|
|
Post by vermontsox1 on Jan 24, 2023 12:25:02 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by bloomstaxonomy on Jan 24, 2023 12:31:07 GMT -5
I'm absolutely furious/thrilled about this trade. Will edit later after I see other people's opinions.
|
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Jan 24, 2023 12:31:47 GMT -5
If Taylor is healthy he's pretty good. Now they need a lefty. They better sign Will Smith or Chafin I like Sherriff but am not comfortable with just Sherriff and Rodriguez as kefty options. Mondesi, I'm not too high on. He has no plate discipline. So is Kiké the regular SS or does he bounce back and forth?
|
|
nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,671
|
Post by nomar on Jan 24, 2023 12:32:25 GMT -5
90% chance Mondesi is awful at the plate, but hey, it is what it is at this point. He can play both SS and 2B and is a good glove. Great baserunner too.
$3M salary this year (Taylor was $1M) which will help the Sox stay under the LT post incentives
|
|
|
|
Post by Addam603 on Jan 24, 2023 12:32:56 GMT -5
Mondesi tore his ACL early last year. Anyone know what his recovery timeline is looking like?
|
|
|
|
Post by vermontsox1 on Jan 24, 2023 12:35:17 GMT -5
The PTBNL is obviously going to be Tony Ruiz.
|
|
|
|
Post by semperfisox on Jan 24, 2023 12:38:06 GMT -5
More dumpster diving…..can’t say I’m shocked.
|
|
|
|
Post by scottysmalls on Jan 24, 2023 12:38:39 GMT -5
Plus maybe ++ defender at short and second (something like a top 5 guy at both positions on a rate basis), speed should play up this year (pending ACL surgery recovery obviously), switch hitter. Injuries obviously make him a question mark, but low acquisition cost, only going to be 27. If he stays healthy it should work out great. I like this better than signing Iglesias at least.
|
|
|
|
Post by greenmonster on Jan 24, 2023 12:38:52 GMT -5
Things to like
- Switch Hitter
- Plus speed. Can readily steal a base prior to the shorter bases.
- Has played 2B/SS/3B
- Appears solid defensively although not sure what advance metrics might suggest
Areas of concern
- Coming off of ACL injury
- Has never been great getting on base
|
|
|
|
Post by grandsalami on Jan 24, 2023 12:38:58 GMT -5
More dumpster diving…..can’t say I’m shocked. yah.. no.... this aint it they gave up nothing to get Mondesi |
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Jan 24, 2023 12:39:49 GMT -5
Mondesi is a switch hitter who has serious speed and good power. He'd be great if he had any plate discipline whatsoever, which he clearly has none of.
Too bad.
I'd rather have a healthy Taylor but who knows if he's fully healthy?
Like I said, I want a proven quality lefty. They have options and more than enough money to accomplish this.
|
|
|
|
Post by scottysmalls on Jan 24, 2023 12:44:05 GMT -5
Context on how good he is:
From 2018 - 2022 he's been a 4 WAR/150 games guy. It's not that he's been a part time player put in strategic spots either, he was just either in the minors or injured the times he was out. Mondesi is a really good player, and someone who should benefit from rule changes (fast ground ball pull/switch hitter), the big question mark is health.
|
|
|
|
Post by soxfan06 on Jan 24, 2023 12:45:35 GMT -5
Hilarious to me that this is likely the trade Chaim was parroting as the move to be on the lookout for when its couldn't be more underwhelming.
|
|
|
|
Post by soxfansince67 on Jan 24, 2023 12:47:20 GMT -5
Nice seasons 2018-2020. Last two years fall off, injury effects. Still young at 27. Agree, it is KMart blue lighting again. We really are taking on Rays-like attributes.
|
|
|
|
Post by notstarboard on Jan 24, 2023 12:49:19 GMT -5
I really like this move. It's one year an oft-injured plus defensive SS with wheels and some pop for three years of a relief pitcher who just missed a full season with back issues. Both players are flawed, but given our relief pitching depth and our hole in the middle infield this makes a ton of sense to me. Mondesi has a pretty high ceiling too, so he'll be a fun player to dream on. He only played 15 games last year and missed a lot of time in just about every previous season as well, but he also produced at roughly a 4 fWAR pace from 2018-2021. He's sort of like a poor man's Byron Buxton that plays SS. One other thing to keep in mind is that signing a free agent SS would have required a DFA, and that DFA would probably have been a reliever like Ort or Brasier. Some were even speculating Rodriguez. Is Taylor that much more valuable than guys like that to worry about giving him up for Mondesi? I think not, especially given the clear need for another middle IF on this roster. And there's also the PTBNL - not expecting a lot given the settled part of the return, but we'll see. Now, if Arroyo and Mondesi could just sync up so that one is always healthy when the other inevitably gets injured, that would be great.
Edit: I also think this makes it very likely that Paxton starts the year in the bullpen. Rodriguez is the only other lefty likely to start the year in the majors. The only other lefty bullpen candidates on the 40 man are Walter and Murphy. With that said, Mondesi is only making ~$3 million this year, so it's only a ~$2 million increase over Taylor. That means the Sox should have enough money to spend on a solid bullpen lefty if they'd like (e.g. Chafin).
|
|
|
|
Post by wingman478 on Jan 24, 2023 12:49:54 GMT -5
Career OPS .674 against RHP. .719 against LHP.
He's a revert split guy. Maybe they make him a RHB only.
I like this move versus giving up real value for 2 years of Kim, who also can't hit.
|
|
|
|
Post by julyanmorley on Jan 24, 2023 12:51:42 GMT -5
People here weren't expecting Taylor to make the 40 man roster cut in the fall, so can't complain about getting Mondesi+ for him.
Even after the ACL, Mondesi rates to be the best baserunner and infield defender on the team. I wouldn't count on him hitting at all, but there's at least a little mystery given he only has 400 PA the last three years. He's a free agent after the year so upside is pretty small on the deal
Mondesi is a luxury 26th man.
|
|
|
|
Post by scottysmalls on Jan 24, 2023 12:52:04 GMT -5
I really like this move. It's one year an oft-injured plus defensive SS with wheels and some pop for three years of a relief pitcher who just missed a full season with back issues. Both players are flawed, but given our relief pitching depth and our hole in the middle infield this makes a ton of sense to me. Mondesi has a pretty high ceiling too, so he'll be a fun player to dream on. He only played 15 games last year and missed a lot of time in just about every previous season as well, but he also produced at roughly a 4 fWAR pace from 2018-2021. He's sort of like a poor man's Byron Buxton that plays SS. One other thing to keep in mind is that signing a free agent SS would have required a DFA, and that DFA would probably have been a reliever like Ort or Brasier. Some were even speculating Rodriguez. Is Taylor that much more valuable than guys like that to worry about giving him up for Mondesi? I think not, especially given the clear need for another middle IF on this roster. And there's also the PTBNL - not expecting a lot given the settled part of the return, but we'll see. Now, if Arroyo and Mondesi could just sync up so that one is always healthy when the other inevitably gets injured, that would be great. This is a good point re; acquisition cost. Are we even certain that Taylor wouldn't have been next on the DFA list anyways? And Mondesi is cheaper $ wise than Andrus or Iglesias likely will be. |
|
|
|
Post by levi on Jan 24, 2023 12:52:50 GMT -5
FWIW, Mondesi’s sprint speed was ~99th percentile from 2016-2020 but dropped to 85th percentile in 2021 and 51st percentile in 2022 (before the ACL injury).
|
|
|
|
Post by The Town Sports Cards on Jan 24, 2023 12:53:44 GMT -5
I mean, there is literally no one the Red Sox could realistically acquire that would put this team into a World Series or bust approach, so all you people complaining that this is "dumpster diving" need a reality check. Whether you think they should be in a win-it-all approach is a different argument, but it's clear this is a year where the goal is to just field an interesting and like-able 70-80 win team (that if everything breaks right could be in the playoffs). So give me all the 1 year lottery tickets in the world. If Mondesi turns back into the .260/.292/.421 ++speed and +defense player he was in 2020-21 then that's a solid guy to have a leg up on when Free Agency rolls around (or the trade deadline if they're out of it).
|
|
|
|
Post by alexcorahomevideo on Jan 24, 2023 12:54:34 GMT -5
Over/Under 250 ABs...
|
|
|
|
Post by incandenza on Jan 24, 2023 12:54:44 GMT -5
Mondesi career wRC+: 79 Andrus career wRC+: 86
Mondesi zips projection: 320 PAs, .240/.277/.383, 79 OPS+, 1.5 WAR Andrus zips projection: 529 PAs, .238/.290/.363, 80 OPS+, 0.9 WAR
Mondesi: 27 years old Andrus: 34 years old
Mondesi: $3 million salary hit Andrus: $8-12 million?
Health is a big question mark. But I like this a lot.
|
|
|
|
Post by scottysmalls on Jan 24, 2023 12:55:11 GMT -5
FWIW, Mondesi’s sprint speed was ~99th percentile from 2016-2020 but dropped to 85th percentile in 2021 and 51st percentile in 2022 (before the ACL injury). Definitely interesting, and 2022 is a super limited sample size for all these metrics, but it didn't noticeably impact his SB or OAA rates if he was slower. |
|
|
|
Post by tjb21 on Jan 24, 2023 12:55:26 GMT -5
The trade is a win.
|
|
|
|
Post by alexcorahomevideo on Jan 24, 2023 12:57:12 GMT -5
Things to like - Switch Hitter - Plus speed. Can readily steal a base prior to the shorter bases. - Has played 2B/SS/3B - Appears solid defensively although not sure what advance metrics might suggest Areas of concern - Coming off of ACL injury - Has never been great getting on base He's never healthy. The good news is that when he gets hurt, Story will be closer to returning. |
|
