|
|
Post by blizzards39 on Sept 12, 2021 1:30:24 GMT -5
Just looking at some stats and if Eovaldi has a strong finish it’s not crazy to think he may be in the running. Unfortunately for him his 10-8 record and mid 3s ERA are going to hurt. That said when you look at many of the advanced metrics he is right there.
|
|
cdj
Veteran
Posts: 14,053 
|
Post by cdj on Sept 12, 2021 1:44:05 GMT -5
I think it’s Ray’s at the moment
I could also see baseball writers being prisoner of the moment and naming Ohtani both MVP and Cy Young. And honestly I wouldn’t complain, I just don’t think he’s been the best pitcher
|
|
|
|
Post by unitspin on Sept 12, 2021 5:53:13 GMT -5
I think it’s Ray’s at the moment I could also see baseball writers being prisoner of the moment and naming Ohtani both MVP and Cy Young. And honestly I wouldn’t complain, I just don’t think he’s been the best pitcher I hope not he does not even have enough ip to qualify as a fulltime pitcher. What's it an ip for every team game played, I don't see him hitting 162 ip by the end of the season. Plus cole and rays numbers are better. |
|
|
|
Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 12, 2021 10:11:43 GMT -5
I think it’s Ray’s at the moment I could also see baseball writers being prisoner of the moment and naming Ohtani both MVP and Cy Young. And honestly I wouldn’t complain, I just don’t think he’s been the best pitcher I hope not he does not even have enough ip to qualify as a fulltime pitcher. What's it an ip for every team game played, I don't see him hitting 162 ip by the end of the season. Plus cole and rays numbers are better. Qualifying for the ERA title doesn't have anything to do with winning the Cy Young. Also not sure why you'd "hope" that Ohtani won't qualify. That's kind of weird... |
|
|
|
Post by unitspin on Sept 12, 2021 10:45:43 GMT -5
I hope not he does not even have enough ip to qualify as a fulltime pitcher. What's it an ip for every team game played, I don't see him hitting 162 ip by the end of the season. Plus cole and rays numbers are better. Qualifying for the ERA title doesn't have anything to do with winning the Cy Young. Also not sure why you'd "hope" that Ohtani won't qualify. That's kind of weird... It was phrased wrong I meant I hope he does not win the cy young. He is hands down the MVP, but cy young he's maybe 6th in line. |
|
|
|
Post by incandenza on Sept 12, 2021 13:14:04 GMT -5
I think it’s Ray’s at the moment I could also see baseball writers being prisoner of the moment and naming Ohtani both MVP and Cy Young. And honestly I wouldn’t complain, I just don’t think he’s been the best pitcher What's the argument for Ray over Cole? Ray's ERA is only 0.09 better, and Cole has a significant advantage in xERA, FIP, and xFIP. Cole is also better in K/9 and BB/9. |
|
cdj
Veteran
Posts: 14,053
|
Post by cdj on Sept 12, 2021 13:16:02 GMT -5
I think it’s Ray’s at the moment I could also see baseball writers being prisoner of the moment and naming Ohtani both MVP and Cy Young. And honestly I wouldn’t complain, I just don’t think he’s been the best pitcher What's the argument for Ray over Cole? Ray's ERA is only 0.09 better, and Cole has a significant advantage in xERA, FIP, and xFIP. Cole is also better in K/9 and BB/9. Tbh I don’t really care about predictive stats for end of season awards. The award is about what’s happened. I also don’t like the Yankees lol. Robbie is at 6.4 WAR, Cole at 5.7. Also Cole is a Yankee. |
|
|
|
Post by manfred on Sept 12, 2021 14:00:04 GMT -5
What's the argument for Ray over Cole? Ray's ERA is only 0.09 better, and Cole has a significant advantage in xERA, FIP, and xFIP. Cole is also better in K/9 and BB/9. Tbh I don’t really care about predictive stats for end of season awards. The award is about what’s happened. I also don’t like the Yankees lol. Robbie is at 6.4 WAR, Cole at 5.7. Also Cole is a Yankee. I find it impossible to believe voters are looking at things like xFIP, which is multiple levels of woulda-coulda-shoulda. The WAR difference makes a better case. But for the awards, narratives move votes, too… which is why I still think Ohtani and Cole would finish ahead of Ray (or a guy like Lynn). Stars and media markets get extra points. |
|
|
|
Post by incandenza on Sept 12, 2021 15:32:53 GMT -5
What's the argument for Ray over Cole? Ray's ERA is only 0.09 better, and Cole has a significant advantage in xERA, FIP, and xFIP. Cole is also better in K/9 and BB/9. Tbh I don’t really care about predictive stats for end of season awards. The award is about what’s happened. I also don’t like the Yankees lol. Robbie is at 6.4 WAR, Cole at 5.7. Also Cole is a Yankee. I get your logic, but those stats aren't merely predictive - they also tell us (some of) what happened. E.g., xERA tells us more or less how good a pitcher has been based on the sort of contact they gave up. And all those stats neutralize for defensive play, which seems like something you'd want to do if you're trying to answer the question "who has been the best pitcher."
I agree philosophically that something like a Cy Young award should be based on what actually happened, rather than what ought to have happened. But the multiverse stats do help us to fill in the picture of what happened.
At any rate, I think it only comes into play in this case because they're basically dead even by ERA. And then Cole has better K, BB, and HR numbers, so those are further points in his favor.
Meanwhile, I really don't think much of WAR for pitchers. But if you're into them, by fWAR Cole is ahead 5.2 to 3.6, so collectively the WAR numbers favor Cole as well.
I will say however: Cole being a Yankee is a perfectly legitimate reason to oppose him getting the Cy. I do endorse that part of your argument.  |
|
vokuhila
Veteran
Posts: 800
Member is Online
|
Post by vokuhila on Sept 13, 2021 1:43:20 GMT -5
Statwise Cole has a slight edge.
His biggest obstacle may be what happend earlier in the season: he was one of the poster boys for the sticky stuff...I don't know if they are willing to give a Cy Young to a guy who was clearly cheating (and basically admitted it) part of the season. I wouldn't...
|
|
