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Post by johnsilver52 on Oct 29, 2013 13:09:09 GMT -5
The Sox upper levels right now is like a machine producing talent now for IF at the 3b-2b position and they don't need anyone blocking any of those places at Portland, Pawtucket, even Salem the number of plus prospects and competition is so high. It was great that they finally benched and switched positions for Vitek, but lets not keep hoping that the team will sit people over others to get the better prospect more playing time.
Next year there will be a Betts/Coyle AB race going on at salem and neither is ready yet to advance to Portland, yet both need AB at high A ball there. Catching at Pawtucket will be interesting with vazquez, Butler and Lavarnway if he is still around. Very curious to see how AB's and rep's behind the plate especially are awarded.
Vinicio and Lin ant Grenville? Who gets the AB there.
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Post by James Dunne on Oct 29, 2013 13:25:10 GMT -5
Lin.
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Post by johnsilver52 on Oct 29, 2013 14:24:58 GMT -5
Point well taken and I respect that Lin is the better prospect, though think that Vinicio might still have possibilities also and already has 2 seasons at Greeneville and isn't ready for Salem yet. What of him? Does he get promoted anyway, or does Lin get the jump a year younger than Lin not deserving, not yet understanding the language even? Could Vinicio stick at Greenville and become another Mneneses? Think his ceiling is higher than that. Just questions James and not trying to put you on any kind of spot, why was asking all of this to start with all the depth Boston has. |
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Post by rjp313jr on Oct 29, 2013 14:33:40 GMT -5
Coyle is basically a non prospect at this point until he shows drastic improvement. If he's at Salem for a 3rd year in a row there is little change he's affecting Betts playing time. Betts has pushed himself into the discussion as a top 10 prospect in a deep system. For me he still has a lot to show, but Coyle has shown me enough that I have no expectations of him. Would I be shocked if he made the major leagues? No, but until the 5'8 guy cuts his K rate below 25% I'm not so interested.
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Post by sbones13 on Oct 29, 2013 14:43:16 GMT -5
Some of these guys will just get promoted anyway, won't they? Kind of like Ryan Dent. He never did anything to warrant getting promoted from Salem, but if you aren't QUITE ready to let him go you just promote him and pray, I guess.
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Post by jmei on Oct 29, 2013 15:45:39 GMT -5
I split this discussion into its own thread.
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Post by jmei on Oct 29, 2013 16:05:04 GMT -5
Coyle is basically a non prospect at this point until he shows drastic improvement. If he's at Salem for a 3rd year in a row there is little change he's affecting Betts playing time. Betts has pushed himself into the discussion as a top 10 prospect in a deep system. For me he still has a lot to show, but Coyle has shown me enough that I have no expectations of him. Would I be shocked if he made the major leagues? No, but until the 5'8 guy cuts his K rate below 25% I'm not so interested. I strongly, strongly disagree with this. Coyle, in my mind, is one of the frontrunners for 2014 Comeback Player of the Year. I think you're focusing too much on what he can't do and not enough on what he can do. His .272 ISO was the second highest in the Carolina League, which is extremely impressive considering his age (21) and position. He posted an above-average 10.7% walk rate as well, while stealing 11 bases (in just 224 PAs) without being caught. His defense is average-to-better at second base, and might have the arm to play 3B or the outfield (but that's personal conjecture). Yes, his plate discipline needs a good amount of work, but he'll still be slightly age-advanced even if he repeats Salem to start the season, especially when you consider that he missed half a season of development time in 2013 due to injuries. Write him off at your own peril-- I, for one, will be ready with a chorus of I-told-you-sos when he cracks the top 15 by July. |
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Post by elguapo on Oct 29, 2013 16:11:49 GMT -5
The SP 2014 rosters page has Betts & Coyle at AA and I concur.
Coyle was already repeating at Salem and had a major breakout season interrupted by injury. Time to move him up a level and let him work through adjustments as necessary. He'll only be 22 next season which is still age-advanced for AA. Just because he's not top 10 doesn't mean he's dirt.
Betts destroyed Salem and seems to be continuing his success in fall league, and should continue to move quickly.
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Post by nebraska4sox on Oct 29, 2013 16:17:09 GMT -5
What do we make of David Chester? He has the body type you like to see in a first baseman. I know he doesnt play middle infield but he plays infield none the less. Hopefully his power continues to develop
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Post by Oregon Norm on Oct 29, 2013 16:24:43 GMT -5
Agree with jmei and guapo here. There's a bit to recommend Coyle, some of it probably masked by the injury. And given the team's stated desire for positional flexibility, there are probably ample at bats for each of them also, even if they're both in Portland.
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Post by jmei on Oct 29, 2013 16:33:29 GMT -5
What do we make of David Chester? He has the body type you like to see in a first baseman. I know he doesnt play middle infield but he plays infield none the less. Hopefully his power continues to develop He was very old for his league last year (24 in Greenville and Salem), so you have to take his stats with a (big) grain of salt. He was drafted as a college senior in the 33rd round, and while he has a bit of power, none of his other tools stand out. He looks like a good org player to me, although he'll have the opportunity to prove he has a higher ceiling than that since there are few other 1B prospects in the organization. |
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Post by Guidas on Oct 29, 2013 16:37:41 GMT -5
I'm all for giving Betts reps in CF. Increases his value to the org and in general if he can learn to track fly balls. CF also gives the best view of pitch and ball for the OF. He has the wheels and the arm can't be any worse than Damon's. If he continues to get on base at the same relative rate as he did at lower levels it seems like a natural progression - and there's no reason he still can't play 2nd, as well (Zobrist).
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Post by johnsilver52 on Oct 29, 2013 16:58:39 GMT -5
I'm all for giving Betts reps in CF. Increases his value to the org and in general if he can learn to track fly balls. CF also gives the best view of pitch and ball for the OF. He has the wheels and the arm can't be any worse than Damon's. If he continues to get on base at the same relative rate as he did at lower levels it seems like a natural progression - and there's no reason he still can't play 2nd, as well (Zobrist). Am for trying him in the OF either this year or next myself as well, especially if his bat continues to fast track him up the charts like it has. This guy doesn't need to be one of those trade bait type players and could just be a speedy guy to lead off for years to come. Who knows? A CoCo Crisp type out there? Tremendous speed and the ability to just put the bat on the ball as did Crisp when he played for the Sox? He seems like a keeper and would like during the spring for the minor league gurus to be figuring out a positional change his tools would mold into long term. Nice points Guidas. |
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Post by jmei on Oct 29, 2013 17:07:14 GMT -5
I think they try Betts at SS before they put him in the outfield. I know that he was reportedly uncomfortable at SS in Lowell a couple years ago and that he looked much better (at the plate) when he was shifted to 2B, but he has the athleticism and arm to handle SS, as well as some past experience there. Plus, Crockett repeatedly called him a middle infielder and implied that that would be the first position he would branch out to.
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Post by johnsilver52 on Oct 29, 2013 17:10:28 GMT -5
SS would be even better JMEI, if Bogaerts moved over to 3b in a couple years and Betts improvements continued.
Just figured that since his original position was SS and he was moved off of it that there was issues at it for him?
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steveofbradenton
Veteran
Watching Spring Training, the FCL, and the Florida State League
Posts: 1,827
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Post by steveofbradenton on Oct 29, 2013 19:18:10 GMT -5
Little surprised that Deven Marrero has not been brought up when the thread is on Organizational middle infield depth chart . Throw in Wendell Rijo too! But back to Marrero, I still like this kid a lot and I like my shortstops to be solid defensively. After watching Drew in the play-offs, everyone understands the importance of his glove. Is there a better glove in our system at short than Deven (not talking Drew)?
Not sold on Middlebrooks at 3rd yet and maybe never will be, so I can see Xander playing quite a bot of 3rd (even next year). We all fell in love with Iglesias' glove and for good reason. Marrero may be a step down, but it sounds like he could be really good along with an average bat (in the future).
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Post by nebraska4sox on Oct 29, 2013 20:03:50 GMT -5
What do we make of David Chester? He has the body type you like to see in a first baseman. I know he doesnt play middle infield but he plays infield none the less. Hopefully his power continues to develop He was very old for his league last year (24 in Greenville and Salem), so you have to take his stats with a (big) grain of salt. He was drafted as a college senior in the 33rd round, and while he has a bit of power, none of his other tools stand out. He looks like a good org player to me, although he'll have the opportunity to prove he has a higher ceiling than that since there are few other 1B prospects in the organization. That makes sense. Hopefully he can DH for awhile, maybe that will be his best bet to get to the league. Does anyone know if Stefan Welch is still with the organization? All I remember reading is this guy could hit and hit and hit, hope we did not let a guy like him get away. Is Michael Almanzar going to move to third or have they thought about letting him go, he is an atrocious fielder |
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Post by nebraska4sox on Oct 29, 2013 20:06:18 GMT -5
I watched Devon Marrero play a lot in College as he was in the CWS twice and watched him in Regionals and supers both years. He handles a bat well and has good speed. Great range at short and doesn't seem to make mistakes. Has very good instincts. He looks to be like another middle infielder that the Sox have from ASU  |
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Post by Steve Henley on Oct 30, 2013 10:55:17 GMT -5
Does anyone know if Stefan Welch is still with the organization? All I remember reading is this guy could hit and hit and hit, hope we did not let a guy like him get away. Is Michael Almanzar going to move to third or have they thought about letting him go, he is an atrocious fielder Welch is a minor league free agent, and the Sox might end up re-signing him but I don't think he's anything more than a JAG. He just turned 25, and 2013 was his 5th season at High-A and his first where he cracked an OPS of .800 (although in 2011 he had an OPS of .799). If the Sox are looking to alleviate the Betts/Coyle logjam by giving one or both some time at third base it probably doesn't make sense to re-sign Welch. |
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Post by hammerhead on Oct 30, 2013 12:18:43 GMT -5
Almanzar wouldn't be moving TO third he would be moving off of third. Almanzar is very interesting to me. I think he could round himself into a very good defensive 1stbaseman with a lot of hard work. Everything I have heard though has said that that is the problem he's not willing to put in the work. He is loaded with talent and has made some nice strides the last couple years although the last 1/4 of the year last season was meh. Maybe something clicks for him and he wakes up to the fact that he needs to work day in and day out to make it.
The good thing is I don't think there is any chance he gets drafted in the Rule 5 , because he is pretty far from sticking on a major league roster.
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Post by nebraska4sox on Oct 30, 2013 13:23:35 GMT -5
With the tools Almanzar has its a shame that he has as you say a bad work ethic. Would be nice to see him turn it around
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