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Top of the roation starter
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Post by jrffam05 on Oct 2, 2015 12:11:01 GMT -5
Another offseason, Cafardo is still employed, and DD is in charge. That means we get to hear a media rhetoric dominated by the Red Sox need to acquire an ace. I will admit, I think this year it makes more sense to go after a top of the rotation starter, as it seems obvious that it is the teams weak point. So I'll start the trade proposals off.
To me, Carrasco and Quintana stick out the most as targets (along with the Mets staff, which maybe I'll get to). They seem to be held at a tier slightly below the Sale group, but still come with 5 years of cheap control and relative youth. Both of them are on teams where they are not the best starter, even though that really means nothing. I haven't fit the jigsaw puzzle together yet, but here's my opening offer.
Quintana for
Swihart
Castillo,
Choice of Miley, Kelly, or Owens.
The Red Sox get their staff lead while also reducing their payroll, and opening two spots on the 40 man. It does open up a hole in the outfield without an obvious replacement, cuts down on our catching depth, and gives away what could be a very very good catcher. Some of the savings could be used to get another outfielder or more pitching
The White Sox downgrade their starter 2-3+ WAR, but round out their roster, getting the best young catcher in the game, and an third outfielder who at 1.5 War a year is on a market contract and has much more upside. They have the choice of a veteran middle of the pack pitcher, a pitcher with ACE tools that hasn't put it together, or a prospect who is just breaking into the league. All three probably suit up for CWS on opening day, for a team that is very top heavy. In the unlikely event that the CWS want Margot instead of Swihart or Castillo, we can accommodate.
Thoughts?
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Post by gregblossersbelly on Oct 3, 2015 7:43:14 GMT -5
Aces don't give up as many hits as innings pitched. See Porcello. You're giving up way too much.
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Post by sibbysisti on Oct 3, 2015 7:55:42 GMT -5
I include Swihart only in a trade for one of the top young starters, i.e. Gray, DeGrom, Cole, to name a few. Good young catchers are harder to find than TOTR starters, especially switch hitters batting .270, showing developing power and improving defense. Besides, we don't know yet how Vasquez will fare post surgery. Will he show the promise he displayed last season, or be stunted like Wieters?
Buchholz is likely to return and DD should try to sign Rich Hill. I'd make Miley expendable as it appears the starting staff is well armed with southpaws, including Brian Johnson.
And I, for one, am glad Cafardo is still around. I didn't like his campaign to recruit Hamels but he is a respected writer who is constantly with the club. As Yogi once said" "you can observe a lot by watching".
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Oct 3, 2015 8:54:06 GMT -5
Another offseason, Cafardo is still employed, and DD is in charge. That means we get to hear a media rhetoric dominated by the Red Sox need to acquire an ace. I will admit, I think this year it makes more sense to go after a top of the rotation starter, as it seems obvious that it is the teams weak point. So I'll start the trade proposals off. To me, Carrasco and Quintana stick out the most as targets (along with the Mets staff, which maybe I'll get to). They seem to be held at a tier slightly below the Sale group, but still come with 5 years of cheap control and relative youth. Both of them are on teams where they are not the best starter, even though that really means nothing. I haven't fit the jigsaw puzzle together yet, but here's my opening offer. Quintana for Swihart Castillo, Choice of Miley, Kelly, or Owens. The Red Sox get their staff lead while also reducing their payroll, and opening two spots on the 40 man. It does open up a hole in the outfield without an obvious replacement, cuts down on our catching depth, and gives away what could be a very very good catcher. Some of the savings could be used to get another outfielder or more pitching The White Sox downgrade their starter 2-3+ WAR, but round out their roster, getting the best young catcher in the game, and an third outfielder who at 1.5 War a year is on a market contract and has much more upside. They have the choice of a veteran middle of the pack pitcher, a pitcher with ACE tools that hasn't put it together, or a prospect who is just breaking into the league. All three probably suit up for CWS on opening day, for a team that is very top heavy. In the unlikely event that the CWS want Margot instead of Swihart or Castillo, we can accommodate. Thoughts? I wouldn't give up Owens and Swihart and Castillo for Quintana. No. That's too much. I'm sure Owens would have to go but I wouldn't surrender Swihart. I'd be fine with parting with Castillo, Vazquez, and Miley or Kelly, but that wouldn't get it done. If they demanded Owens I'd have to think about that. My inclination would be to say no. I know there are concerns with Owens and Swihart, but these guys are not finished products. I really think in time Owens's control will improve enough to make him a very effective pitcher and I think in time Swihart will be an all-star caliber catcher. Quintana is good, but not enough to the point that I move both players. |
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Post by telson13 on Oct 3, 2015 10:07:02 GMT -5
Another offseason, Cafardo is still employed, and DD is in charge. That means we get to hear a media rhetoric dominated by the Red Sox need to acquire an ace. I will admit, I think this year it makes more sense to go after a top of the rotation starter, as it seems obvious that it is the teams weak point. So I'll start the trade proposals off. To me, Carrasco and Quintana stick out the most as targets (along with the Mets staff, which maybe I'll get to). They seem to be held at a tier slightly below the Sale group, but still come with 5 years of cheap control and relative youth. Both of them are on teams where they are not the best starter, even though that really means nothing. I haven't fit the jigsaw puzzle together yet, but here's my opening offer. Quintana for Swihart Castillo, Choice of Miley, Kelly, or Owens. The Red Sox get their staff lead while also reducing their payroll, and opening two spots on the 40 man. It does open up a hole in the outfield without an obvious replacement, cuts down on our catching depth, and gives away what could be a very very good catcher. Some of the savings could be used to get another outfielder or more pitching The White Sox downgrade their starter 2-3+ WAR, but round out their roster, getting the best young catcher in the game, and an third outfielder who at 1.5 War a year is on a market contract and has much more upside. They have the choice of a veteran middle of the pack pitcher, a pitcher with ACE tools that hasn't put it together, or a prospect who is just breaking into the league. All three probably suit up for CWS on opening day, for a team that is very top heavy. In the unlikely event that the CWS want Margot instead of Swihart or Castillo, we can accommodate. Thoughts? You're admittedly trading "the best young catcher in the game" for a fair #2 starter who gives up more hits than IP? And you're tossing in your best MLB-ready pitching prospect and an extremely dependable #4 starter and a starting OF to boot? Seems like giving a ton away for a pitcher who's not a TOR guy. I'd maybe trade Swihart if Sale, Gray, or Syndergaard were involved. And Owens in two years is a reasonable bet to approach Quintana. They're better off signing Price (or Cueto), not creating a giant hole at C again, keeping their OF intact (are you proposing signing Heyward or someone else to fill the Castillo's spot?), letting Owens develop, and making a trade for a SP at the deadline if they need one...once questions about Vazquez, Castillo, and Owens are, if not answered, at least more clear. |
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Post by telson13 on Oct 3, 2015 10:14:12 GMT -5
I include Swihart only in a trade for one of the top young starters, i.e. Gray, DeGrom, Cole, to name a few. Good young catchers are harder to find than TOTR starters, especially switch hitters batting .270, showing developing power and improving defense. Besides, we don't know yet how Vasquez will fare post surgery. Will he show the promise he displayed last season, or be stunted like Wieters? Buchholz is likely to return and DD should try to sign Rich Hill. I'd make Miley expendable as it appears the starting staff is well armed with southpaws, including Brian Johnson. And I, for one, am glad Cafardo is still around. I didn't like his campaign to recruit Hamels but he is a respected writer who is constantly with the club. As Yogi once said" "you can observe a lot by watching". Nick Cafardo recently wrote a whole article on, essentially, whether or not the team's good play was hurting them by worsening their draft position. He then proceeded to talk about the ***NEED*** (he's so emphatic) to sign a TOR free agent like Price, Cueto, or Zimmerman (?really). He made the point that they'd be giving up a high pick and might be dissuaded from signing a pitcher for that reason...and tried to make the point that the draft pick wasn't really very valuable anyway. Never mind that Cueto and Price **were traded in-season and CAN'T BE QO'D!!** The guy doesn't even know the basics about the sport he covers daily. True story. |
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Post by sibbysisti on Oct 3, 2015 11:24:02 GMT -5
Could you cite the article? I'm having trouble accessing it via Globe archive. Could it be that he was referring to Zimmermann, who, most likely, will receive a QO? Or another potential FA TOTR guy to be QO'd, and lumped them in with Cueto and Price?
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Post by telson13 on Oct 3, 2015 22:37:55 GMT -5
Could you cite the article? I'm having trouble accessing it via Globe archive. Could it be that he was referring to Zimmermann, who, most likely, will receive a QO? Or another potential FA TOTR guy to be QO'd, and lumped them in with Cueto and Price? It was sometime around Sept 13/14/15. He mentioned all three, with no differentiation as to compensation. In fact, the whole crux of the article was how signing a FA would be a huge conundrum. I just was shocked by how uninformed he was regarding the new CBA...or else he was blatantly trying to sensationalize by manufacturing a "predicament." He's actually a fairly good "writer," it's just that his articles are often a bit too much of writing and short on (logical) analysis...and way too editorial (with a lot of bad ideas, IMO). I will say this: I've emailed both Cafardo and Dan Shaughnessey, and both responded promptly and thoughtfully, especially Shaughnessy, who actually complimented *me* on my writing. That was a trip. So as much as I bust on Globe writers sometimes, they're professionals, and pretty good guys. Except Pete Abraham, I found him snarky and he sounded like a navel-gazer. |
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