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Jeremy Kapstein’s contract not renewed
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Post by grandsalami on Oct 31, 2015 18:51:12 GMT -5
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Post by jamesmcgillstatue on Nov 1, 2015 19:35:52 GMT -5
Whether it was selective memory or just incompetence, Nick does not mention Kapstein's role in the breakup of the mid-to-late 1970s Red Sox. I say, however, that he was doing his job as a good agent. And the breakup was aided, abetted and basically created by a bumbling Red Sox front office led by Jean Yawkey, Haywood Sullivan and Buddy LeRoux.
The 1975-76 Messersmith-McNally-Peter Seitz arbitration ruling destroyed the reserve clause in player contracts. Carlton Fisk, Rick Burleson and Fred Lynn, the up-the-middle core of the pennant-winning 1975 Red Sox, had not signed new contracts when the ruling was handed down. (And multi-year deals in baseball were unheard of then. Why bother, the owners reasoned, when the reserve clause forced players to sign with their current club, or stay out of OB altogether?) During that 1975-76 offseason, Kapstein, their agent, advised them to stay unsigned, which infuriated Tom Yawkey (dying from leukemia but still very much the owner of the Red Sox), his wife, Jean, and Sullivan, who (although he was serving in the role of director of scouting at the time) was their fair-haired boy in the front office. (Although in truth Sully had had a chrome dome since the late 1960s.) Tom Yawkey, however, still believed that Dick O'Connell was the right man to be the Sox' evp/general manager, which in those days put him in Lucchino-esque control of both business and baseball operations.
Fisk, Lynn and Burleson did not "hold out," however; they simply played the first few months of 1976 under the reserve clause (as their "option year") and remained unsigned for 1977. This was the source of massive talk-show fodder on 1510 AM, the Red Sox' new flagship station and carrier of Clif Keane and Larry Claflin's "Clif and Claf" talk show. They were house men for the Red Sox and Kapstein was vilified -- as Howard Slusher would be the next year by holding out Leon Gray and John Hannah.
The Sox started 1976 horribly. They recovered but were outfought by the cheap-shotting Yankees in that famous brawl at the Toilet. Yawkey (unknown to the general public) was on his deathbed. Manager Darrell Johnson was hitting the sauce. O'Connell tried to shake things up by buying Fingers and Rudi from Oakland for $1m each, but Bowie Kuhn stopped that. At some point that summer (Yawkey died in early July and I can't remember if O'C got this done before that happened), O'Connell got Kapstein "in a room" and signed Fisk, Burleson and Lynn to "big money" (for the time) contracts through 1980 with an option for 1981.
Jean Yawkey was furious. She thought the players were traitors for daring NOT to sign the contracts they had initially been offered by the team. She claimed that her dying husband had been horribly offended by their act of impudence and rebellion and had ordered O'Connell to let the ingrates walk. (One might suspect that Tom Y was "player friendly" during the reserve clause era, but once the players got the power of free agency through the Seitz decision, old Tom would have turned into a reactionary of the first rank. He died before that possibility would have been tested.) Jean was supported in her opinion by Sullivan, who had been shunted aside by Dick O'Connell -- demoted from, if you will, co-general manager (he was always on the dais with O'C during the major new conferences of the late 1960s) to scouting director when Neil Mahoney died in 1973. Sullivan and O'Connell were members of rival groups who were organizing to buy the Red Sox after Mrs. Yawkey put them up for sale in 1977. Sullivan had been ruthlessly sucking up to the Yawkeys, especially Jean.
Mrs. Yawkey, of course, chose the Sullivan group (headed by LeRoux), although its bid was supposedly far lower than competing syndicates. She fired O'Connell after the 1977 season and gave Sullivan the general manager's job before the American League could even approve the sale. (Which they did only when Mrs. Y reinvested in the team as co-general partner in 1978). Don Zimmer almost wrecked Fisk's career by catching him in 1,316 and 1,355 innings in 1977-78 -- and in 1979 when Fisk had to go on the DL for the first two months of the season with a bad arm, Sullivan called him a malingerer. That set the stage for almost 20 years of bad blood between Fisk and the Red Sox regime.
In 1980, as the clock was ticking on their contracts, Fisk was 33 (with a dozen years of MLB left in him), Burleson 29 and Lynn 28. The players and Sullivan were at an impasse. Surprisingly, Sullivan pulled off a great trade -- Burleson (and Hobson) to the Angels for Carney Lansford and Mark Clear. (Lansford gave them two fine years, and Burleson wrecked his throwing shoulder in Anaheim.) But then Haywood missed the deadline for offering 1981 contracts to Fisk and Lynn -- and according to the CBA of the time, triggering binding arbitration that would decide whether or not they were instant free agents. Sully then traded Lynn to Anaheim, too, getting back washed-up Joe Rudi, sore-armed former fireballer Frank Tanana, and 32-year-old weak-hitting CF Rick Miller. But he couldn't find a taker for Fisk before Pudge was declared a free agent, and he signed, almost right away, with the White Sox.
Four months or so later, I sat in the RF bleachers for the home opener against the White Sox. The up-the-middle of the Red Sox was now Gary Allenson, Glenn Hoffman and Miller. Allenson hit a solo homer to give the Sox a 2-0 lead in the seventh (thanks for the details, Retrosheet!). But Fisk was behind the plate for the ChiSox and he hit a three-run bomb off Bob Stanley in the eighth to put Chicago ahead 3-2 and they never looked back. The absence of Fisk, native New Englander and quintessential Red Sox player, was for many of us the story of the team during the 1980s, at least before 1986. But the loss of Lynn in center field, especially his bat, was also keenly felt. His desire was questioned by Clif, Claf and their ilk -- he was not an "iron man" -- and many stories were written (which Lynn has since denied) that he hated Boston and pined for his native Southern California. But he may have given them another 3-5 years of power hitting and elite defense. (True, Burleson hurt his arm so if you look at both Angel trades as one megadeal it was a wash, but then in 1982 the Sox decided they didn't want to pay Lansford, so they wheeled him to Oakland for Tony Armas. Boggs could have played first base if Lansford had stayed here.)
So, anyway, Kapstein. I'm not sure when he ceased being Fisk's, Lynn's and Burleson's agent, but in my mind he was a bigger "playah" with the Red Sox from 1976-80 than he was from 2002 until a few days ago.
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Post by GyIantosca on Nov 1, 2015 23:25:04 GMT -5
Looking back that was the dark years.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Nov 2, 2015 1:29:06 GMT -5
Looking back that was the dark years. I would say the early 90s from about 1992 to 1994 were just as dark if not darker. I was stunned that Duquette was able to come in and turn around the Red Sox so quickly. They had three losing seasons and only the strike saved the Sox from bottoming out in 1994. I appreciate the long post about Kapstein and the Sox of that era. I remember all of those trade rumors in Dec 1980 regarding Burleson, Hobson, and Lynn, and I remember the Sox botching the Fisk contract and I remember his opening day HR to beat the Sox in 1981. Haywood Sullivan was awful. Mrs. Yawkey was a spiteful woman, it seemed. I remember reading that Dominic DiMaggio tried to buy the team. Can't help but wonder what that would have been like. And when Coup LeRoux happened in 1983 during the gathering of the 1967 squad honoring the fallen Tony C, it was a disgrace. It was surprising to me that LeRoux had placed Dick O'Connell back in charge. Hard to imagine those two in alliance. Wonder how history would have changed had LeRoux wrestled control of the team from Sullivan and Yawkey. He was a shyster, too, but O'Connell had been a competent GM, something Sullivan could never aspire to. Out of that mess, Lou Gorman became the GM, and that lead toward the building of the 1986 AL Championship team. And eventually Sullivan fell out of favor with Mrs. Yawkey and John Harrington became her golden boy, and would be the one to sell to John Henry.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Nov 2, 2015 1:32:15 GMT -5
One other thing, we'll never know what Mr. Yawkey did think of O'Connell getting Fingers and Rudi in 1976.
The Sullivan camp was of the opinion that Mr. Yawkey was livid and wanted O'Connell fired.
O'Connell's version was that Mr. Yawkey was only disappointed that O'Connell hadn't come away with Sal Bando, too.
It makes sense that Mr. Yawkey would have probably fallen in line with the other owners, but at that point he knew he didn't have long to live, and was at that point perhaps only hoping to see one more chance at a Championship, money be damned.
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Post by sibbysisti on Nov 2, 2015 10:11:12 GMT -5
Nick Cafardo, in his Sunday Globe column, wrote a nice piece about Jeremy. I was impressed that, after selling the Padres for Joan Kroc, he spent ten years in the San Diego area, doing work for the homeless. Quite a guy.
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Post by jamesmcgillstatue on Nov 3, 2015 8:57:37 GMT -5
Looking back that was the dark years. I would say the early 90s from about 1992 to 1994 were just as dark if not darker. I was stunned that Duquette was able to come in and turn around the Red Sox so quickly. They had three losing seasons and only the strike saved the Sox from bottoming out in 1994. I appreciate the long post about Kapstein and the Sox of that era. I remember all of those trade rumors in Dec 1980 regarding Burleson, Hobson, and Lynn, and I remember the Sox botching the Fisk contract and I remember his opening day HR to beat the Sox in 1981. Haywood Sullivan was awful. Mrs. Yawkey was a spiteful woman, it seemed. I remember reading that Dominic DiMaggio tried to buy the team. Can't help but wonder what that would have been like. And when Coup LeRoux happened in 1983 during the gathering of the 1967 squad honoring the fallen Tony C, it was a disgrace. It was surprising to me that LeRoux had placed Dick O'Connell back in charge. Hard to imagine those two in alliance. Wonder how history would have changed had LeRoux wrestled control of the team from Sullivan and Yawkey. He was a shyster, too, but O'Connell had been a competent GM, something Sullivan could never aspire to. Out of that mess, Lou Gorman became the GM, and that lead toward the building of the 1986 AL Championship team. And eventually Sullivan fell out of favor with Mrs. Yawkey and John Harrington became her golden boy, and would be the one to sell to John Henry. I think what made the early 1980s so dispiriting (from my vantage point) is that the 1975 Red Sox, with a young ball club, seemed so set up to keep winning. Mistakes by the FO (as much as I bemoan the Sullivan-LeRoux ascendancy, O'Connell made them, too, like dealing Cecil Cooper for George Scott and Bernie Carbo) and their decisions to purge the team of malcontents like Jenkins and Carbo by selling incredibly low in 1977-78 and to opt out completely from the free agent market put incredible pressure on their farm system to keep them competitive. Boggs was a mistake -- he had to hit himself onto the team as a utility man. Tudor was traded for offense (would they have needed Easler if they had managed to hold onto Lynn or Lansford?) before he blossomed. The Schiraldi-Ojeda deal helped win the Sox the pennant in 1986, but was a boon for the Mets in the WS. And until the whole Coup LeRoux blowup in June 1983 it seemed that the front office would just plod on forever.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Nov 3, 2015 13:41:59 GMT -5
I would say the early 90s from about 1992 to 1994 were just as dark if not darker. I was stunned that Duquette was able to come in and turn around the Red Sox so quickly. They had three losing seasons and only the strike saved the Sox from bottoming out in 1994. I appreciate the long post about Kapstein and the Sox of that era. I remember all of those trade rumors in Dec 1980 regarding Burleson, Hobson, and Lynn, and I remember the Sox botching the Fisk contract and I remember his opening day HR to beat the Sox in 1981. Haywood Sullivan was awful. Mrs. Yawkey was a spiteful woman, it seemed. I remember reading that Dominic DiMaggio tried to buy the team. Can't help but wonder what that would have been like. And when Coup LeRoux happened in 1983 during the gathering of the 1967 squad honoring the fallen Tony C, it was a disgrace. It was surprising to me that LeRoux had placed Dick O'Connell back in charge. Hard to imagine those two in alliance. Wonder how history would have changed had LeRoux wrestled control of the team from Sullivan and Yawkey. He was a shyster, too, but O'Connell had been a competent GM, something Sullivan could never aspire to. Out of that mess, Lou Gorman became the GM, and that lead toward the building of the 1986 AL Championship team. And eventually Sullivan fell out of favor with Mrs. Yawkey and John Harrington became her golden boy, and would be the one to sell to John Henry. I think what made the early 1980s so dispiriting (from my vantage point) is that the 1975 Red Sox, with a young ball club, seemed so set up to keep winning. Mistakes by the FO (as much as I bemoan the Sullivan-LeRoux ascendancy, O'Connell made them, too, like dealing Cecil Cooper for George Scott and Bernie Carbo) and their decisions to purge the team of malcontents like Jenkins and Carbo by selling incredibly low in 1977-78 and to opt out completely from the free agent market put incredible pressure on their farm system to keep them competitive. Boggs was a mistake -- he had to hit himself onto the team as a utility man. Tudor was traded for offense (would they have needed Easler if they had managed to hold onto Lynn or Lansford?) before he blossomed. The Schiraldi-Ojeda deal helped win the Sox the pennant in 1986, but was a boon for the Mets in the WS. And until the whole Coup LeRoux blowup in June 1983 it seemed that the front office would just plod on forever. Like their 1948 - 1950 counterparts, the late 70s Red Sox were unlucky to be playing in the Yankee dominated no wild card era. It's hard to imagine a team as great as the 1975 squad adding a hof pitcher in Jenkins for a backup OF in Beniquez, and then getting a lot worse, but that's what happened. They lost 10 in a row early and were toast. Lee got injured in the brawl. Rick Wise wasn't the same. Lynn had an off year. Way too much dissension going on with the Fisk/Lynn./Burleson contract issues, Tow Yawkey's failing health, and Darrell Johnston's drinking problems and fights with Fisk over pitch calling. The Cooper for Scott deal was awful, although short-term Scott gave them one last good year and Carbo played well in half a season, but Zimmer clashed with the Buffalo heads and alienated most of his pitching staff, including Lee, Jenkins, Willoughby, and Wise, and the Sox got less out of them. Hard to imagine they gave Jenkins away for a guy named Jon Poloni the following season and with Lee in Zimmer's doghouse they had no pitching depth left except Bobby Sprowl to pitch the last game of the Boston Massacre and when they gave away Carbo they had no bench depth and that showed in the playoff game with Bob Bailey's statue imitation pinchhitting against Gossage. Then Sullivan alienated and lost Tiant, gave away Lee, and the Sox started that slow fade, starting with the 2nd half of the 1979 season that went full bore into their September collapse in 1980. I remember that 1980 season well as it was my first as a Red Sox fan. Sullivan lost Fisk, never got any top starting pitching so the Sox went about five years with no top starter. Tiant had been the ace and Eck was an up and coming ace who went through personal problems and regressed until getting dealt away for Buckner, getting clean, and becoming a closer. Between 1978 Eck and 1986 Clemens, there was nothing resembling an ace, or even a strong #2 starter. Tudor, Hurst, and Ojeda were their best hopes, and the Sox gave away Tudor for a DH in Easler. Tudor became an excellent starter for St. Louis and LA, which Easler, to his credit, gave the Sox a great season in 1984 and was later dealt for Baylor, a big contributor in 1986. Like you said, Ojeda was sent to the Mets where he had a nice career and his career year in 1986 while Schiraldi and Gardner never really developed into what the Sox hoped they'd be although for two months Schiraldi was pretty dominating before it all unraveled in Game 6. Hurst took awhile to develop, and I have to credit Lou Gorman for his patience with him. Too bad they lost him for no good reason after 1988. Like you said, the Sox were ready to give away Boggs, much like they let another rough fielding low power good hitting 3b go a few years later in Jeff Bagwell. They rode forever, it seemed, with Glenn Hoffman who couldn't hit, and watched Dave Stapleton become a worse player in every succeeding year. And Haywood's ultimate dream was realized when his son Marc ascended (well rather, got it by default) to the starting catching job where he became the worst hitter I've ever seen the Red Sox run up to the plate, a guy I would bat 9th behind the pitcher if I had to make that choice. And of course, I was so happy Fisk wasn't around so that Haywood could make his dream come true.jamesmcgillstatue, thanks for the reminding me of my youth with this thread. A lot of guys around here are about 30 years old and went without ever really thinking they'd go their entire lives without seeing a Championship. A lot of guys here were fortunate to miss 1986. I was very fortunate to miss 1978, But if you remember what the Sox were and compare them with what they are now (even with 3 last place finishes in the last 4 years), you can see how so much better it is now, then what it was!
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Nov 4, 2015 4:05:12 GMT -5
Many thanks for the refresher course. I was around for '46 and have memories of the excitement but not the game. My older brothers sat in the bleachers. The teams of the 50's and 60's were mine, and I lived and died with the '67 and have vivid memories. The intervening nearly 40 years from '67 to '04 were not easy but were SOP, like a constant toothache, sometimes more painful than others.
The past 11 years have been heaven, and a couple of last place finishes, especially as we can understand the reasons, and can expect to contend around a homegrown core (think '67) is exciting. The toothache has been gone for more than a decade.
BTW, the '67 season was only part of the excitement. The Sox were hot for the decade, as were the Celts and Bruins. Another glorious era. For a small university town to be such a center for sports, medicine, culture, history is remarkabls, and to be cherished in a humble way.
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jimoh
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Post by jimoh on Nov 4, 2015 10:23:19 GMT -5
The worst thing about the late 70s was the complete mis-match between the manager Zimmer, with his tiny brain and traditional values, and the self-centered drug-gulping talented players he had.
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Post by tonyc on Nov 4, 2015 16:38:27 GMT -5
Thanks all for a level of detail I didn't have at the time as a fanatic sox fan living in NY, dependant on a sporting news subscription, occasionally borrowing the Boston Globe from the library, and turning a screechy faint radio signal in every direction from WTIC Hartford to eventually get some audible poetic calls from Ned Martin. Once in the '70's a friend/ enemy Yank fan was pacing around our Brooklyn neighborhood for 2 hours awaiting my return from the Bronx after the Yanks swept the sox, licking his chops at the opportunity to cut into me- I saw him and quickly jumped some fences and escaped through some backyards and basements. I believe Yawkey would've approved the Rudi and Fingers deals as he had earlier attempted to purchase Bando for in excess of 1 million. I think I'd heard that he woud've also bought Vida Blue had he known the Yanks would get him. For that game 4 1978 I had been hoping they'd start Tom Burgmeir, who as I recollect had some excellent super long relief appearances- from 4-7 innnings as I recall, who came in anyhow after Sprowl and pitched well- they would have won.
I loved Fisk especially, and was in terrible pain about losing him. Loved Cecil Cooper- hit over .300 at every minor league level, and was aghast at that trade, as well as dumping Tudor. One good thing that came of Easler, he later become the sox hitting coach and without his relentless work at correcting Mo Vaughn's swing into one generating loft, Mo was not much at first. In fact the real prospect was Phil Plantier initially, who must've gotten injured after a great year or so. After '86 couldn't stand Gorman and his attempts to trade away youth- tried to trade Vaughn early on, and Bagwell was inevitable given that m.o. Loved Duquette's intelligence, and just knew that once he was aboard the sox would have a shot at the ring in my lifetime.
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hank
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Post by hank on Nov 5, 2015 10:29:26 GMT -5
interesting article about Kapstein in today's Projo by Bill Reynolds
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TearsIn04
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Everybody knows Nelson de la Rosa, but who is Karim Garcia?
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Post by TearsIn04 on Nov 8, 2015 22:09:09 GMT -5
I'm just catching up on this thread and would like to thank jamesmcgillstatue for an epic post. I've always wondered whether they purposely mailed out the Fisk and Lynn contracts late just to speed their exit out of town or whether they just forgot to make a trip to the Post Office. With that incompetent FO, anything is possible. I have never seen that question answered authoritatively in any RS history book or article. Does anyone know?
There's a great case to be made for a number of guys as the biggest a-hole of that grossly mismanaged period in Red Sox history. But I've always placed Zimmer at the top. He let his personal feelings get in the way of his handling of Bill Lee in '78, costing us at a minimum a division championship and probably a trip to the WS. And of course he couldn't along with Jenkins, so a HOF P turned into Jon Poloni.
After Lee was traded to the Expos, I rooted hard for that team for a couple of years. I can remember getting scratchy radio broadcasts of Expos games in French and using the francais I learned in my HS classes to help me decipher what was going on. (Strangely enough, French and Spanish - classes that all the other kids hated - came easy to me and I got A's just by showing up. The reason that's amazing is because I was barely passing anything else, other than gym.)
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Nov 8, 2015 22:21:28 GMT -5
I'm just catching up on this thread and would like to thank jamesmcgillstatue for an epic post. I've always wondered whether they purposely mailed out the Fisk and Lynn contracts late just to speed their exit out of town or whether they just forgot to make a trip to the Post Office. With that incompetent FO, anything is possible. I have never seen that question answered authoritatively in any RS history book or article. Does anyone know? There's a great case to be made for a number of guys as the biggest a-hole of that grossly mismanaged period in Red Sox history. But I've always placed Zimmer at the top. He let his personal feelings get in the way of his handling of Bill Lee in '78, costing us at a minimum a division championship and probably a trip to the WS. And of course he couldn't along with Jenkins, so a HOF P turned into Jon Poloni. After Lee was traded to the Expos, I rooted hard for that team for a couple of years. I can remember getting scratchy radio broadcasts of Expos games in French and using the francais I learned in my HS classes to help me decipher what was going on. (Strangely enough, French and Spanish - classes that all the other kids hated - came easy to me and I got A's just by showing up. The reason that's amazing is because I was barely passing anything else, other than gym.) I don't have a definitive answer but I remember reading (was it Gammon's Beyond the 6th Game?) how Sullivan and Fisk didn't get along, and I know that on the day Fisk hit his welcome back 3 run HR at Fenway to defeat the Red Sox on Opening Day 1981, he was wearing a Buddy and Haywood suck T-shirt, so that would tell me that he very much doubted that those two buffoons didn't know that they needed to send out the contracts by a certain date. That would indicate to me, reading between the lines, that it was done on purpose. They were still buffoons, though. Haywood really, really hated free agency. He wasn't alone in that at that time as a lot of GMs and owners felt they could reverse the momentum the players' union had going on and that free agency would collapse and things (including salaries) would return to the olden days.
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TearsIn04
Veteran
Everybody knows Nelson de la Rosa, but who is Karim Garcia?
Posts: 2,835
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Post by TearsIn04 on Nov 8, 2015 22:36:23 GMT -5
I'm just catching up on this thread and would like to thank jamesmcgillstatue for an epic post. I've always wondered whether they purposely mailed out the Fisk and Lynn contracts late just to speed their exit out of town or whether they just forgot to make a trip to the Post Office. With that incompetent FO, anything is possible. I have never seen that question answered authoritatively in any RS history book or article. Does anyone know? There's a great case to be made for a number of guys as the biggest a-hole of that grossly mismanaged period in Red Sox history. But I've always placed Zimmer at the top. He let his personal feelings get in the way of his handling of Bill Lee in '78, costing us at a minimum a division championship and probably a trip to the WS. And of course he couldn't along with Jenkins, so a HOF P turned into Jon Poloni. After Lee was traded to the Expos, I rooted hard for that team for a couple of years. I can remember getting scratchy radio broadcasts of Expos games in French and using the francais I learned in my HS classes to help me decipher what was going on. (Strangely enough, French and Spanish - classes that all the other kids hated - came easy to me and I got A's just by showing up. The reason that's amazing is because I was barely passing anything else, other than gym.) I don't have a definitive answer but I remember reading (was it Gammon's Beyond the 6th Game?) how Sullivan and Fisk didn't get along, and I know that on the day Fisk hit his welcome back 3 run HR at Fenway to defeat the Red Sox on Opening Day 1981, he was wearing a Buddy and Haywood suck T-shirt, so that would tell me that he very much doubted that those two buffoons didn't know that they needed to send out the contracts by a certain date. That would indicate to me, reading between the lines, that it was done on purpose. They were still buffoons, though. Haywood really, really hated free agency. He wasn't alone in that at that time as a lot of GMs and owners felt they could reverse the momentum the players' union had going on and that free agency would collapse and things (including salaries) would return to the olden days. I just started reading the new Fisk biography. Maybe there are some clues in there. So far (about 50 pages in), it seems like the author has done a pretty thorough job in researching Fisk's life.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Nov 8, 2015 22:45:06 GMT -5
I don't have a definitive answer but I remember reading (was it Gammon's Beyond the 6th Game?) how Sullivan and Fisk didn't get along, and I know that on the day Fisk hit his welcome back 3 run HR at Fenway to defeat the Red Sox on Opening Day 1981, he was wearing a Buddy and Haywood suck T-shirt, so that would tell me that he very much doubted that those two buffoons didn't know that they needed to send out the contracts by a certain date. That would indicate to me, reading between the lines, that it was done on purpose. They were still buffoons, though. Haywood really, really hated free agency. He wasn't alone in that at that time as a lot of GMs and owners felt they could reverse the momentum the players' union had going on and that free agency would collapse and things (including salaries) would return to the olden days. I just started reading the new Fisk biography. Maybe there are some clues in there. So far (about 50 pages in), it seems like the author has done a pretty thorough job in researching Fisk's life. Let me know what you find out. As a little kid, he was the first Red Sox player I ever recognized - #27 behind the plate. I only got to see him with the Red Sox for one season - my first as a baseball fan and his last with the BoSox - 1980.
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Post by tonyc on Nov 9, 2015 1:30:57 GMT -5
My family is from Montreal, so I spent all my summers there. When Bill Lee got hit by a driver jogging during spring training, he cracked up the Montreal Gazette writer, as he said " I got up as quick as I could before she could hit me again."
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Post by jimed14 on Nov 9, 2015 8:50:20 GMT -5
There's a great case to be made for a number of guys as the biggest a-hole of that grossly mismanaged period in Red Sox history. But I've always placed Zimmer at the top. He let his personal feelings get in the way of his handling of Bill Lee in '78, costing us at a minimum a division championship and probably a trip to the WS. And of course he couldn't along with Jenkins, so a HOF P turned into Jon Poloni. Bill Lee should have pitched game 163! He was the Yankee killer and I despised Mike Torrez.
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Post by tonyc on Nov 9, 2015 10:33:51 GMT -5
Probably Jimed. If you recall, Torrez had a cut finger that almost caused him to miss the start, but it resulted in the ball diving, and the yanks shaking their heads, until he started getting his pitches up, and Zimmer ignored that so we got Dented.b
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Nov 9, 2015 13:21:33 GMT -5
Probably Jimed. If you recall, Torrez had a cut finger that almost caused him to miss the start, but it resulted in the ball diving, and the yanks shaking their heads, until he started getting his pitches up, and Zimmer ignored that so we got Dented.b Perhaps he should have threw a warm-up pitch or two while Dent was hobbling around after fouling the ball of his foot. He probably had no idea it would be as long a delay as it turned out to be. I guess his next pitch was the warm-up pitch, the flyball that Dent hit that dropped into the netting. No doubt Lee should have at least started one of the Boston Massacre games instead of being used in long relief. Either that or move up Tiant a day. Zimmer was such an awful manager with the Red Sox.
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