderson? My bad for putting Anderson on the list. His team option will 100% be picked up. It’s also amazing how many of the votes are X or Story. I think there is a good chance that X is back, that said I also think it’s Almost certain the Sox are in on a big FA hitter. SS makes the most sence is Boergarts is not retained
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Post by Soxfansince1971 on Aug 31, 2022 13:52:19 GMT -5
Does anyone legitimately think Swanson will improve or sustain a career-year performance for a 5-year deal? Anyone signing him will be disappointed if they're not expecting a 2.1 or so fWAR player. That's been his profile. Turner is head and shoulders above him. Over the same period, he's averaged 4.36 fWAR and has been a lot more consistent. Xander's averaged 3.62 fWAR since 2014, so his sample size is somewhat larger. He's 9 months older than Turner and a year and 4 months older than Swanson. If Bloom wants to spend money elsewhere, he can move Story to SS and patch together a second baseman from Arroyo and whomever else they can find when Arroyo goes on his annual IL stints (Iglesias?). The shame here is Arroyo, who is one of Bloom's best pick-ups, would likely be an All Star or near All Star if he could put together a healthy season. The Red Sox are paying for future performance, not past. Lol, let’s look at past JD vs future JD….get the idea… X is nowhere near the 2019 version: 2B - 52 HR - 33 RBI - 117 OPS - .939 X 2022 version with only 32 games left: 2B - 33 HR - 11 RBI - 55 OPS - .825 and he is obviously not getting any younger Do we honestly think Bogaerts will return to his pre-30s heights or is it better to look at another SS or 2B and let Story play opposite whichever position the player the Red Sox choose?
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Aug 31, 2022 15:37:41 GMT -5
I'd love to see X stay with the team. Seems like a good guy, well-liked by players and mgt. alike.
I do not like him as a SS, now or forever. His hands are okay & his arm is fine. I'm sure his instincts are good too. He's got all those plusses but crammed into a first basemen's body.
He'd make a fine platoon 1B/DH. Play some 3rd in a pinch. Maybe even LF. Please, no more SS.
Aside: while we're on the topic of 2023 INFIELD, I don't want Devers as my third baseman. I truly dislike watching him play baseball. He's very talented. He's more productive than many others. He's probably a fine young man. Aesthetically, he's awful to watch. (I'd expand, but I don't want to derail this thread ... to be continued.)
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Post by seamus on Aug 31, 2022 15:45:21 GMT -5
I went with Hernandez. My pet idea right now is that they re-sign him as their SS and go for splashes in the outfield (e.g. Nimmo, trade for Reynolds), leaving the top of the SS market alone.
(benogliviesbrother, I think Devers is one of the most aesthetically pleasing players to watch. I actually think the fun factor is so great that it's worth taking the chance of an albatross contract. I'm sorry that you don't feel the same way because that seems just miserable.)
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Post by greatscottcooper on Aug 31, 2022 15:53:39 GMT -5
Bogaerts and Devers have both been good defenders this year. I believe a move from SS/3B to 3B/1B is in the cards for their futures but both of them are fine there for right now and probably will be for a couple years.
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Post by iliketacos on Aug 31, 2022 16:33:12 GMT -5
I went with Hernandez. My pet idea right now is that they re-sign him as their SS and go for splashes in the outfield (e.g. Nimmo, trade for Reynolds), leaving the top of the SS market alone. (benogliviesbrother, I think Devers is one of the most aesthetically pleasing players to watch. I actually think the fun factor is so great that it's worth taking the chance of an albatross contract. I'm sorry that you don't feel the same way because that seems just miserable.) Kiké can't play SS. That being said, I completely agree with your point in regard to Devers.
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Post by iliketacos on Aug 31, 2022 16:38:27 GMT -5
I voted Story. I think that Arroyo will start at 2nd. Swanson is interesting, but depends on the price. The Braves have Albies locked up long-term and Grissom is a natural SS.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 31, 2022 16:47:52 GMT -5
I voted Story, but I'm really hoping they splurge for Turner, but even then I'm not sure Turner is the SS.
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