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Will the Red Sox completely clean house this offseason?
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Post by julyanmorley on Sept 20, 2022 13:31:22 GMT -5
Kevin Plawecki is telling everyone he's headed to the Rangers to be their third catcher for ten days. So I guess this worked out pretty good for him. This odd transaction would seem to have something to do with Eovaldi, the soon to be free agent Texan.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 20, 2022 13:48:28 GMT -5
Kevin Plawecki is telling everyone he's headed to the Rangers to be their third catcher for ten days. So I guess this worked out pretty good for him. This odd transaction would seem to have something to do with Eovaldi, the soon to be free agent Texan. He's getting paid the same amount anyway.
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Post by incandenza on Sept 20, 2022 13:50:36 GMT -5
This is the part I never understand . For every guy you pick up at the deadline, you must cut, trade, or send down one of the guys currently on the roster. Is it only losing popular players that bothers these guys? Kevin Plawecki is telling everyone he's headed to the Rangers to be their third catcher for ten days. So I guess this worked out pretty good for him. This odd transaction would seem to have something to do with Eovaldi, the soon to be free agent Texan. Both these points were referenced by Bloom in his interview with Bradford.
On the first point: roster management is a zero sum game; Bloom noted that it might feel nice to keep a well-liked guy around just as a favor to him and his buddies, but that would come at the expense of some other guy who would be left off the roster, which would hardly be fair to him and his own career prospects.
On the second: Plawecki is about to be a free agent and it doesn't exactly help him in free agency to sit on the bench for the last three weeks of the season.
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Post by greenmonster on Sept 20, 2022 14:33:09 GMT -5
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Sept 20, 2022 14:39:46 GMT -5
Hill was on the IL on the deadline day, Nate had literally just come back the night before it after missing a month, and JD had I think 2 hits in the 17 GAMES leading up to it. Nobody was asking Boston for these guys.
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Post by julyanmorley on Sept 20, 2022 15:10:01 GMT -5
Can you guys imagine the last two months of sports talk radio if they had unloaded respected vets that have actually made an all star team and condemned everyone to low ratings until next season
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Post by xdmo on Sept 20, 2022 15:14:08 GMT -5
Can you guys imagine the last two months of sports talk radio if they had unloaded respected vets that have actually made an all star team and condemned everyone to low ratings until next season Not trying to be rude, but didn't the ratings tank the last 2 months of the season anyways because of the team's performance? They already had traded Vazquez, why stop there?
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Sept 20, 2022 15:21:51 GMT -5
This is the part I never understand . For every guy you pick up at the deadline, you must cut, trade, or send down one of the guys currently on the roster. Is it only losing popular players that bothers these guys? Kevin Plawecki is telling everyone he's headed to the Rangers to be their third catcher for ten days. So I guess this worked out pretty good for him. This odd transaction would seem to have something to do with Eovaldi, the soon to be free agent Texan. Both these points were referenced by Bloom in his interview with Bradford.
On the first point: roster management is a zero sum game; Bloom noted that it might feel nice to keep a well-liked guy around just as a favor to him and his buddies, but that would come at the expense of some other guy who would be left off the roster, which would hardly be fair to him and his own career prospects.
On the second: Plawecki is about to be a free agent and it doesn't exactly help him in free agency to sit on the bench for the last three weeks of the season.
I don't really need to hear Bloom's explanation on things. I don't take him as being transparent here. He is going to play the middle, but the actions speak louder than the words. What is a 3 week trial period gonna tell anyone about Plawecki or German ? The chances of that being informative are so slim as to be nearly non-existent. The question is does this type of decision making interfere with your chances to retain veteran players, sign FA's. It probably doesn't, but it is weird risk to take. He wants to come off as considerate in the press, that is to his benefit. He may be for all I know, but his MO is very transactional and it is appears to be noticeable to some players and some fans.
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Post by julyanmorley on Sept 20, 2022 15:23:11 GMT -5
Can you guys imagine the last two months of sports talk radio if they had unloaded respected vets that have actually made an all star team and condemned everyone to low ratings until next season Not trying to be rude, but didn't the ratings tank the last 2 months of the season anyways because the team's performance anyways? The next time the team is 2 games out of the third wild card on trade deadline day they will still likely be without a crystal ball that can predict the outcome of every future game. But they will have a stark reminder of how toxic the media environment can get after weeks of boredom.
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Sept 20, 2022 15:34:30 GMT -5
Both these points were referenced by Bloom in his interview with Bradford.
On the first point: roster management is a zero sum game; Bloom noted that it might feel nice to keep a well-liked guy around just as a favor to him and his buddies, but that would come at the expense of some other guy who would be left off the roster, which would hardly be fair to him and his own career prospects.
On the second: Plawecki is about to be a free agent and it doesn't exactly help him in free agency to sit on the bench for the last three weeks of the season.
I don't really need to hear Bloom's explanation on things. I don't take him as being transparent here. He is going to play the middle, but the actions speak louder than the words. What is a 3 week trial period gonna tell anyone about Plawecki or German ? The chances of that being informative are so slim as to be nearly non-existent. The question is does this type of decision making interfere with your chances to retain veteran players, sign FA's. It probably doesn't, but it is weird risk to take. He wants to come off as considerate in the press, that is to his benefit. He may be for all I know, but his MO is very transactional and it is appears to be noticeable to some players and some fans. Fans scream and scream for guys to be DFAd to the point where I've muted the word on Twitter, and now that they actually DFA a guy who quite honestly sucks, they lose their smooth brained minds. I honestly don't get it. Nobody worth a damn is going to remember this once the offseason starts. You think Scott Boras is going to not take a meeting from Boston because of Kevin Plawecki?
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Sept 20, 2022 15:36:41 GMT -5
Sorry, but who cares what they are paid ? The contracts were negotiated by 2 parties and that really isn't relevant. There have been degrees of underperformance, so it is fair to be critical there. However, that is the difficulty of playing at a Pro level, everyone understands that can happen. I don't take the players reactions with a grain of salt. It appears to be a continuation of some of the Bogey talk around the All-Star break. There is bound to be some hostile carryover towards management when good friends on the team get released. I don't think that should be surprising, whatever the context of their quotes. And releasing a guy, who is obviously well liked, with 3 Weeks left in a losing season is really kind of shortsighted and stupid, IMO. It has a transactional vibe that feels unnecessary to me. Will they clean house ? All depends on who is doing the cleaning.&nbs p; Maybe the players will be cleaning house with Ownership and Mgt and finding other places to play. One thing i am pretty certain about, if Bloom let's guys go because they voice their feeling about positive clubhouse guys getting released, then he is in even more trouble than I think he is in to build a contending club. uhhh, everyone? if you are being paid millions of dollars to perform, and you play like poop, you dont think people will be upset? Second bolded: thats fine with me, If these people call themselves "leaders" they are not acting like it that is fine. I can understand this. However, leadership can take many forms and 1 of them is speaking truth to power.
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Post by incandenza on Sept 20, 2022 15:39:28 GMT -5
Both these points were referenced by Bloom in his interview with Bradford.
On the first point: roster management is a zero sum game; Bloom noted that it might feel nice to keep a well-liked guy around just as a favor to him and his buddies, but that would come at the expense of some other guy who would be left off the roster, which would hardly be fair to him and his own career prospects.
On the second: Plawecki is about to be a free agent and it doesn't exactly help him in free agency to sit on the bench for the last three weeks of the season.
I don't really need to hear Bloom's explanation on things. I don't take him as being transparent here. He is going to play the middle, but the actions speak louder than the words. What is a 3 week trial period gonna tell anyone about Plawecki or German ? The chances of that being informative are so slim as to be nearly non-existent. The question is does this type of decision making interfere with your chances to retain veteran players, sign FA's. It probably doesn't, but it is weird risk to take. He wants to come off as considerate in the press, that is to his benefit. He may be for all I know, but his MO is very transactional and it is noticeable. The first point about roster management is just a statement of fact - keeping Plawecki on the roster necessarily means keeping another player off the roster; favoring Plawecki necessarily means disfavoring someone else. So I don't know what there even is to disagree with there.
As for whether his MO is especially transactional, I dunno... Find me the organization that never releases veterans and never sells off at the trade deadline and makes its decisions based on the feelings of the team's veterans rather than the long-run interest of the team. I'd guess that organization is not especially successful. (Come to think of it, that might be the Royals.) But other organizations don't exist within the bullshit industrial complex that is the Boston media environment...
ADD re: the above comment: Haha, "speaking truth to power" is a hell of a spin on... whatever this is.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Sept 20, 2022 15:40:26 GMT -5
I don't really need to hear Bloom's explanation on things. I don't take him as being transparent here. He is going to play the middle, but the actions speak louder than the words. What is a 3 week trial period gonna tell anyone about Plawecki or German ? The chances of that being informative are so slim as to be nearly non-existent. The question is does this type of decision making interfere with your chances to retain veteran players, sign FA's. It probably doesn't, but it is weird risk to take. He wants to come off as considerate in the press, that is to his benefit. He may be for all I know, but his MO is very transactional and it is appears to be noticeable to some players and some fans. Fans scream and scream for guys to be DFAd to the point where I've muted the word on Twitter, and now that they actually DFA a guy who quite honestly sucks, they lose their smooth brained minds. I honestly don't get it. Nobody worth a damn is going to remember this once the offseason starts. You think Scott Boras is going to not take a meeting from Boston because of Kevin Plawecki? i am gonna have this last post, and I not making this personal. it isn't about what the fans think. It is there in print, there was obvious discomfort with a segment of players for this club. That isn't something that should be dismissed. It may not have any effect at all, but the players reaction can be a window into the future of the club.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Sept 20, 2022 15:45:16 GMT -5
Incandenza.....ha. sure it isn't "power to the people" stuff. but it has happened on a few occasions this year. Take that for what it is worth.
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Post by vermontsox1 on Sept 20, 2022 16:28:04 GMT -5
Let's knock off the personal attacks. Thanks.
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 15,659
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Post by cdj on Sept 20, 2022 16:32:29 GMT -5
Fans scream and scream for guys to be DFAd to the point where I've muted the word on Twitter, and now that they actually DFA a guy who quite honestly sucks, they lose their smooth brained minds. I honestly don't get it. Nobody worth a damn is going to remember this once the offseason starts. You think Scott Boras is going to not take a meeting from Boston because of Kevin Plawecki? i am gonna have this last post, and I not making this personal. it isn't about what the fans think. It is there in print, there was obvious discomfort with a segment of players for this club. That isn't something that should be dismissed. It may not have any effect at all, but the players reaction can be a window into the future of the club. If they are actually upset by the transaction then I don’t want those players around because they’re losers and not only that, they’re stupid and actively working against the best interests of the club On top of that I’d say getting German and Wong innings is far more important than letting a guy who has somehow accumulated-1.1 bWAR/-0.4 fWAR in 150 AB’s waste a roster spot on a sub .500 team when he’s a free agent to be So if the players want to be upset they can look in the mirror for somebody to blame.
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Sept 20, 2022 16:35:42 GMT -5
Let's knock off the personal attacks. Thanks. The smooth brained comment was directed towards the people on hellscape that is twitter, not anyone here
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Post by Guidas on Sept 20, 2022 16:38:10 GMT -5
Both these points were referenced by Bloom in his interview with Bradford.
On the first point: roster management is a zero sum game; Bloom noted that it might feel nice to keep a well-liked guy around just as a favor to him and his buddies, but that would come at the expense of some other guy who would be left off the roster, which would hardly be fair to him and his own career prospects. On the second: Plawecki is about to be a free agent and it doesn't exactly help him in free agency to sit on the bench for the last three weeks of the season.
I don't really need to hear Bloom's explanation on things. I don't take him as being transparent here. He is going to play the middle, but the actions speak louder than the words. What is a 3 week trial period gonna tell anyone about Plawecki or German ? The chances of that being informative are so slim as to be nearly non-existent. The question is does this type of decision making interfere with your chances to retain veteran players, sign FA's. It probably doesn't, but it is weird risk to take. He wants to come off as considerate in the press, that is to his benefit. He may be for all I know, but his MO is very transactional and it is appears to be noticeable to some players and some fans. But everyone NEEDS to see Yu Chang!!!! Because we don’t have enough info on a career minor leaguer/org guy and this absolute garbage time small sample will tell us so much!!!
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Post by Guidas on Sept 20, 2022 16:43:12 GMT -5
I hate to see anyone lose their job, but Plawecki needed to go a while ago. What is troubling yes to hear the veteran comments. People say “play better“ but Eovaldi was injured and never seem to get his full arm extension back when he came back from the IL. Hill was injured, too, and I think he’ll played to about his projected regression from last year.
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Post by julyanmorley on Sept 20, 2022 16:50:26 GMT -5
But everyone NEEDS to see Yu Chang!!!! Because we don’t have enough info on a career minor leaguer/org guy and this absolute garbage time small sample will tell us so much!!! Would you prefer they go with a 28 man roster that contains zero backup infielders
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Post by incandenza on Sept 20, 2022 17:03:44 GMT -5
But everyone NEEDS to see Yu Chang!!!! Because we don’t have enough info on a career minor leaguer/org guy and this absolute garbage time small sample will tell us so much!!! Would you prefer they go with a 28 man roster that contains zero backup infielders Right. People are bringing up Chang and German and Almonte for some reason, but obviously Plawecki wasn't blocking them; the point is that they want to evaluate McGuire and Wong and give them all the playing time they can down the stretch to see what they're going to do about the catcher position in 2023. Makes sense, no?
The alternative to DFAing Plawecki was to let him sit on the bench for three weeks and just be a chill dude to hang out with (which would also mean denying another player a chance at being on the big league roster).
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shagworthy
Veteran
My neckbeard game is on point.
Posts: 1,845
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Post by shagworthy on Sept 20, 2022 17:07:55 GMT -5
Wasn't a fan of the Plawecki or Vasquez move. That being said, we can all debate till we are blue in the face about the importance of continuity and chemistry, but we also must acknowledge that losing teams rarely have either. It was a calculated risk by Bloom in both cases, we won't know until after the offseason if it was worth it. I wish Plow and Vasquez well, and I wish the guys on the roster who are making this as big of a deal as they are actually came to the post. They didn't, and so attrition was inevitable.
Let's take a moment to celebrate each players contributions, both on the field and off (The Laundry Cart doesn't happen without plow) and then just move on. All I see is a lot of finger pointing with no appreciable personal responsibility. It's not like any of these guys will immediately become Oliver Twist anyways. They'll be ok,
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Sept 20, 2022 17:09:01 GMT -5
Both these points were referenced by Bloom in his interview with Bradford.
On the first point: roster management is a zero sum game; Bloom noted that it might feel nice to keep a well-liked guy around just as a favor to him and his buddies, but that would come at the expense of some other guy who would be left off the roster, which would hardly be fair to him and his own career prospects. On the second: Plawecki is about to be a free agent and it doesn't exactly help him in free agency to sit on the bench for the last three weeks of the season.
I don't really need to hear Bloom's explanation on things. I don't take him as being transparent here. He is going to play the middle, but the actions speak louder than the words. What is a 3 week trial period gonna tell anyone about Plawecki or German ? The chances of that being informative are so slim as to be nearly non-existent. The question is does this type of decision making interfere with your chances to retain veteran players, sign FA's. It probably doesn't, but it is weird risk to take. He wants to come off as considerate in the press, that is to his benefit. He may be for all I know, but his MO is very transactional and it is appears to be noticeable to some players and some fans. Kind of unnecessary, really. I don't care if Plawecki is on the roster or not, but it seems to me that Bloom could have avoided ticking off a large segment of his team's clubhouse by DFAing Almonte who is as useless to the Sox and their future as Plawecki is. So it seems this stuff could have been headed off without having to make waves. I mean if it's Almonte or Plawecki does it really make much difference to keep Almonte over Plawecki? Almonte's tenure with the Sox is basically a brief cup of coffee.
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Post by incandenza on Sept 20, 2022 17:18:25 GMT -5
I don't really need to hear Bloom's explanation on things. I don't take him as being transparent here. He is going to play the middle, but the actions speak louder than the words. What is a 3 week trial period gonna tell anyone about Plawecki or German ? The chances of that being informative are so slim as to be nearly non-existent. The question is does this type of decision making interfere with your chances to retain veteran players, sign FA's. It probably doesn't, but it is weird risk to take. He wants to come off as considerate in the press, that is to his benefit. He may be for all I know, but his MO is very transactional and it is appears to be noticeable to some players and some fans. Kind of unnecessary, really. I don't care if Plawecki is on the roster or not, but it seems to me that Bloom could have avoided ticking off a large segment of his team's clubhouse by DFAing Almonte who is as useless to the Sox and their future as Plawecki is. So it seems this stuff could have been headed off without having to make waves. I mean if it's Almonte or Plawecki does it really make much difference to keep Almonte over Plawecki? Almonte's tenure with the Sox is basically a brief cup of coffee. "Sorry, Abe, the guys like Kevin better. You gotta go."
Among other things that seem bad about turning roster management into a popularity contest is that it would call into question some of the cultural/racial dynamics mentioned on the previous page. Not that I am assuming the team has issues with that, but if there are these sort of cultural factions on the club and the team was deferring to the most numerous and outspoken faction... well. That would be bad.
Like how would Xander and Rafi and the other Latin players feel about the team trading Vazquez but keeping the much worse Plawecki around just because certain guys liked him?
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Post by alexcorahomevideo on Sept 20, 2022 17:20:02 GMT -5
Probably. I can't see Xander JD Eovaldi Hill or Wacha back next year. Devers will either sign and extension or traded. This will truly be Chaims team next year. Wouldn't rule out Chaim using Devers to rid the Sox of Sale either.
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