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Post by soxfansince67 on Jul 18, 2019 16:24:42 GMT -5
Great win, took the series, only one stinker. NOW....can they find consistency? Sweep the Os and hit the huge games hot. If we can do that, things can get really interesting....
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Post by coachmac on Jul 18, 2019 17:52:43 GMT -5
I like the idea of Walden as the long reliever on this team much more than a 1-inning high(ish) leverage guy. I think this team is missing the 2018 versions of Velazquez and Johnson a lot more than has been talked about and he could fill that role well, much like he did today pitching two innings. Does anyone else have the same sense or am I way off base? When Eovaldi is activated, Weber seems like the logical bullpen arm to go to Pawtucket. If Walden can become the multople inning guy that would fill a huge need.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Jul 18, 2019 18:11:56 GMT -5
I like the idea of Walden as the long reliever on this team much more than a 1-inning high(ish) leverage guy. I think this team is missing the 2018 versions of Velazquez and Johnson a lot more than has been talked about and he could fill that role well, much like he did today pitching two innings. Does anyone else have the same sense or am I way off base? When Eovaldi is activated, Weber seems like the logical bullpen arm to go to Pawtucket. If Walden can become the multople inning guy that would fill a huge need. Yes, I see Weber leaving for Eovaldi, Hembree on the bubble (probably still injured) if/when Johnson/Wright comes back - not sure who leaves next if both come back.
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Post by DesignatedForAssignment on Jul 18, 2019 21:08:59 GMT -5
Yup... 9 over .500, 3 against the Os next. Gotta keep winning these types, turn it around and chip away at MFY and Tampa. Cleve & Oak never lose.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 18, 2019 21:10:05 GMT -5
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Post by dirtdog on Jul 18, 2019 21:17:21 GMT -5
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Post by telson13 on Jul 18, 2019 21:18:10 GMT -5
Jones is gonna get me for a gameday thread post (after swearing them off following the London debacle)... but I have nowhere else to put this, so it goes here: Bogey is awesome. He is finding a new level. He’s become the guy we all dreamed on when he was the #2 prospect in baseball. And he’s made his move for the .300/.400/.550 triple slash I predicted was well within reach this year. He’s second in WAR in the AL, closing in on 5 quickly, headed for 7...maybe 8. And he’s sticking around a few years. What a joy he’s been to watch develop. He’s been my favorite player for a long time. It’s such a joy to watch him turn into the stud we knew he could be. What would his contract look like if he didn’t force boras into making a deal??? After this year? Idk, maybe 8/240? I mean, at this point he compares favorably to Machado, right? Might not have the track record, but he’s about to turn in a better season than Machado’s best, he’s arguably a better SS defensively at this point, he walks more, whiffs less, and he’s a terrific, humble, hard-working/hard-playing guy. Hell, maybe he tops that Machado deal. Sox really made a terrific move there. I hope they reward him by re-working his contract, getting rid of the opt-out, and racking on a couple of years. Maybe add value but defer the $.
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Post by incandenza on Jul 18, 2019 21:19:26 GMT -5
6.68. I mean, that almost proves too much. There is no way Chris Sale becomes literally the worst starter in baseball just because he's throwing to Vazquez.
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Post by dirtdog on Jul 18, 2019 21:22:00 GMT -5
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 18, 2019 21:23:44 GMT -5
6.68. I mean, that almost proves too much. There is no way Chris Sale becomes literally the worst starter in baseball just because he's throwing to Vazquez. It proves that Leon is the superior catcher at calling a game.
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Post by James Dunne on Jul 18, 2019 21:27:58 GMT -5
You throw around the word "proves" very liberally.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 18, 2019 21:35:24 GMT -5
It's the truth though. This has been going on for years now where Leon has had superior catching ERA's.
It's the reason why Sale and Porcello are going to throw to Leon from now on, even in the midst of a offensive breakout from Vazquez this year.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Jul 18, 2019 22:01:42 GMT -5
It's the truth though. This has been going on for years now where Leon has had superior catching ERA's. It's the reason why Sale and Porcello are going to throw to Leon from now on, even in the midst of a offensive breakout from Vazquez this year. Some examples July 13 Dodgers 11 Sox 2 Sale starting Leon catching June 26 - White Sox 8 Red Sox 7 Sale 5 runs Leon catching June 7 - Tampa 5 Sox 1 ERod pitching Leon catching June 1 - Yankess 5 Sox 3 Porcello pitching Leon catching So it isn't a black and white thing - all or nothing.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 18, 2019 23:08:13 GMT -5
It's the truth though. This has been going on for years now where Leon has had superior catching ERA's. It's the reason why Sale and Porcello are going to throw to Leon from now on, even in the midst of a offensive breakout from Vazquez this year. Some examples July 13 Dodgers 11 Sox 2 Sale starting Leon catching June 26 - White Sox 8 Red Sox 7 Sale 5 runs Leon catching June 7 - Tampa 5 Sox 1 ERod pitching Leon catching June 1 - Yankess 5 Sox 3 Porcello pitching Leon catching So it isn't a black and white thing - all or nothing. forum.soxprospects.com/thread/4708/red-sox-rays-series-thread?page=10"I had to check it and confirm it myself. Vazquez caught Price regularly until July 7th. That was Price's last really bad start. His ERA was all the way up to 4.44 after that start. Ever since Leon has caught him regularly his ERA has dropped to 3.75 after his last start and it keeps dropping with this start. There's something to be said about Vazquez here. If he doesn't call a good game like Leon does, then that drops his value demonstrably. At best Vazquez is a league average catcher hitting wise, if he's not making up for it defensively, then why would you want to keep him past this season?" Soxfan, no matter who's throwing to Leon, they get better results. This was a thread from last year. It showed that Price started to turn his season around once Vazquez went down with the injury. His ERA literally dropped a full run in a month with Leon catching. Now coincided with Porcello's and Sale's ERA this year, it shows that something is *there.* Whether it's just Leon is a awesome game caller or Vazquez isn't a good one or both. When I say this has been going on for two years, I'm not making it up. Sale's off games with Leon probably shows how inconsistent Sale has been this year. The catcher can only call a game, the pitcher still has to execute to a extent.
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 14,272
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Post by cdj on Jul 18, 2019 23:15:57 GMT -5
I think the pitchers didn’t come into the season ready and Sandy wasn’t around so the numbers are skewed against Vazquez when in actuality the pitchers were going to improve no matter what
I mean these are pitchers that have won and contended for cy young’s without throwing to Sandy.
Basically this is my point- Sandy is a good game caller but at the end of the day he’s a bad Major League Baseball player. I don’t think he deserves nearly as much credit as some give him
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 19, 2019 0:44:04 GMT -5
I think the pitchers didn’t come into the season ready and Sandy wasn’t around so the numbers are skewed against Vazquez when in actuality the pitchers were going to improve no matter what I mean these are pitchers that have won and contended for cy young’s without throwing to Sandy. Basically this is my point- Sandy is a good game caller but at the end of the day he’s a bad Major League Baseball player. I don’t think he deserves nearly as much credit as some give him Sandy Leon is a good MLB backup catcher. He's a bad offensive player. Once Sale and Porcello are pulled from their starts, Sandy will be pinched hit for when behind in games.
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Post by bluechip on Jul 19, 2019 7:50:50 GMT -5
As great as Chris Sale is and has been, this stat just shows how dominant Randy Johnson was. Edit: This lead me to thinking back as to how the 1997 Mariners with Ken Griffey Jr., A-Rod, Edgar Martinez, Jay Buhner, Randy Johnson, et al, did not win the World Series.... ...I then looked at the bullpen and realized that it makes the 2019 Red Sox look like the 2014 Royals. Norm Charlton lead the team in saves and had an ERA of 7.27! Heathcliff Sloucumb (after the Derek Lowe trade) got ten saves, but still had an era over four. Though the starting pitching was apparently not brilliant in the ALDS either.
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Post by hammerhead on Jul 19, 2019 9:09:36 GMT -5
If Sale was an ace he would go out tomorrow and give the team 8 innings. I don't care if he wins or not. He must deliver 8 innings. He will be lucky to get through five at 100 pitches. It's who he is. I guess he was more than lucky?
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Post by patford on Jul 19, 2019 9:40:01 GMT -5
If Sale was an ace he would go out tomorrow and give the team 8 innings. I don't care if he wins or not. He must deliver 8 innings. He will be lucky to get through five at 100 pitches. It's who he is. I guess he was more than lucky? My definition of an ace is a horse who goes deep into games and is at his best during the later part of the season and into the post season.
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Post by James Dunne on Jul 19, 2019 9:42:01 GMT -5
My definition of an ace is a whale who can dive at least 140 feet underwater and hold his breath for 45+ minutes.
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Post by patford on Jul 19, 2019 12:11:33 GMT -5
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Jul 19, 2019 12:15:37 GMT -5
My definition of an ace is a whale who can dive at least 140 feet underwater and hold his breath for 45+ minutes. Personally I'm looking for three plus pitches and a sideline in investigating animal-related crimes.
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