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Breaking News - Dombrowski out
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 27, 2019 16:37:17 GMT -5
Does not surprise me one bit.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Sept 27, 2019 19:21:23 GMT -5
Here might be the difference in philosophy.
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Sept 27, 2019 20:10:17 GMT -5
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ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,931
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Post by ericmvan on Sept 28, 2019 2:25:48 GMT -5
Re staying under the cap ...
Let's say they and Holt would both like to sign a 3/$16 contract.
Is there anything in the CBA that says they couldn't sign him for $2M with two player options for $7M? It's completely gaming the system, so I suspect that player options count in the AAV.
In which case, I also suspect that you could sign him for $2M with a really easy vesting option (e.g., 200 PA) that would trigger a 2/$14 extension, and that would be kosher.
Another thing they can do is outbid everyone for mlfa's, and hope that they strike it rich with a couple of Brasier 2018 types. They can either serve as much cheaper virtual trade deadline pickups, or (if there's no room on the MLB roster) be traded for something interesting. The latter strategy means that you can sign guys who would appear to be blocked at the MLB level.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Sept 28, 2019 12:45:48 GMT -5
Well of course they weren't on the same page, our owners do a 180 right after we win a world series. Everything is DD fault, even though they are his boss and can tell him what to do. Now the lies about having to reset. It's horrible I don't believe a word coming out of our owners mouths right now. It's like 100% scripted crap to blame DD and set the stage for very unpopular moves to come.
I don't buy for a second they told DD they were resetting this up coming year. He's a lot of things, but he's not stupid. You don't sign both Sale and Evoldi if your marching orders are to slash payroll the next year. At the same time our owners wouldn't approve them, it makes zero sense. Heck even now they are going to reset, but act like it isn't 100% which we know it is. They have a long history of flip flopping and that seems to be exactly what they did here.
I don't even care that they want to move on, I just hate the ripping the guy and placing all the blame on him. A simple thank you DD we just want to move in a different direction is what should of happened!
So we taking bets on who gets traded? They talk about restocking the farm, yet no bridge year. As we've talked about the president/GM have very little to do with that. DD hadn't made a big deal since Sale. So they have to be planning on trading guys on the major league roster for young guys. The problem is the guys with value aren't guys you want to trade! Workman is probably your best bet if we aren't talking about one other certain player. A guy like Bradley just won't have much value after this season at his salary.
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Post by jbsox on Sept 28, 2019 13:57:48 GMT -5
If we are hell bent on resetting the tax what about this idea. Trading Price and/or Eovaldi where you eat a portion of their contracts to the point where they are tradeable, and maybe just get little back in return or if you have to tack on lower tier prospects. Let’s say that shaves 30 mil off the payroll between both. Maybe then trade for a cost controlled SP, and bargain hunt for the 4th and 5th spots(maybe a minor leaguer surprises like Houck, Hart ect.). You could maybe try that with Sale, but with 5 years left of his contract that’s probably less likely.
It may not be pretty for a year (not like this year was pretty anyway with SP), but maybe it allows us to keep Betts and JD. We also need to start thinking about possible extensions for Erod, Benny, Devers...
Then the following year maybe we can then really dive into the FA market for a SP, and maybe Mata will be ready to stabilize SP again.
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Post by Guidas on Sept 28, 2019 14:22:03 GMT -5
Anytime a team says they want to significantly cut salary but promise to put a "competitive team" on the field, this is what it means:
"We think we'll win about 82 games but we hope to get back into the playoffs in three or so years. But even if we get absurdly lucky and make the playoffs with this mediocre team - and if we do we'll say, 'See, we told you we'd put a competitive team on the field!' - we're not advancing anyway. Oh, and ticket and concession prices are going up."
I really, really respect this ownership group and thank them for all they've done, but this is a sham. At least tell us the truth.
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Post by soxjim on Sept 28, 2019 15:22:14 GMT -5
Again more bizarre quotes. 1-- You want to build the farm yet you demote Cherington who built the farm? 2-- You didn't know what DD was? 3-- Who has final say on the contracts for Extensions and Free Agents; the GM or the owner? what's Henry thinking? Blindly following a GM he doesn't care for? 4-- If Henry doesn't think DD did a good job putting forth a team that can win it all then why did he agree to sign Sale? Unless he came to the conclusion after-the-fact which imo would have been a complete lack of insight. But if you didn't trust DD from the outset, then why agree to sign Sale? 5--- If you think DD's style is poor thus I would surmise that you don't think they can win. If that's the case, are we going to see a major bust up of the team? Though what I'm reading we aren't? So wtf is he talking about and thinking about for the team in the future? Rebuild? Go for it? Middle of the pack and content? 6-- Is our owner schizophrenic?
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Post by yuchangclan on Apr 9, 2024 9:13:06 GMT -5
In the final analysis, it’s hard to give Dombrowski anything less than stellar grades for his time in Boston. Not only did he preside over/assemble the best Red Sox team ever, but he also added Rafaela, Duran, Crawford, Bello, Casas(others?) to the current roster.
In hindsight, he stole Chris Sale from the White Sox(the Sale extension was obviously a disaster). He stole Eovaldi from the Rays(that extension was MUCH better). He also got Kimbrel for very little in prospect capital.
He extended Xander on a very team-friendly deal. He signed JDM to a deal that could only be classified as a huge win.
You can definitely say(correctly) that he overpaid for David Price. But at least they got some productive years(and a WS) from Price. That signing was also necessitated by the previous administration’s failure to sign Lester. There are no Rusneys or Pandas or Hanleys or Carl Crawfords on DD’s record, either.
I don’t understand the general hate that Dombrowski tends to get from Sox fans. I think he deserves a lot more credit and his fingerprints will remain on this team for a LONG time to come.
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Post by alexcorahomevideo on Apr 9, 2024 9:14:38 GMT -5
In the final analysis, it’s hard to give Dombrowski anything less than stellar grades for his time in Boston. Not only did he preside over/assemble the best Red Sox team ever, but he also added Rafaela, Duran, Crawford, Bello, Casas(others?) to the current roster. In hindsight, he stole Chris Sale from the White Sox(the Sale extension was obviously a disaster). He stole Eovaldi from the Rays(that extension was MUCH better). He also got Kimbrel for very little in prospect capital. He extended Xander on a very team-friendly deal. He signed JDM to a deal that could only be classified as a huge win. You can definitely say(correctly) that he overpaid for David Price. But at least they got some productive years(and a WS) from Price. That signing was also necessitated by the previous administration’s failure to sign Lester. There are no Rusneys or Pandas or Hanleys or Carl Crawford on DD’s record, either. I don’t understand the general hate that Dombrowski tends to get from Sox fans. I think he deserves a lot more credit and his fingerprints will remain on this team for a LONG time to come. Dombrowski won. It wasn't even the high priced guys. He made great trades for Steve Pierce and Eovaldi. I'm not sure why he gets a lot of hate on here. His team won.
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Post by incandenza on Apr 9, 2024 9:18:47 GMT -5
I'm still looking for volunteers to occupy the space on the Venn diagram where "happy with Dombrowski's go-for-it-now approach" and "sanguine about the couple of mediocre seasons that inevitably followed" overlap.
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Post by manfred on Apr 9, 2024 9:28:12 GMT -5
I'm still looking for volunteers to occupy the space on the Venn diagram where "happy with Dombrowski's go-for-it-now approach" and "sanguine about the couple of mediocre seasons that inevitably followed" overlap. I accept that position if that is the option. I think the latter is a bit of an oversimplification, though. One can accept even that they might suck but not be happy with how they sought to rebuild.
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Post by taiwansox on Apr 9, 2024 9:29:55 GMT -5
In the final analysis, it’s hard to give Dombrowski anything less than stellar grades for his time in Boston. Not only did he preside over/assemble the best Red Sox team ever, but he also added Rafaela, Duran, Crawford, Bello, Casas(others?) to the current roster. In hindsight, he stole Chris Sale from the White Sox(the Sale extension was obviously a disaster). He stole Eovaldi from the Rays(that extension was MUCH better). He also got Kimbrel for very little in prospect capital. He extended Xander on a very team-friendly deal. He signed JDM to a deal that could only be classified as a huge win. You can definitely say(correctly) that he overpaid for David Price. But at least they got some productive years(and a WS) from Price. That signing was also necessitated by the previous administration’s failure to sign Lester. There are no Rusneys or Pandas or Hanleys or Carl Crawford on DD’s record, either. I don’t understand the general hate that Dombrowski tends to get from Sox fans. I think he deserves a lot more credit and his fingerprints will remain on this team for a LONG time to come. I think he overplayed for some trades, the Kimbrel and Thornburg trades weren’t great, but most of the hate is really because Cherington was so mediocre. The abysmal 2012-2015 drafts really killed us with depth/affordable talent which has a long tail. Looking at Benintendi’s career it almost feels like that’s lucky as one of Cherington’s only strong draft picks. The other notably strong pick was Kopech who Dombrowski unloaded thank god. Cherington did get Devers as his one cornerstone piece, but damn, that was the worst GM tenure in the last 30 years
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Post by incandenza on Apr 9, 2024 9:35:59 GMT -5
I'm still looking for volunteers to occupy the space on the Venn diagram where "happy with Dombrowski's go-for-it-now approach" and "sanguine about the couple of mediocre seasons that inevitably followed" overlap. I accept that position if that is the option. I think the latter is a bit of an oversimplification, though. One can accept even that they might suck but not be happy with how they sought to rebuild. Oh come on manfred. You aren't fooling anyone.
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Post by scottysmalls on Apr 9, 2024 9:36:56 GMT -5
In the final analysis, it’s hard to give Dombrowski anything less than stellar grades for his time in Boston. Not only did he preside over/assemble the best Red Sox team ever, but he also added Rafaela, Duran, Crawford, Bello, Casas(others?) to the current roster.Is that above Front office-replacement-level? Honestly not sure on the expected hit rate there. I mean if literally no one they drafted/signed via IFA during Dombrowski's tenure was on the roster that would be a total disaster. I guess it depends on how these guys turn out. Either way the infrastructure responsible for bringing those guys in, for the most part, both pre-dates and has outlasted Dombrowski.
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Post by julyanmorley on Apr 9, 2024 9:41:33 GMT -5
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Apr 9, 2024 9:49:15 GMT -5
Just why? There's no ongoing lockout, it's not mid-February, there's actual real life baseball happening, and this is what you wanna stir up? But I'm sure you'll change people's minds now 5 years later.
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Post by yuchangclan on Apr 9, 2024 9:49:41 GMT -5
In the final analysis, it’s hard to give Dombrowski anything less than stellar grades for his time in Boston. Not only did he preside over/assemble the best Red Sox team ever, but he also added Rafaela, Duran, Crawford, Bello, Casas(others?) to the current roster.Is that above Front office-replacement-level? Honestly not sure on the expected hit rate there. I mean if literally no one they drafted/signed via IFA during Dombrowski's tenure was on the roster that would be a total disaster. I guess it depends on how these guys turn out. Either way the infrastructure responsible for bringing those guys in, for the most part, both pre-dates and has outlasted Dombrowski. Yeah, I’m actually not sure if this is a lot of talent produced, or not. It looks like a pretty good list given his relatively short tenure, though. And it’s not an inclusive list. Those were just the guys off the top of my head. I’m sure I missed several. I think he was a pretty good talent evaluator overall. And he’s won everywhere he’s gone.
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Post by manfred on Apr 9, 2024 9:56:23 GMT -5
I accept that position if that is the option. I think the latter is a bit of an oversimplification, though. One can accept even that they might suck but not be happy with how they sought to rebuild. Oh come on manfred. You aren't fooling anyone. What are you talking about? I am being completely serious. There are plenty of examples of mistakes that had nothing to do with paying a short term price. Sale’s extension is a good one. That had nothing to do with going all in in 2018, but it really hurt after. Just for one.
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Post by yuchangclan on Apr 9, 2024 10:14:22 GMT -5
Just why? There's no ongoing lockout, it's not mid-February, there's actual real life baseball happening, and this is what you wanna stir up? But I'm sure you'll change people's minds now 5 years later. You could have, you know, ignored the thread if you are so offended. Try that next time instead.
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Post by vermontsox1 on Apr 9, 2024 10:19:20 GMT -5
I think there is some good faith discussion we could have about Dombrowski, but doesn't seem like we are having that. I'm going to lock the thread.
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