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8/20-8/22 Red Sox vs. Rangers Thread
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Post by vermontsox1 on Aug 20, 2021 7:15:17 GMT -5
8/20 Red Sox (LHP Chris Sale, 1-0, 3.60, 5.0 IP, 8K:0BB) vs. Rangers (RHP Dane Dunning, 5-7, 4.06, 99.2 IP, 97K:35BB) 7:10 pm ET, NESN/WEEI 8/21 Red Sox (LHP Eduardo Rodriguez, 9-6, 4.97, 116.0 IP, 145K:36BB) vs. Rangers (RHP Jordan Lyles, 5-10, 5.55, 131.1 IP, 105K:43BB) 7:10 pm ET, NESN/WEEI 8/22 Red Sox (RHP Nathan Eovaldi, 10-8, 3.91, 138.0 IP, 140K:26BB) vs. Rangers (LHP Kolby Allard, 3-10, 4.88, 94.0 IP, 79K:18BB) 1:10 pm ET, NESN/WEEI MLB StandingsRed Sox Hitting StatsRed Sox Pitching StatsMLB ScoreboardMLB TransactionsA note regarding moderating of the gameday threads in 2021: As the disclaimer has always said, in the past, we have been very liberal in moderating the Gameday threads. They're meant to be a lot less formal than other threads on the forum, so to moderate them the same way would be silly. However, we do ask posters to maintain a certain level of decorum in these threads, and we plan on moderating the Gameday threads a little more actively this season. In particular, we ask that posters refrain from being overly repetitive with their posts (if you've made your point, let it go), refrain from monopolizing the discussion (if you are making more than a couple posts in a row, you probably need to slow down a little bit), and of course, follow the Ground Rules ( link). The point is to make these threads worth participating in and fun for all posters, from our long-time fixtures to people just signing up today. -The Management
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Aug 20, 2021 7:22:32 GMT -5
Sweep them hard
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Post by soxfansince67 on Aug 20, 2021 9:03:05 GMT -5
How long as it been since we were on the outside looking in at the playoffs? There's the incentive for the team to right the ship.
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Post by kjkramer on Aug 20, 2021 9:07:58 GMT -5
We almost have to get a sweep here.
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Post by DesignatedForAssignment on Aug 20, 2021 9:32:22 GMT -5
How long as it been since we were on the outside looking in at the playoffs? There's the incentive for the team to right the ship. The bullpen performance is what's totally off the beam |
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Post by manfred on Aug 20, 2021 9:39:12 GMT -5
How long as it been since we were on the outside looking in at the playoffs? There's the incentive for the team to right the ship. The bullpen performance is what's totally off the beam I wonder why, though? We’ve speculated much of the season about overwork. Are they tired? And/or did the crackdown really hurt Barnes? Or are some of these guys just not that good (e.g. Taylor)? Or is it just one of those flukey stretches when things go wrong? Put differently: is this it? Or can it turn? |
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Aug 20, 2021 9:53:39 GMT -5
The bullpen performance is what's totally off the beam I wonder why, though? We’ve speculated much of the season about overwork. Are they tired? And/or did the crackdown really hurt Barnes? Or are some of these guys just not that good (e.g. Taylor)? Or is it just one of those flukey stretches when things go wrong? Put differently: is this it? Or can it turn? Bullpen is certainly an issue. Seems a little unfair to single out Taylor as Otto, Barnes, Valdez, recent pickups, even Whitlock have really struggled. Also the Pen has to share this spiral with an offense which has, with few exceptions, been suddenly weak. And defense has not been stellar. On paper this remains a really good team. Hopefully this stretch against less talented teams can save the season. |
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Post by soxfansince67 on Aug 20, 2021 10:13:15 GMT -5
How long as it been since we were on the outside looking in at the playoffs? There's the incentive for the team to right the ship. The bullpen performance is what's totally off the beam I don't see that - the offense has been out of sorts for quite a while now, and that puts a LOT of pressure on the pitchers. |
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Post by greenmonster on Aug 20, 2021 10:13:44 GMT -5
Curious if any of the more stat-savy posters have any data on this thought.....The sticky stuff crackdown was suppose to remove an unfair advantage for pitchers and allow more offense. This clearly hasn't been the case with the Red Sox as they have struggled during most of that time period. Is this similar across baseball or just the Sox offense?
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Post by kingofthetrill on Aug 20, 2021 10:21:24 GMT -5
If we could just not be a national embarrassment, I'd take that.
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Post by vokuhila on Aug 20, 2021 12:02:39 GMT -5
The bullpen performance is what's totally off the beam I wonder why, though? We’ve speculated much of the season about overwork. Are they tired? And/or did the crackdown really hurt Barnes? Or are some of these guys just not that good (e.g. Taylor)? Or is it just one of those flukey stretches when things go wrong? Put differently: is this it? Or can it turn? Some of them are just "coming down to earth". A month (or more, can't remember when i looked) ago the bulk of the relievers were outperforming their expected results by quite a bit, some still are (Sawamura's ERA is nearly 2 points lower than it should, Whitlocks 1.3). The rest of the relievers "normalized" their results...some "overcorrected" and are now underperforming (Barnes ERA is 1.25 higher than it should be). Have a look yourselves: baseballsavant.mlb.com/leaderboard/expected_statistics?type=pitcher&year=2021&position=&team=111&min=25&sort=15&sortDir=desc |
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Aug 20, 2021 14:21:51 GMT -5
Hernandez 4
Devers 5
Bogaerts 6
Schwarber DH
Martinez 7
Verdugo 9
Vazquez 2
Duran 8
Dalbec 3
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Post by manfred on Aug 20, 2021 14:24:14 GMT -5
Hernandez 4 Devers 5 Bogaerts 6 Schwarber DH Martinez 7 Verdugo 9 Vazquez 2 Duran 8 Dalbec 3 This is pretty ideal, I think. |
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 20, 2021 14:42:29 GMT -5
Hernandez 4 Devers 5 Bogaerts 6 Schwarber DH Martinez 7 Verdugo 9 Vazquez 2 Duran 8 Dalbec 3 This is pretty ideal, I think. Swap Dalbec out of the lineup for Renfroe and that's about as good as their lineup gets. I really hate seeing JDM forced into the outfield, but if Schwarber doesn't play 1b that's what happens. |
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Post by incandenza on Aug 20, 2021 15:04:18 GMT -5
This is pretty ideal, I think. Swap Dalbec out of the lineup for Renfroe and that's about as good as their lineup gets. I really hate seeing JDM forced into the outfield, but if Schwarber doesn't play 1b that's what happens. I'm pretty comfortable with JD in LF at Fenway; he's been downright good at that position this season. And Verdugo seems best in RF so that's also a plus. Renfroe can replace Duran late in the game either as a pinch-hitter or defensive replacement.
I'm glad they're using Schwarber in place of Renfroe against righties at least some of the time. That's one of the ways I thought he could add value to the team.
(By the way, Dalbec's wRC+ against righties: 95 since May 1st; 113 since June 1st; 94 since July 1st; 274 since August 1st. Renfroe has also improved against righties and for the season is up to a 97 wRC+, but Dalbec has been tolerable against them for a while now.)
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Post by DesignatedForAssignment on Aug 20, 2021 16:01:05 GMT -5
The bullpen performance is what's totally off the beam I don't see that - the offense has been out of sorts for quite a while now, and that puts a LOT of pressure on the pitchers. They scored 20 runs in one game, 16 in another. If we cap those at 9 runs ... that gives them 4 runs per game in August. One run/gm drop-off. Bullpen ERA is almost 7.00 in August. 2 serious issues. Those 2 blowout games distort the offensive stats, making it tougher to pinpoint the performance issue. |
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 20, 2021 17:10:57 GMT -5
Schwarber DH'ing again. This trade might have made this team worse.
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Post by blizzards39 on Aug 20, 2021 17:16:01 GMT -5
Schwarber DH'ing again. This trade might have made this team worse. How so? |
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Aug 20, 2021 17:19:00 GMT -5
Schwarber DH'ing again. This trade might have made this team worse. How so? Dalbec still playing 1st base and you have JDM in the outfield which is a substantial hit to the OF defense. He needs to be playing 1B and he needs to be playing regularly. |
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Post by incandenza on Aug 20, 2021 17:19:54 GMT -5
Schwarber DH'ing again. This trade might have made this team worse. As near as I can tell, every single critic of the Schwarber trade thinks that the Rays did great by adding Nelson Cruz.
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Post by manfred on Aug 20, 2021 17:29:38 GMT -5
Schwarber DH'ing again. This trade might have made this team worse. As near as I can tell, every single critic of the Schwarber trade thinks that the Rays did great by adding Nelson Cruz.
I’m not one of those, but in fairness, it is apples and oranges. I am very pro-Schwarber, but having him DH is certainly not what I was hoping for. I don’t agree it makes them “worse,” — I think JDM has not embarrassed himself or anything — but I doubt Bloom did this thinking it would result in JDM in the OF. Anyway… it is temporary, I assume, and I think have Schwarber hit should make up for possible defensive lapses. |
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shagworthy
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Post by shagworthy on Aug 20, 2021 17:30:24 GMT -5
It's really been a combination of poor situational hitting, pitching, baserunning, and defense that has put this team in a hole. Too many runners left in scoring position, to many outs run into, too many balls not gotten to in the field either because of errors, or because of lack of range (Looking at you Bogey, JD, and Dalbec) and too many fat pitches in/near the middle of the zone versus competitive pitches on the corners and elevated.
I named a few guys defensively, but as a whole even guys who we laud like Renfroe makes boneheaded mistakes sometimes in an attempt to show off his throwing arm. In fact, the one person who has looked good defensively of late is someone many of us panned in the beginning of the year. Devers has turned around his glovework and saved this team extra runs a few times right now.
So in short, it's a little bit of everything, and generally when that happens, it's because a team is pressing to do more than it's capable of. They need to reign it in and concentrate on what they did well earlier in the season and just let it come to them.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 20, 2021 17:44:02 GMT -5
Schwarber DH'ing again. This trade might have made this team worse. As near as I can tell, every single critic of the Schwarber trade thinks that the Rays did great by adding Nelson Cruz.
I'm sorry, but I have to disagree. In a vacuum it is, but it neglects two big factors. 1) Cruz has been available to the Rays for a month. 2) Cruz fills a DH spot that was a need and doesn't displace defensively inept players into the field. With the Sox, Schwarber has barely played and the need is for him at 1b. Dalbec, who is well below average, remains in the lineup, and JDM has had to go into the outfield. While you're comfortable with that I'm not. He is not an average outfielder. The numbers have also shown he's better as a DH. The time at DH gives him time for his video work which probably reflects upon why he's probably hits better as a DH. But the bigger factor with JDM is that DHing has kept him healthier. Schwarber is a welcome bat for the Sox but his fit is not as clean and you cannot compare 4 games of contribution to the month the Rays have gotten from Cruz. Like Manfred said at this point it's temporary, perhaps Schwarber does start playing 1b soon and can be adequate, but it hasn't happened yet and in the past 3 weeks the Sox have collapsed. Not saying Schwarber could have prevented this, but he might have been able to help in some of the closer games. You see the two as equals but I think it leaves out some variables. |
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Post by incandenza on Aug 20, 2021 17:56:28 GMT -5
As near as I can tell, every single critic of the Schwarber trade thinks that the Rays did great by adding Nelson Cruz.
I'm sorry, but I have to disagree. In a vacuum it is, but it neglects two big factors. 1) Cruz has been available to the Rays for a month. 2) Cruz fills a DH spot that was a need and doesn't displace defensively inept players into the field. With the Sox, Schwarber has barely played and the need is for him at 1b. Dalbec, who is well below average, remains in the lineup, and JDM has had to go into the outfield. While you're comfortable with that I'm not. He is not an average outfielder. The numbers have also shown he's better as a DH. The time at DH gives him time for his video work which probably reflects upon why he's probably hits better as a DH. But the bigger factor with JDM is that DHing has kept him healthier. Schwarber is a welcome bat for the Sox but his fit is not as clean and you cannot compare 4 games of contribution to the month the Rays have gotten from Cruz.Like Manfred said at this point it's temporary, perhaps Schwarber does start playing 1b soon and can be adequate, but it hasn't happened yet and in the past 3 weeks the Sox have collapsed. Not saying Schwarber could have prevented this, but he might have been able to help in some of the closer games. You see the two as equals but I think it leaves out some variables. Indeed, it would be slightly unfair to regard them as equals - after all, Cruz has been worth 0.0 fWAR over his full month in Tampa, while Schwarber has already been worth 0.2 in four games.
Broader point: Schwarber is not an absolutely ideal fit, it's true, but if (like me) you felt that the team's need at the deadline was not "a first baseman" but rather "a good hitter who can extend the lineup," then you can feel perfectly fine with his replacing Marwin on the roster, and replacing Renfroe against righties sometimes, etc.
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Post by manfred on Aug 20, 2021 18:11:24 GMT -5
I did not realize the Rangers offense was so bad. I always have an image of them as a no-pitch, slugging team. This is a game they should win! Go time!
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