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Post by umassgrad2005 on Oct 14, 2017 15:36:49 GMT -5
Is a popular name that a bunch of people keep bringing up. What is he going to cost?
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Oct 14, 2017 16:27:23 GMT -5
If he costs more than a lottery prospect or two, then the Sox should pass knowing full well that Moreland is a cheap cost for first base.
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Post by sibbysisti on Oct 14, 2017 16:37:13 GMT -5
Why not re-sign Moreland? Similar stats. Two and a half years older but with a GG.
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Post by soxjim on Oct 14, 2017 16:51:11 GMT -5
Why not re-sign Moreland? Similar stats. Two and a half years older but with a GG. Bour is better than Moreland. IMO they aren't similar. And I prefer hitting for this team. Bour is about over 100OPS better than Moreland. This year close to 150OPS better. I'm not saying Bour is a "have to get." But I am not a big fan of Moreland and his offense. I really don't like a bottom 4 of Moreland, the catchers, holt and company (bcs Pedroia may be hurt) and JBJ. I just don't think they are smilar. I think Bour vs righties at the least is much better than Moreland.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Oct 15, 2017 13:24:30 GMT -5
Yea it's really a trade-off more offense, less D. Depending on what happens, it could make sense. If you can build a package around Sam Travis. That could make sense for a team in win now mode. Also makes sense for Marlins. They get a ready to play cheap replacement.
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Oct 16, 2017 14:11:36 GMT -5
Yea it's really a trade-off more offense, less D. Depending on what happens, it could make sense. If you can build a package around Sam Travis. That could make sense for a team in win now mode. Also makes sense for Marlins. They get a ready to play cheap replacement. Is Bours a better defender than Moreland? My primary concern about 1B is having the best possible glove there to deal with occasional throwing issues from Devers, Xander, Nunez, and whoever subs for Pedey in the first half among Holt/Lin/Marco/Rutledge. Moreland is solid there, has better range than, say, Hosmer, and assuming a healthy foot, will hit 30-35 doubles and 20-25 HR even in a bad year (like 2017). Just as losing JBJ will hurt OF defense because his glove is virtually irreplaceable in 2018, especially at the $$$, losing MM's glove at 1B will hurt the "D" of the entire IF. IMHO, Martinez at DH, with a healthy Hanley backing DH and 1B, along with rebounding bats from HEALTHY Betts, Bogaerts, Bradley, Hernandez, Holt, Moreland, Swihart, and an acclimated Beni, Devers, Vasquez; and with Travis and Chavis in the wings, is more than enough to provide a top 2-3 offense in the AL. Would be nice to add Brentz to that. Add a healthy Price, ERod, Wright, Johnson, Smith, etc. to an already strong rotation and pen, and this team is MOSTLY ready to again win the ALE and have the increased firepower, pitching and defense to get to the WS. I wouldn't spend a lot for Bour, LoMo or Hosmer just to, perhaps, increase offensive production at 1B when a healthy Moreland is already a solid, well balanced, Boston-acclimated, reasonably priced, well liked, veteran presence on the team, and begins 2018 on the right/healthy foot.
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Post by soxjim on Oct 16, 2017 21:00:55 GMT -5
Yea it's really a trade-off more offense, less D. Depending on what happens, it could make sense. If you can build a package around Sam Travis. That could make sense for a team in win now mode. Also makes sense for Marlins. They get a ready to play cheap replacement. Is Bours a better defender than Moreland? My primary concern about 1B is having the best possible glove there to deal with occasional throwing issues from Devers, Xander, Nunez, and whoever subs for Pedey in the first half among Holt/Lin/Marco/Rutledge. Moreland is solid there, has better range than, say, Hosmer, and assuming a healthy foot, will hit 30-35 doubles and 20-25 HR even in a bad year (like 2017). Just as losing JBJ will hurt OF defense because his glove is virtually irreplaceable in 2018, especially at the $$$, losing MM's glove at 1B will hurt the "D" of the entire IF. IMHO, Martinez at DH, with a healthy Hanley backing DH and 1B, along with rebounding bats from HEALTHY Betts, Bogaerts, Bradley, Hernandez, Holt, Moreland, Swihart, and an acclimated Beni, Devers, Vasquez; and with Travis and Chavis in the wings, is more than enough to provide a top 2-3 offense in the AL. Would be nice to add Brentz to that. Add a healthy Price, ERod, Wright, Johnson, Smith, etc. to an already strong rotation and pen, and this team is MOSTLY ready to again win the ALE and have the increased firepower, pitching and defense to get to the WS. I wouldn't spend a lot for Bour, LoMo or Hosmer just to, perhaps, increase offensive production at 1B when a healthy Moreland is already a solid, well balanced, Boston-acclimated, reasonably priced, well liked, veteran presence on the team, and begins 2018 on the right/healthy foot. I am not as certain on next year's offense as you are with Moreland. Though I'm okay if they basically stand pat too. As for MM, even though he is a superior defender, why would the WAA have Bour 1.0 while the older Moreland just 0? What scares me is if the 32/33 yo Moreland can't hit then our bottom of the order is probably going to be poor. The 32/33 yo Moreland is not a sure thing to hit 25/35. Thus if one guy of Beni/Betts/Xander/(if we get JD)/Devers has a sub-par year then we're in trouble. I'm slightly on the fence how good Devers (relative) will be next year. Are you certain he will be real good in his 1st full year as a 21 yo? Look at Correa as a comp. He struggled (relative struggle) his 2nd year a bit (a little bit). We don;t have Pedey at least to start with. Your building up of JBJ, Hernandez, Holt, Vaz and Swihart has me scared to rely on their hitting. And Bour is $3.5m. I'm okay though keeping it as low as possible for possibly another round of picks. You are correct - I agree - that nearly every player seemed to go to a floor. But if Moreland doesn't hit, you realize you have to go with Hanley, right? There is a reason why Moreland isn't in high deamnd and had a 0 WAA. And possibly the more games Hanley plays he gets worse because he is so brittle. I think the best thing for Hanley is to be platooned. I fear a possible scenario coming full circle yet again. But this time Moreland fades, we have a crummy bottom 4 order which means we can't give the top of the order much of a rest. Which means as the season progresses that we have to ride our pitching hard and then the team wears down yet again. IMO Bour could very well allow Betts to get a rest which he didn't seem to get. the past 2 years. Same with if they get JD a rest and the same with Xander. Plus Bour possibly could take pressure off Devers possibly pressing. It's not the 1st time a 21 year old in which the team were to rely on him to be the big left handed bat would struggle/press. Bour would ensure a lot of big and little things - and he is just $3.5m and all you might have to do to get him is trade some prospects. Though you are right. Potentially many players could bounce back hitting. .
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Oct 17, 2017 12:11:38 GMT -5
Yes. MM might falter, though he finished up strong after recovering from the busted foot. Also, it seems more likely that Betts, XB, Bradley, Hanley regress to better years in 2018, perhaps not 2016 level (but maybe). I don't know enough about Bour to discuss him as a replacement for MM but I do know a Hanley/MM platoon could be pretty good. I also know that Devers, XB, Rutledge and Nunez all benefit considerably from a GG caliber first baseman. Even though Hosmer seems even better at picking errant throws, he will cost enough to prevent signing JDM as DH. JDM seems the best possible option for big $$. So it seems the discussion is what will it take (especially vis a vis Hosmer) to land Bour, can he support IF defense like MM, and will he likely hit 30 2b and 22 HR like MM? In that scenario how would Bour be better? I honestly haven't found answers and don't know.
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Oct 17, 2017 18:49:27 GMT -5
Yes. MM might falter, though he finished up strong after recovering from the busted foot. Also, it seems more likely that Betts, XB, Bradley, Hanley regress to better years in 2018, perhaps not 2016 level (but maybe). I don't know enough about Bour to discuss him as a replacement for MM but I do know a Hanley/MM platoon could be pretty good. I also know that Devers, XB, Rutledge and Nunez all benefit considerably from a GG caliber first baseman. Even though Hosmer seems even better at picking errant throws, he will cost enough to prevent signing JDM as DH. JDM seems the best possible option for big $$. So it seems the discussion is what will it take (especially vis a vis Hosmer) to land Bour, can he support IF defense like MM, and will he likely hit 30 2b and 22 HR like MM? In that scenario how would Bour be better? I honestly haven't found answers and don't know. Ok. Just did a reasonable dive on Bour. He had a great year (.902 in 429 PA's) which would make him about the best hitter on the Sox for 2017, but it was also his best year of four since making the Majors at age 26. 2018 will be his age 30 season with a May birthday. His home away splits are fairly even. He mashed RHP with a .929 OPS and .378 OBP, but vs LHP his .809 OPS is also very good, though his .327 OBP suffers. I was surprised at only 25HR and 18 2B. Mitchie 2-bags was good for 22 and 30+ 2B this year with that busted foot. Like MM, Bour would likely benefit by platoon with a healthy-shouldered Hanley (as would Beni, JBJ if JDM is DH/LF, as would Holt/Lin//Marco if he pinch hit for them. So yes, Bour could add HR. He is a very big guy at 6' 4" for 1B, with massive thighs, and appears to be a good defender with a .999% fielding but found nothing about his range or athleticism. His virtual lack of SB and 3B and relatively low doubles tells me he is more stationery than MM, and might not field as well as MM. Conjecture. Also, He and MM have had not dissimilar careers with the edge going to the longer tenured MM at this time; perhaps not long term if Bour's breakout is sustainable. I watched several interviews and he seems to be pleasant, funny, articulate and unphased by the media, which is important. He could be a good clubhouse guy like MM, but couldn't find evidence of that. As MM may get better offers and multiple years elsewhere, he may be gone anyways. IMO the overall value of Bour to the Sox is similar to that of MM, but if MM leaves, Bour would be a terrific replacement through his Arb years. The only question is how much, in prospects, would he cost this slowly rebuilding farm?
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