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Post by Don Caballero on May 15, 2024 20:33:41 GMT -5
Draymond Green: “no one cares that they’re going back to the Eastern Conference Finals.” He’s kind of right lol. You know you’re far gone the hater bandwagon when you start agreeing with Draymond Green.
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Post by rjp313jr on May 15, 2024 20:40:01 GMT -5
They are 7-1 in the playoffs with only one win being less than 10 points; average victory is well into the double digits and you think they have “no killer instinct”. This is the NBA and these are the playoffs. I don’t care who’s injured or who you’re playing. Beating NBA teams by that much isn’t easy. Also; your timing is great as they go on a nice run in the 4th to go up 14. They’re 7-2, it’s been a nice run against two average teams without their respective best players. To be honest, Boston should be winning all these games by double digits, which they pretty much have been doing. But you can’t act like they are now impervious to criticism. You can criticize any team in the world if you want to. This thread is 90% negative from most of you. The playoffs are usually a dog fight and you’re going to have close games even against less talented opponents. It gets more physical, which mucks things up. You get a Morris going 10/13 for 25 points. The team with no killer instinct just won by 15 by putting the game away down the stretch.
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Post by rjp313jr on May 15, 2024 20:41:59 GMT -5
They are 7-1 in the playoffs with only one win being less than 10 points; average victory is well into the double digits and you think they have “no killer instinct”. This is the NBA and these are the playoffs. I don’t care who’s injured or who you’re playing. Beating NBA teams by that much isn’t easy. Also; your timing is great as they go on a nice run in the 4th to go up 14. How old are you? I can’t tell if this is a serious question or if it what the point of it is. If your handle is any indication I’m younger than you. Old enough to remember the end of the 80s hay day and suffer thru the aftermath.
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Post by capesox on May 15, 2024 20:43:42 GMT -5
Draymond Green: “no one cares that they’re going back to the Eastern Conference Finals.” He’s kind of right lol. You know you’re far gone the hater bandwagon when you start agreeing with Draymond Green. Kind of disgusting that TNT brings in this guy after the suspension and antics he has pulled this year.
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 15,679
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Post by cdj on May 15, 2024 21:04:13 GMT -5
Insert Josh Horford tweet that I posted after last game here
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Post by jodyreidnichols on May 15, 2024 21:35:27 GMT -5
The thing with Tatum is that his weaknesses are all judgment-based, not skill-based. It's not that he's just not a good enough shooter or that he can't keep up on defense. It's that he takes bad iso pull-up threes during clutch moments and complaints to the refs instead of getting back on D. Those are weaknesses that would seem so easy to fix to fans but which persist season after season. I disagree to a degree. Do they still happen and are they a weakness, no doubt. However, they happen less frequently. He's improved and we hold him to a standard that at times are unreasonable and other times warranted.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 15, 2024 21:49:32 GMT -5
If we go by winshares which might not be perfect like war, but best we have. Players peak way before late 20's and early 30s. I looked at MJ, LeBron and Horford to add in not an all-time great. They all peaked age 23/24 and only MJ wasn't on the decline once he hit age 30. Now every player is different. Went and looked at KG, Pierce, Allen, Rondo, KG has the latest peak at age 25 of all the players. So while it's a very limited sample that's 5 HOF players and a maybe in Horford. The type of caliber player Tatum is. Even trying to find the late guys like Butler and Nash, were at age 25 and 28. Nash looks more like the Unicorn than the average. Looked at Curry and Jokic. Good chance we are at the start of Tatums peak years, though I'll certainly hold out hope he's like Nash and has another level in him a few years from now. The average from what I'm seeing of players like Tatum isn't late 20s into early 30s. To be fair i didn’t read this entire study. Player performance statistics data was collected from ESPN and analyzed to help determine at what age players reach their prime productivity levels for a team. The findings suggest that the prime performing age of NBA players is between 27 and 31 years old, with a slight decline in performance after the age of 32. digitalcommons.bryant.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1223&context=eeb#:~:text=Player%20performance%20statistics%20data%20was,after%20the%20age%20of%2032. I think we’d all agree there’s a lot more than statistical performance when it comes to being a winning player. Jordan is a good example of this as he was a better player when he was winning all those chips than he was in his early/mid 20s. Why? Because he was more intelligent. It literally says prime age is 23-27, with decline starting at age 29 which they call slight. That literally almost exactly matches my tiny little study.
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Post by jodyreidnichols on May 15, 2024 21:54:03 GMT -5
They are 7-1 in the playoffs with only one win being less than 10 points; average victory is well into the double digits and you think they have “no killer instinct”. This is the NBA and these are the playoffs. I don’t care who’s injured or who you’re playing. Beating NBA teams by that much isn’t easy. Also; your timing is great as they go on a nice run in the 4th to go up 14. They’re 7-2, it’s been a nice run against two average teams without their respective best players. To be honest, Boston should be winning all these games by double digits, which they pretty much have been doing. But you can’t act like they are now impervious to criticism. Save it for the Finals otherwise the team that made it to the Semi's going 8 and 2 winning nearly every game by double digits by definition makes you the boy that cried wolf. You are not a realist but a nervous nelly. It reminds me of my wife, she'll be wrong 9 times then right the tenth and I ask her do you think this justifies the other 9 times, and I'm dumbfounded when this intelligent person answers yes. Look back at nearly every single Championship year and there were bumps along the way, moments when you could whine about this or that. I'd rather hop on the bus and have it crash then be telling everyone on the bus we are about to crash the whole way. Sure you may be right here and there but good god it's annoying to everyone else. I'd rather take the gut wrenching punch to the stomach and be wrong and believe than tell everyone the sky is falling and be proud of myself the occasional time I'm right. But that's just me. I can take the disappointment because the trip is better when you enjoyed it along the way. This will always be true.
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Post by Montana Lemonious-Craig on May 15, 2024 22:16:18 GMT -5
I don’t know what’s going on with all the weird negativity in here, but I’m pretty happy tonight! Was hoping for a Horford rebound and he beyond delivered. Don’t really care about how they’re winning or how they would do in a hypothetical finals matchup. Just happy that they keep winning
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Post by philarhody on May 15, 2024 22:24:58 GMT -5
They’re 7-2, it’s been a nice run against two average teams without their respective best players. To be honest, Boston should be winning all these games by double digits, which they pretty much have been doing. But you can’t act like they are now impervious to criticism. Save it for the Finals otherwise the team that made it to the Semi's going 8 and 2 winning nearly every game by double digits by definition makes you the boy that cried wolf. You are not a realist but a nervous nelly. It reminds me of my wife, she'll be wrong 9 times then right the tenth and I ask her do you think this justifies the other 9 times, and I'm dumbfounded when this intelligent person answers yes. Look back at nearly every single Championship year and there were bumps along the way, moments when you could whine about this or that. I'd rather hop on the bus and have it crash then be telling everyone on the bus we are about to crash the whole way. Sure you may be right here and there but good god it's annoying to everyone else. I'd rather take the gut wrenching punch to the stomach and be wrong and believe than tell everyone the sky is falling and be proud of myself the occasional time I'm right. But that's just me. I can take the disappointment because the trip is better when you enjoyed it along the way. This will always be true. The fact that you would keep track of 9 times your wife is wrong in a conversation is wild. I’m starting to get a unique insight into your psyche. For you, sports are not a realistic depiction of how one may overcome obstacles or fall short of doing so. For you sports are a whimsical escape from a nightmarish home life. I apologize for robbing you of the balm that has soothed the pounding of your very real trauma.
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Post by philarhody on May 15, 2024 22:27:40 GMT -5
Draymond Green: “no one cares that they’re going back to the Eastern Conference Finals.” He’s kind of right lol. You know you’re far gone the hater bandwagon when you start agreeing with Draymond Green. Like, with anything?
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Post by redsoxfan2 on May 16, 2024 5:39:34 GMT -5
The team has done the expected against mediocre to bad teams. Without Butler or Mitchell, they're bad teams. Not to mention they had other depth injuries.
They had two ugly losses that shouldn't have happened. Maybe losing is fine, but they looked terrible in those two.
Their win over the Cavs to put the series away was way too close for a team without their 1 star player. You could argue Jarret Allen, but he was out too.
This was the best team in the NBA by far. I just want them to look like it in these playoffs. As long as they're winning, and most importantly closing out series, it's fine.
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Post by jmei on May 16, 2024 5:55:15 GMT -5
Save it for the Finals otherwise the team that made it to the Semi's going 8 and 2 winning nearly every game by double digits by definition makes you the boy that cried wolf. You are not a realist but a nervous nelly. It reminds me of my wife, she'll be wrong 9 times then right the tenth and I ask her do you think this justifies the other 9 times, and I'm dumbfounded when this intelligent person answers yes. Look back at nearly every single Championship year and there were bumps along the way, moments when you could whine about this or that. I'd rather hop on the bus and have it crash then be telling everyone on the bus we are about to crash the whole way. Sure you may be right here and there but good god it's annoying to everyone else. I'd rather take the gut wrenching punch to the stomach and be wrong and believe than tell everyone the sky is falling and be proud of myself the occasional time I'm right. But that's just me. I can take the disappointment because the trip is better when you enjoyed it along the way. This will always be true. The fact that you would keep track of 9 times your wife is wrong in a conversation is wild. I’m starting to get a unique insight into your psyche. For you, sports are not a realistic depiction of how one may overcome obstacles or fall short of doing so. For you sports are a whimsical escape from a nightmarish home life. I apologize for robbing you of the balm that has soothed the pounding of your very real trauma. I just warned you about steering clear of the personal stuff. Cut it out.
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Post by jmei on May 16, 2024 9:30:42 GMT -5
Couple quick thoughts:
-Even really good teams lose sometimes, especially in this day and age when three-point shooting variance matters so much. Not a surprise that the two games they lost were games in which they shot really poorly and the other team shot really well. Because the Celtics shoot so many threes, they will be subject to a clunker every now and again based on variance alone. With that said, it's still frustrating to see them play inconsistently and they need to pick it up against better talent - but they've also shown the ability to do that.
-They really missed Porzingis both offensively and defensively versus the Cavs. On offense, his versatility on the pick and roll/pop and ability to post up mismatches really supercharges their offense and helps prevent those stagnant periods where they just pass the ball around the perimeter but don't get into the paint. Defensively, you saw both Horford and Kornet get hurt on switches and against a more athletic big in Mobley.
-The Cavs were definitely hurt by not having Mitchell (especially) and Allen, but it didn't hurt them as much as you'd think. They were able to fill in with players who were better at stretching the floor and needed the ball less in their hands (Strus, Wade, Morris, Niang, Merrill), which gave them better spacing and juiced up their offense. Of course, it also really hurt their defense, which sunk them in the end, but the point is that their regular starting lineup had some clunky fits (Mitchell/Garland and Allen/Mobley) and so losing those guys negatively impacted their team less than you'd expect based on talent alone.
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mobaz
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Posts: 3,018
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Post by mobaz on May 16, 2024 9:47:19 GMT -5
I think a really smart move would be for Orlando to lay out the red carpet for Mitchell. I think he'd be a great fit on a young team, and accelerate their growth, letting Franz be cast as a 3rd banana on a good team (which is what he looked more like this season). Not sure of the mechanics or cost. Basically Orlando would be doing what Cleveland tried to do by getting Mitchell in the first place.
Cleveland can reset as Garland/Mobley team, which is high risk but seems more likely to work than their two-tiny-guard team. Let Mobley and Garland sink or swim.
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Post by rjp313jr on May 16, 2024 11:13:20 GMT -5
I think the Celtics need to blow it up after this season. Tatum is on the downside of his peak and doesn’t have the IT factor that guys like Shai and Edwards have. We have to get rid of his lazy effort and find a new coach who’s more like Ime. It’s tiring watching a bunch of losers.
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Post by rjp313jr on May 16, 2024 12:02:54 GMT -5
I hope people fall for this meaningless crap so we can deal him for a real star or at least enough picks so we can find a real one.
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Post by Don Caballero on May 16, 2024 12:59:53 GMT -5
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Post by rhswanzey on May 16, 2024 13:05:07 GMT -5
I hope people fall for this meaningless crap so we can deal him for a real star or at least enough picks so we can find a real one. That's the first time anyone has led in all five categories in a playoff series - including all players from both teams- since LeBron in the 2016 finals
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Post by Don Caballero on May 16, 2024 13:18:55 GMT -5
I hope people fall for this meaningless crap so we can deal him for a real star or at least enough picks so we can find a real one. That's the first time anyone has led in all five categories in a playoff series - including all players from both teams- since LeBron in the 2016 finals And only the second time in 50 years.
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Post by rjp313jr on May 16, 2024 13:29:59 GMT -5
I hope people fall for this meaningless crap so we can deal him for a real star or at least enough picks so we can find a real one. That's the first time anyone has led in all five categories in a playoff series - including all players from both teams- since LeBron in the 2016 finals He’s spoiled “super-star” carried by his teammates.
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Post by jmei on May 16, 2024 13:40:43 GMT -5
I hope people fall for this meaningless crap so we can deal him for a real star or at least enough picks so we can find a real one. To be fair, he also shot 27.3% from three and 44.1% overall in this series (and 28.1%/43.0% for the playoffs). The rebounds and assists are a great sign, but the scoring has been pretty inefficient.
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Post by jmei on May 16, 2024 13:47:44 GMT -5
This is kind of what I'm talking about. It's literally in the rulebook that "overt actions indicating resentment to a call or no-call" results in a technical foul, but he keeps doing it in his seventh year in the league. It's a little thing but should be so easy to fix. Stuff like this and the iso pullup stuff has persisted across three coaching staffs so it's more of a Tatum issue than a coaching issue.
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Post by rjp313jr on May 16, 2024 14:15:42 GMT -5
I hope people fall for this meaningless crap so we can deal him for a real star or at least enough picks so we can find a real one. To be fair, he also shot 27.3% from three and 44.1% overall in this series (and 28.1%/43.0% for the playoffs). The rebounds and assists are a great sign, but the scoring has been pretty inefficient. You don’t have to tell me; he’s over-rated and should be traded. His TS% (56.5) is only slightly above average for the playoffs and over 60% the last 3 games, but that’s only 3 games can’t count on him if he’s not efficient every game like Luka and his 41/28/77 splits (52% TS). No way Dallas deals him so maybe we can get a real offensive stud like Brunson and his 54.3 TS% on 45/30/78 splits.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on May 16, 2024 14:40:10 GMT -5
To be fair, he also shot 27.3% from three and 44.1% overall in this series (and 28.1%/43.0% for the playoffs). The rebounds and assists are a great sign, but the scoring has been pretty inefficient. You don’t have to tell me; he’s over-rated and should be traded. His TS% (56.5) is only slightly above average for the playoffs and over 60% the last 3 games, but that’s only 3 games can’t count on him if he’s not efficient every game like Luka and his 41/28/77 splits (52% TS). No way Dallas deals him so maybe we can get a real offensive stud like Brunson and his 54.3 TS% on 45/30/78 splits. The Celtics played 2 mid teams without their best players and are likely playing the Knicks who lose a player every game. It's really not that impressive of a stat line. Tatum has been solid. Not spectacular, but solid. I would hope the soon-to-be highest paid player in the NBA would be one of the best players in the playoffs. The Celtics have the best team in the NBA and tend to have a different guy be a major contributor and then do nothing on another night whereas Tatum is usually steady and consistent. I don't think anyone questioned them not making the Finals. Has their current performance made you believe they can beat the best team in the West? That has a major question mark for me right now. I'm hoping KP gets back healthy and they'll win the Finals. They have the talent to do it. It's not like they haven't earned the critique. They were favored over the Heat last year, got down 1-3, Smart did a typical Smart thing and took a bad shot thar almost lost game 6 before D White decided to be Superman, but then they no-showed at home after the Tatum injury. Brown completely forgot how to dribble the basketball. I believe their home record in the playoffs the last few years is actually under .500, which is also kind of impressive considering they make the ECF every year. I'm not excited for the squad to be the Buffalo Bills of the NBA. They need to punch in their ticket because this might be the very best team they'll ever have with the Js.
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