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gerry
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Post by gerry on Jan 18, 2021 13:59:30 GMT -5
Case in point. I get NESN here in SoCal through Direct TV. Also a long time Sox fan (for more than 70 years). It is an expensive investment in my team which reliably and happily takes me from ST thru postseason, and throws in some miLB games for good measure.
2020 NESN was, frankly, only worth the $$ because of the respite it provided from the depths of CoVid. True joy and anticipation came from watching XB and CV, Verdugo and JBJ, Dalbec and MM, Arauz and Munoz, and ultimately Arroyo, Houck, Pivetta and Valdez.
Admittedly, the race to the bottom for a top draft pick became a perverse pleasure, though that’s a movie that I wouldn’t want to see again.
Count me among those who are struggling to figure out Bloom’s strategies, which seems the oppo of Homegrown, though I can convince myself that minor league kids like Arauz, Seabold and Downs are almost homegrown.
Back to NESN. With so many good (for the Sox) FA’s coming off the market what can convince me to pay for it again in 2021? Simply the enjoyment of watching this team I love turn it around and contending again, as the FO repeatedly states as the goal. A promise kept.
But as much as I understand the value of Renfroe, Perez, Andriese and Whitlock, without a top SP, a proven closer, and an above average OF this team is unlikely to contend. That would needlessly waste another year of Verdugo, XB, Devers, JDM, Sale, ERod, Eovaldi, Barnes, Brasier, et al; and rob the arrivals of so many new kids like Dalbec, Downs, Duran, Houck, Mata, etc. of a winning mentality. IMO the Sox need just a few strong signings to compete. If $$$ is a primary concern to the group, failing to compete will cost them short an long term. Big names like Bauer or Bryant are not needed for this group to start winning again, but there is still above average talent available.
So, like many others, I will gladly tithe to NESN and the Fenway Sports Group if the Sox use their Mookie Money to sign a couple of premium players. Otherwise I will be added to their loss column.
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Post by pasadenasox on Jan 18, 2021 21:30:33 GMT -5
They invested significant money into Chris Sale, Xander, JDM, Eovaldi, and Price. ERod, Benny, and Vazquez aren't cheap anymore, either.
The draft has been much more miss than hit for almost a decade now with some high profile exceptions. They've done very well with international signings but have dealt away a fair amount of it leaving their best talents still years away.
The system is what it is. I'd rather have Mookie and a stacked system, too, but this reckoning has been a long time coming. I'm confused why people seem to be confused about how or why they The Sox find themselves where they do.
Hopefully a short rebuild sets up another decade of consistent success.
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Post by soxinjersey on Jan 18, 2021 22:54:29 GMT -5
He released a guy that he wants on the team and ultimately resigned for the sake of saving $1M on a $200M payroll. Granted, they may have some additional restraints this year, but really what difference does this make to the budget when they risked losing Perez to another team? If you want a working definition for a Chaim Bloom special I would call it "acting in a way that is technically sound from an accounting perspective while being strategically dubious". This is how the game is played and has been for years in the front office. The $1.85 million saved can be used on other players and help keep the team under the CBT. You obviously are not a numbers person and the almost $2 million saved is not your money. If it was you might feel different. Perez wanted to come back, and if he had other serious offers Bloom would have signed him earlier. That is why the classic line about keep in touch with the players is so over used in all the off season articles. The “team A is interested in player B.” Omg, every team is interested in everybody. I wish the writers would not write until the player has signed!
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Post by soxinjersey on Jan 18, 2021 23:33:49 GMT -5
Is it just a numbers game? I would have been very happy if the Sox had picked up Perez's option after the season because I felt he'd fulfilled the expectations with which he was signed and perhaps a little more. He took the ball every fifth day and was solid, and everything I read about him was positive. Now, I feel queasy about this move. True, the extra money saved will help with player acquisition on one level as it gives the cash to pay some or all of the salary of a Mitch Moreland or another bullpen arm, but how does Perez feel about his position on the team? Does he feel he's been treated fairly? I don't know how other players judge a move like this, but if I'm a FA and the Red Sox offer me a contract with a team option for an extra year, I will feel that it's worth only whatever buy-out it contains. Everything else being equal, I would be inclined to sign with a more player-friendly team. We can imagine all kinds of FA signings on this site, but the reality is that players ultimately have to choose to sign with the Sox. It hurts that Kluber signed with the Yankees for less than the highest offer on the table. Bloom has to create an environment and a reputation where players want to sign with the Sox. It's hard to see the way Perez has been signed as a step in this direction.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Jan 19, 2021 2:24:01 GMT -5
They invested significant money into Chris Sale, Xander, JDM, Eovaldi, and Price. ERod, Benny, and Vazquez aren't cheap anymore, either. ... If by cheap you mean grossly underpaid, that's true. If you mean expensive for what they brought to the team you're wrong. Rodriguez' has had only one year - when he got hurt - where he was worth less than the $8.3M he's currently being paid, and he was pre-arb back then. Most years he's been worth anywhere from 2 to 7 times more than the amount he's only now being paid. Vazquez was worth almost twice his salary last year, even in a strike shortened season. Those are very reasonable paydays that don't equate to the first set of names.
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Post by alexcorahomevideo on Jan 19, 2021 7:17:01 GMT -5
They invested significant money into Chris Sale, Xander, JDM, Eovaldi, and Price. ERod, Benny, and Vazquez aren't cheap anymore, either. The draft has been much more miss than hit for almost a decade now with some high profile exceptions. They've done very well with international signings but have dealt away a fair amount of it leaving their best talents still years away. The system is what it is. I'd rather have Mookie and a stacked system, too, but this reckoning has been a long time coming. I'm confused why people seem to be confused about how or why they The Sox find themselves where they do. Hopefully a short rebuild sets up another decade of consistent success. There were other ways around this. The most notable example is that Dombrowski did not have to give Eovaldi that contract. The rest at least were somewhat reasonable, even Sale. Remember injuries aside when he signed that deal if healthy he was a top 5 pitcher in the league. That contract was under the going rate for a top 5 arm. If this team struggles out of the gate you probably need to think about dealing ERod and Vazquez. But those two players are certainly underpaid compared to players on their level. The reason why the Sox are in this spot is that they have an abysmal draft track record over the last 5 years or so. There is some light at the end of the tunnel in those draft classes with Cassas, Houck and a few others. I'm also not sure what to make of last years draft like everyone else. I really wish they kept Mookie but I'm guessing that he wasn't all in on staying and the team cashed in and got some good pieces for him. Verdugo will never be Mookie Betts and he doesn't have to be. But certainly the need for say someone like Martin Perez would be lessened if the Sox had at least gotten an arm in the Mookie trade.
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Post by electricityverdugo99 on Jan 19, 2021 8:16:11 GMT -5
Matt Moore is right around the corner Speaking of the Devil, I guess his velocity is back. Matt Moore was really good when he had that back in the day.
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Post by pasadenasox on Jan 19, 2021 10:49:19 GMT -5
They invested significant money into Chris Sale, Xander, JDM, Eovaldi, and Price. ERod, Benny, and Vazquez aren't cheap anymore, either. ... If by cheap you mean grossly underpaid, that's true. If you mean expensive for what they brought to the team you're wrong. Rodriguez' has had only one year - when he got hurt - where he was worth less than the $8.3M he's currently being paid, and he was pre-arb back then. Most years he's been worth anywhere from 2 to 7 times more than the amount he's only now being paid. Vazquez was worth almost twice his salary last year, even in a strike shortened season. Those are very reasonable paydays that don't equate to the first set of names. Of course they don't, that's literally why I listed them separately. If that's an argument that you're having it isn't with me. None of it was a value judgement, anyway, but a math problem: this guy plus this guy plus this guy... equals like $85 million, plus another $13.5m for the second list of names and $12.7m for Pedy... is like $111m. The money has been spent and adds up fast. An argument about the relative merits, past and present, and judgements about who is or who isn't underpaid would seem to be one for another thread, if I were interested in in it, which I am not. You guys all fight with each other too much and can't just read what people post without a "well actually..." that's often tangential at best to the post. That's the main reason why I stopped posting here.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jan 19, 2021 10:53:58 GMT -5
Losing some portion of your revenue, say 20%, still means losing 20%. If that takes you from comfortably over your margin to the edge of profitability, you still have to rethink your business model. That takes time and thought. So you don't think the Red Sox currently a plan?
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jan 19, 2021 11:00:47 GMT -5
I have no problem with the Red Sox spending up to the tax. A halfway trying to win type thing. I have a huge problem if Perez is the top starter you sign because of money. I have zero issues waiting the market out, that's smart this year. I have a huge issue if you think this is because they are trying to figure out a business model. Our owner knows damn well what last season did to NESNs ratings and what will happen if they suck again next year.
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Post by alexcorahomevideo on Jan 19, 2021 11:24:44 GMT -5
Sox right now are nowhere even close to the tax. I think they're going to hold off on spending until fans return. I guess as a seasons ticket holder I can accept that but it really is kind of ridiculous that the team is probably going to be around the 160-170 range this year when they don't need to be. Using COTS numbers and a little creative imagination on what they'd both ask for, If the Jays sign George Springer and Kirby Yates they'd be somewhat close to what the Sox are going to spend this year. That doesn't seem correct...
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Post by pasadenasox on Jan 19, 2021 11:40:14 GMT -5
According to Sportrac.com, who I suppose could be wrong but I have no reason to think so, The Sox have spent ~$162m taxable payroll and with estimated provisions for benefits and minor league salaries have just under $30m to play with while staying beneath the luxury tax threshold. Link
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Post by soxfanatic on Jan 25, 2021 10:14:35 GMT -5
I wonder why his deal hasn't been made official yet. It's been nine days since the rumors that they struck a deal. It's not like there's no room on the 40 man.
Probably a delay of the physical, because of Covid/immigration issues.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Jan 25, 2021 10:19:56 GMT -5
I wonder why his deal hasn't been made official yet. It's been nine days since the rumors that they struck a deal. It's not like there's no room on the 40 man. Probably a delay of the physical, because of Covid/immigration issues. Could certainly be it. That said, given the number of pending signings, there could also just be a lot of moving parts on the 40-man right now.
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ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,927
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Post by ericmvan on Jan 26, 2021 5:42:00 GMT -5
According to Sportrac.com, who I suppose could be wrong but I have no reason to think so, The Sox have spent ~$162m taxable payroll and with estimated provisions for benefits and minor league salaries have just under $30m to play with while staying beneath the luxury tax threshold. LinkWell, in six days they committed $25.15M of that. Cot's has us at 8.04M in space, while Sportrac now has $5.94M.
Sportrac has
0.85 more for pre-arb players (including Brewer, who's a minor leaguer in Cot's)
0.25 more for minor leaguers 0.75 for Daniel Gosset, but that only counts if he gets selected 0.575 for Munoz, ditto (which is likelier, however).
Sportrac is counting Chavis and Brewer at 0.575M each, but they are likely to be optioned and DFA'd.
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Post by soxfanatic on Feb 12, 2021 17:41:21 GMT -5
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