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Best Defensive Players in the System
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Post by jiant2520 on Oct 14, 2018 16:49:58 GMT -5
Can someone rank the top ten (or however many) defensive players at each position in our system? I tried to find a thread, but didn't see anything.
Thank you.
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Oct 15, 2018 2:06:50 GMT -5
Can someone rank the top ten (or however many) defensive players at each position in our system? I tried to find a thread, but didn't see anything. Thank you. I assume you mean minor league system, not the Sox OF, but including guys like Lin, Marco and Quiroz?
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Post by jiant2520 on Oct 15, 2018 9:26:45 GMT -5
Yes.
Chavis, Lin, Casas, Rei, etc.
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Post by jimed14 on Oct 15, 2018 9:46:26 GMT -5
This has never been a thing. The Red Sox may release their defensive minor league players of the year, but that's about it. It would be next to impossible to do it without a team of scouts watching every minor league game.
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Oct 15, 2018 10:24:30 GMT -5
This has never been a thing. The Red Sox may release their defensive minor league players of the year, but that's about it. It would be next to impossible to do it without a team of scouts watching every minor league game. Good point. Yet, soxprospects and scouts have been good at identifying defenders worthy of note. From high school on defensive tools seem to be implicitly understood, whereas offensive stats are compiled and broadcast. No wonder offense has historically and culturally been considered more important, right down to baseball cards.
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Post by jimed14 on Oct 15, 2018 10:41:42 GMT -5
This has never been a thing. The Red Sox may release their defensive minor league players of the year, but that's about it. It would be next to impossible to do it without a team of scouts watching every minor league game. Good point. Yet, soxprospects and scouts have been good at identifying defenders worthy of note. From high school on defensive tools seem to be implicitly understood, whereas offensive stats are compiled and broadcast. No wonder offense has historically and culturally been considered more important, right down to baseball cards. Defensive stats are pretty unreliable in the minors especially. So you have to hope that the games that a scout is watching are typical defensive games for each player. And they need to also have the opportunity to make difficult plays. I don't think you can get a good read on a player's defense without watching a lot of games.
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Post by jiant2520 on Oct 15, 2018 10:59:29 GMT -5
Any defenders worthy of note. Just curious if we have anything at all on these prospects?
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Oct 15, 2018 13:27:02 GMT -5
Any defenders worthy of note. Just curious if we have anything at all on these prospects? To jimed’s point, even major league defensive metrics still leave much to be desired. For example, UZR seems like an old stat, but when new, not long ago, it was used to wrongly paint Ellsbury as a well below average defender because of routes in CF and arm. There are no easily tabulated slash lines on D. And I have been told that some advanced metrics paint Nunez as an above average defender, as the final out in ALDS clearly showed. Sarcasm. Defense is so difficult to quantify, yes? We do know about Lin, and Dalbec’s soft hands (and power) may make him a good 1B some day, assuming Dever’s D continues to mature. As an aside, stories and pictures of young Jarren Duran (though my memories may be playing tricks) remind me a lot of my childhood hero Jimmy Piersall. That would be a good thing.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Oct 16, 2018 6:59:58 GMT -5
Some names that stick out for defensive ability looking quickly down the org chart (by no means a ranking): Sturgeon, Dalbec, Rei, Madera, Deiner Lopez, Rivera, Lin. Tough to know on some of the lower guys because I'm not as familiar with them.
Note that a decent amount of this is based on reputation, because as noted above, you'd have to see many games for some of these guys to get that, particularly the catchers. Not everyone is an Iglesias or even Marrero where you see it after a couple of games. Also exclusion from this list might be based on being unfamiliar.
As for some of the guys you listed, Gerry, Chavis is a below-average defender. Casas has a plus arm but is unlikely to stay at third base, but we've heard projections he might be a very good defensive first baseman.
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Oct 16, 2018 12:28:00 GMT -5
Some names that stick out for defensive ability looking quickly down the org chart (by no means a ranking): Sturgeon, Dalbec, Rei, Madera, Deiner Lopez, Rivera, Lin. Tough to know on some of the lower guys because I'm not as familiar with them. Note that a decent amount of this is based on reputation, because as noted above, you'd have to see many games for some of these guys to get that, particularly the catchers. Not everyone is an Iglesias or even Marrero where you see it after a couple of games. Also exclusion from this list might be based on being unfamiliar. As for some of the guys you listed, Gerry, Chavis is a below-average defender. Casas has a plus arm but is unlikely to stay at third base, but we've heard projections he might be a very good defensive first baseman. Now that you bring them up, is it possible that Chavis could ever learn to play 2B? Any position? Would he actually be a bad defender at 1B? Now that the Sox have become a strong defensive team, they should make every effort to remain so. I was hoping that Dalbec and Devers would mature into the strong D/ high OPS 1B/3B of the future. Casas may be even better? Wow. So many good options coming up.
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Post by jiant2520 on Oct 16, 2018 21:35:47 GMT -5
Some names that stick out for defensive ability looking quickly down the org chart (by no means a ranking): Sturgeon, Dalbec, Rei, Madera, Deiner Lopez, Rivera, Lin. Tough to know on some of the lower guys because I'm not as familiar with them. Note that a decent amount of this is based on reputation, because as noted above, you'd have to see many games for some of these guys to get that, particularly the catchers. Not everyone is an Iglesias or even Marrero where you see it after a couple of games. Also exclusion from this list might be based on being unfamiliar. As for some of the guys you listed, Gerry, Chavis is a below-average defender. Casas has a plus arm but is unlikely to stay at third base, but we've heard projections he might be a very good defensive first baseman. Thank you.
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