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Post by xdmo on Nov 7, 2022 18:35:25 GMT -5
What's the expectation on signing shortstops? Do you think there will be a flurry of signing all/most of them in the next two weeks? I'm sure Chaim will be calling Turner's agents first thing tomorrow. Let the Xander and Turner options play out in that time period. If no Xander, Turner is my choice. It's close between Turner and Correa if no Xander. If you had to pick one. Correa will come at a hefty contract, but just how much? I guess wait and see. No qualifying offer attached, which is very attractive. Turner has the QO attached and I think he gets more than most people anticipate. With the video I posted, he's been sneaky underated and good. Swanson is a option, but he might get too many years.
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Post by greenmonster on Nov 7, 2022 18:44:45 GMT -5
If the Sox miss on Xander then I fear they will end up with Correa. Cora and Correa have a previous connection from the ASStros and I would imagine that helps facilitate a deal. This is a worst case in my mind, since I want no part in routing for him.
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Post by iakovos11 on Nov 7, 2022 19:43:28 GMT -5
I'm fine with Correa, he's a good baseball player.
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Nov 7, 2022 19:51:35 GMT -5
If the Sox miss on Xander then I fear they will end up with Correa. Cora and Correa have a previous connection from the ASStros and I would imagine that helps facilitate a deal. This is a worst case in my mind, since I want no part in routing for him. Imagine "fearing" signing a perennial 5WAR, platinum glove winning, Ortiz playoff clone, shortstop?
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Post by greenmonster on Nov 7, 2022 19:58:33 GMT -5
If the Sox miss on Xander then I fear they will end up with Correa. Cora and Correa have a previous connection from the ASStros and I would imagine that helps facilitate a deal. This is a worst case in my mind, since I want no part in routing for him. Imagine "fearing" signing a perennial 5WAR, platinum glove winning, Ortiz playoff clone, shortstop? Imagine having no morals
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Post by oldfaithful2019 on Nov 7, 2022 20:02:09 GMT -5
I want Zander to stay more than any other option, but voted for Swanson. He will come at the lowest price which will allow more salary to spend on other additions.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Nov 7, 2022 20:08:24 GMT -5
I figured it was a flip of a coin as to whether they re-sign Xander but as we approach his free agency my guess is that he receives bigger offers from other teams and winds up in Philly for a contact north of 200 million.
The Sox probably wind up with Swanson.
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Nov 7, 2022 20:08:50 GMT -5
Imagine "fearing" signing a perennial 5WAR, platinum glove winning, Ortiz playoff clone, shortstop? Imagine having no morals Did I miss a story somewhere that Correa killed a village of women and children?
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Post by incandenza on Nov 7, 2022 20:49:47 GMT -5
I have, once again, forgotten why I'm supposed to hate Correa, who seems like a smart and decent guy.
Meanwhile, I've really talked myself into thinking that the very best fit for Xander Bogaerts is... the Boston Red Sox. Or is there another team that has a clearer need for "strong bat that can play shortstop for 2-3 more years until the team's #1 prospect arrives and can then move to a different position, and also the team has a ton of money to spend"? All that before getting into the personal relationship between the team and player and the surplus value of having a beloved star spend his whole career with the team and the fact that there is probably a PR need to hang onto a home-grown star after the whole Mookie thing and there is no guarantee that Devers will be satisfying that need.
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Post by julyanmorley on Nov 7, 2022 21:08:03 GMT -5
Quotes like this are setting themselves up for some bad days on talk radio if they don't get it done
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Nov 7, 2022 21:41:06 GMT -5
I have, once again, forgotten why I'm supposed to hate Correa, who seems like a smart and decent guy. Meanwhile, I've really talked myself into thinking that the very best fit for Xander Bogaerts is... the Boston Red Sox. Or is there another team that has a clearer need for "strong bat that can play shortstop for 2-3 more years until the team's #1 prospect arrives and can then move to a different position, and also the team has a ton of money to spend"? All that before getting into the personal relationship between the team and player and the surplus value of having a beloved star spend his whole career with the team and the fact that there is probably a PR need to hang onto a home-grown star after the whole Mookie thing and there is no guarantee that Devers will be satisfying that need. If Correa signs with the Yankees I'm sure you and everybody else will remember. Lol
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TearsIn04
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Post by TearsIn04 on Nov 7, 2022 21:41:52 GMT -5
I expect D-Dom to be D-Dom and sign one of the big-name SS. But I don't think it will necessarily be X. I'd probably bet on him signing Correa.
If the Red Sox sign one, I'd expect it to be Swanson, as he's likely to carry the lowest price tag.
I take no encouragement from Bloom saying X is the team's priority. If he's the priority, Chaim, then where ya been the past two years? Why didn't it get done already? It's easier to make these deals before a guy hits FA than it is once other teams start making offers.
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Post by incandenza on Nov 7, 2022 21:44:25 GMT -5
I have, once again, forgotten why I'm supposed to hate Correa, who seems like a smart and decent guy. Meanwhile, I've really talked myself into thinking that the very best fit for Xander Bogaerts is... the Boston Red Sox. Or is there another team that has a clearer need for "strong bat that can play shortstop for 2-3 more years until the team's #1 prospect arrives and can then move to a different position, and also the team has a ton of money to spend"? All that before getting into the personal relationship between the team and player and the surplus value of having a beloved star spend his whole career with the team and the fact that there is probably a PR need to hang onto a home-grown star after the whole Mookie thing and there is no guarantee that Devers will be satisfying that need. If Correa signs with the Yankees I'm sure you and everybody else will remember. Lol I won't "remember," as I don't think I ever knew in the first place. I will simply have all new reasons to loathe him.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Nov 7, 2022 21:46:42 GMT -5
I'd bet that D-Dom will be D-Dom and sign one of the big-name SS. But I don't think it will necessarily be X. I'd probably bet on him signing Correa. If the Red Sox sign one, I'd bet on it being Swanson, as he's likely to carry the lowest price tag. I take no encouragement from Bloom saying X is the team's priority. If he's the priority, Chaim, then where ya been the past two years? Why didn't it get done already? It's easier to make these deals before a guy hits FA than it is once other teams start making offers. I think the Dodgers will be heavily in on Correa as they probably lose Trea Turner who I think I read prefers playing on the East Coast....so if Dombrowski doesnt sign X perhaps he goes after Turner. Perhaps the Os get involved. I still think they look at Henderson as a 3b but even so Turner would still be a huge upgrade for them as would Correa. The Orioles will get somebody. And the Cubs and Cards are candidates to sign a SS, possibly X.
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Post by incandenza on Nov 7, 2022 21:53:24 GMT -5
Quotes like this are setting themselves up for some bad days on talk radio if they don't get it done Just Chaim being Chaim (i.e., clearly and candidly articulating the team's priorities).
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Post by stunzisox on Nov 8, 2022 0:46:02 GMT -5
I want Zander to stay more than any other option, but voted for Swanson. He will come at the lowest price which will allow more salary to spend on other additions. its just a little bit disrespectful spelling it ‘Zander’ on the Red Sox prospects forum, no? Be better please.
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Nov 8, 2022 1:30:52 GMT -5
Brought this up in another thread, but if Chaim & Co can’t resign X, I much rather swing a trade for Willy Adames than sign one of the big 3.
I would go after Correa, but (1) I think the Dodgers or Phillies are going to pony up more money + years and (2) he’s just too injury prone.
I know it’s off field stuff, but Turner’s bigoted past doesn’t seem like it would jive well in a market like Boston (or the clubhouse). Seems to also lack the intangibles too.
5-7 years of Swanson would make me go mad. Can’t put my finger on it, but I just don’t see him being better than a 2+ WAR player after 2-3 years of that deal.
With 2 more years of control, familiarity w/ the eastern division (and Chaim), and a strong clubhouse presence, Adames seems like a far more logical choice than what’s available on the market after X — especially considering he could be packaged with a Burnes/Woodruff and/or Yelich.
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Post by xdmo on Nov 8, 2022 1:45:41 GMT -5
Should Bogaerts sign elsewhere, it seems the plan is to move Trevor Story -- who inked a six-year, $140 million contract last offseason -- back to shortstop, where he played exclusively for the first six years of his career. According to sources, the Red Sox have started reaching out to some teams regarding the availability of their second basemen, hoping to figure out Plan B in the likely event that Bogaerts leaves Boston. www.mlb.com/news/gm-meetings-intrigue-includes-opt-outs-qualifying-offers“It doesn’t seem like they’re going to spend big on a shortstop,” one source said. “They knew this was a possibility when they signed Story last year.” That's a pretty clear cut quote. The Sox might not be as concerned with Story's arm strength problems. I'd rather move Story back versus get stuck with a bad contract. They're all going to be bad contracts with teams flooded looking for short stops this winter. Add- all the teams that could be in the short stop market- Mariners Cubs Phillies Dodgers Red Sox Braves Cardinals Orioles Two or three of these teams are going to be left without a chair at the end.
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Post by julyanmorley on Nov 8, 2022 2:40:48 GMT -5
There may be something to them feeling like Story at SS is an option, but I wouldn't read too much into that quote. It's speculation that doesn't really make sense from a completely anonymous source. The Red Sox are checking the price on everyone they could conceivably add to the roster like they do every year.
Can't find many 2B that are plausible trade targets. Kolten Wong and Jorge Polanco maybe.
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Post by xdmo on Nov 8, 2022 3:26:51 GMT -5
The Red Sox actions of checking in and not following up right now, might be the reason that quotes coming out though.
All of the interested teams are probably ready to strike quick on the top of the free agent short stop class. It's a very barren market outside the top 4.
If one anonymous agent (I'm assuming) is saying the Sox aren't being aggressive, then that's very striking early out of the gate.
The whole "wait for Xander's market to fall apart" could be a problem if they actually want him back.
The Sox might have eyes on another prize in free agency. Not sure who that is, but maybe it's not at Short Stop. Maybe it's Kodai Senga.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Nov 8, 2022 4:39:05 GMT -5
I expect D-Dom to be D-Dom and sign one of the big-name SS. But I don't think it will necessarily be X. I'd probably bet on him signing Correa. If the Red Sox sign one, I'd expect it to be Swanson, as he's likely to carry the lowest price tag. I take no encouragement from Bloom saying X is the team's priority. If he's the priority, Chaim, then where ya been the past two years? Why didn't it get done already? It's easier to make these deals before a guy hits FA than it is once other teams start making offers. Because until this year, there was real possibility that Xander Bogaerts would need to move to LF as soon as this coming year.
Same thing with extending Raffy, and note that they made a point of giving him an offer based on his playing 1B.
If a player is a year from free agency, and there's a 1 to 2 WAR uncertainty (each year!) in his value, there is no way to strike a deal. The player realizes that they need to improve on defense and, convinced of their ability to do just that, will want that money now. But the F.O. cannot do that. Sometimes no amount of hard work can bring about a desired outcome. Even if you're 90% sure the players will reach their upside, the downside if you're wrong exceeds the gain you'll get by completing a deal when the upside is still just that, and not reality. It's rare that a 10% chance-we're-screwed gamble is better than waiting a bit and eliminating the uncertainty.
The Raffy offer suggests that the low offers to both players were in part designed to underscore the importance of fulfilling their defensive potential. I think they're both professional enough and proud enough to have lit their own fires underneath themselves, so you can regard the low offers as tossing an extra log or two on them. It makes the consequences of not working hard enough really vivid, by putting a $number on it.
It worked beautifully. And the team will gladly pay the extra money now.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Nov 8, 2022 5:15:00 GMT -5
“It doesn’t seem like they’re going to spend big on a shortstop,” one source said. “They knew this was a possibility when they signed Story last year.”
That's a pretty clear cut quote. The Sox might not be as concerned with Story's arm strength problems. I'd rather move Story back versus get stuck with a bad contract. They're all going to be bad contracts with teams flooded looking for short stops this winter. Add- all the teams that could be in the short stop market- Mariners Cubs Phillies Dodgers Red Sox Braves Cardinals Orioles Two or three of these teams are going to be left without a chair at the end. Actually, it's a complete guess. And actually, a bad one.
It doesn't follow in the least that asking about 2B means that moving Story to SS is plan B.
If for some reason they can't strike a deal with Xander, there's a non-zero possibility that Xander is the 4th and last guy signed.
I mean, seriously. Even if that's random, there's a 25% chance that there's no one left to sign! And the more confident you are of signing a guy, the more likely it is that the negotiations drag out if you can't come to a deal as expected. Xander want to sign here. He's a Boros client. He's not going to sign early with another team.
It Xander goes elsewhere, it may well be a coin toss as to whether Correa is left, or no one. They are covering the latter possibility. The notion that they won't spend $ on Correa if he's the last guy standing, given the money they have to spend (which has already in part been budgeted to sign Xander) is laughable.
I take it back -- that's not a bad guess, it's a laughably lazy one. Stopping and thinking things through is not exactly S.O.P. among sportswriters.
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Post by ericmvan on Nov 8, 2022 5:18:14 GMT -5
The Red Sox actions of checking in and not following up right now, might be the reason that quotes coming out though. All of the interested teams are probably ready to strike quick on the top of the free agent short stop class. It's a very barren market outside the top 4. If one anonymous agent (I'm assuming) is saying the Sox aren't being aggressive, then that's very striking early out of the gate. The whole "wait for Xander's market to fall apart" could be a problem if they actually want him back. The Sox might have eyes on another prize in free agency. Not sure who that is, but maybe it's not at Short Stop. Maybe it's Kodai Senga. No one is allowed to negotiate with a F.A. yet. The source didn't say the Sox weren't being aggressive; he was guessing that interest in a 2B meant they were uninterested in a SS.
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Post by alexcorahomevideo on Nov 8, 2022 6:44:09 GMT -5
Should Bogaerts sign elsewhere, it seems the plan is to move Trevor Story -- who inked a six-year, $140 million contract last offseason -- back to shortstop, where he played exclusively for the first six years of his career. According to sources, the Red Sox have started reaching out to some teams regarding the availability of their second basemen, hoping to figure out Plan B in the likely event that Bogaerts leaves Boston. www.mlb.com/news/gm-meetings-intrigue-includes-opt-outs-qualifying-offers“It doesn’t seem like they’re going to spend big on a shortstop,” one source said. “They knew this was a possibility when they signed Story last year.” That's a pretty clear cut quote. The Sox might not be as concerned with Story's arm strength problems. I'd rather move Story back versus get stuck with a bad contract. They're all going to be bad contracts with teams flooded looking for short stops this winter. Add- all the teams that could be in the short stop market- Mariners Cubs Phillies Dodgers Red Sox Braves Cardinals Orioles Two or three of these teams are going to be left without a chair at the end. This was always the play. They might be able to afford someone like Brandon Lowe who is coming off a really bad injury filled season but has the potential to have a middle of the order impact. Plus Tampa has some really good infield prospects that can fill his void immediately. I don't think they part with someone like Brujan unless they are overwhelmed. I feel like if this was going to happen with Xander it never would have gotten to this point. I guess theres always a chance they just say screw it and go with Valdez and Arroyo and see what happens at 2nd.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Nov 8, 2022 7:13:00 GMT -5
Yeah I'm not buying Story to SS being plan B. Maybe plan F or something and as Eric mentions, it's not like they could even talk to anyone other than Xander yet, so they might as well figure out what's out there if the doomsday scenario happens.
Figuring out every possible option feels very Bloom to me.
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