chaimtime
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Post by chaimtime on Mar 8, 2024 12:54:08 GMT -5
I'm feeling irritable right now and may delete this later, but the Andrew Bailey I remember was a 0 WAR player for 75% of his career. Live look at pitching workouts at JetBlue Park:
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Post by pappyman99 on Mar 8, 2024 13:00:05 GMT -5
Not sure how anyone can get on the FO for the contract because of a circumstance that happened after the fact?
Oh yeah they definitely would have done the same contract if they knew in spring training he would need TJ……………………….
The injury sucks. This is why I think we should focus on pitching in the drafts it’s just lest costly financially if a pre arb pitcher is lost for the season
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Post by Smittyw on Mar 8, 2024 13:07:47 GMT -5
I'm feeling irritable right now and may delete this later, but the Andrew Bailey I remember was a 0 WAR player for 75% of his career. 1) Pre-Sox (and injuries) Andrew Bailey was a darn good closer, as I recall. 2) So what?
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Post by iamnotluistiant on Mar 8, 2024 13:07:48 GMT -5
Some less than stellar major league players have become well-respected managers/coaches. And some stellar players have made less than great managers/coaches.
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Mar 8, 2024 13:33:15 GMT -5
I’ve long argued that the best players would actually make terrible coaches, so I don’t view it as a negative that Bailey was merely a solid professional.
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Post by ematz1423 on Mar 8, 2024 13:38:42 GMT -5
I’ve long argued that the best players would actually make terrible coaches, so I don’t view it as a negative that Bailey was merely a solid professional. Same, if someone is just more naturally gifted and talented than their peers then that type of person is probably not going to make a very good coach since they probably can't understand why someone might not be able to do what they were able to.
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Post by scottysmalls on Mar 8, 2024 13:45:20 GMT -5
Not sure how anyone can get on the FO for the contract because of a circumstance that happened after the fact? Oh yeah they definitely would have done the same contract if they knew in spring training he would need TJ………………………. The injury sucks. This is why I think we should focus on pitching in the drafts it’s just lest costly financially if a pre arb pitcher is lost for the seasonThis is also true for position players except generally teams are much better at drafting them.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Mar 8, 2024 13:59:20 GMT -5
I'm feeling irritable right now and may delete this later, but the Andrew Bailey I remember was a 0 WAR player for 75% of his career. Tom House says, "Huh?"
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Post by itinerantherb on Mar 8, 2024 14:24:11 GMT -5
I'm feeling irritable right now and may delete this later, but the Andrew Bailey I remember was a 0 WAR player for 75% of his career. 1) Pre-Sox (and injuries) Andrew Bailey was a darn good closer, as I recall. 2) So what? Smitty, you miss the point, which is that it's better to look at a former pitcher's stats after his shoulder blew up than his highly successful three-year run as an actual pitching coach.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Mar 8, 2024 15:21:01 GMT -5
I'm feeling irritable right now and may delete this later, but the Andrew Bailey I remember was a 0 WAR player for 75% of his career. Tom House says, "Huh?" Negative WAR player Walt Hriniak & his career 71 OPS+ would like a word as well.
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Post by pappyman99 on Mar 8, 2024 16:32:19 GMT -5
Not sure how anyone can get on the FO for the contract because of a circumstance that happened after the fact? Oh yeah they definitely would have done the same contract if they knew in spring training he would need TJ………………………. The injury sucks. This is why I think we should focus on pitching in the drafts it’s just lest costly financially if a pre arb pitcher is lost for the seasonThis is also true for position players except generally teams are much better at drafting them. But I’d venture to say SPs have significantly more lost seasons than position players. I feel like it’s 50/50 now that a sp has TJ now. Position players tearing their Achilles or acl is much less do Mom
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Post by ematz1423 on Mar 8, 2024 16:38:41 GMT -5
This is also true for position players except generally teams are much better at drafting them. But I’d venture to say SPs have significantly more lost seasons than position players. I feel like it’s 50/50 now that a sp has TJ now. Position players tearing their Achilles or acl is much less do Mom Probably so but if anything you're kind of making an argument why it's sometimes best to focus on drafting position players. Pitchers get hurt more often which as a young developing pitcher trying to make your way through the minors if you get TJ poof there goes a year of precious development time. They also just flat out breakdown more than position players. I'm not saying that the answer is to never draft pitchers high but it's also not to just focus on pitchers either.
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Post by pappyman99 on Mar 8, 2024 16:43:43 GMT -5
But I’d venture to say SPs have significantly more lost seasons than position players. I feel like it’s 50/50 now that a sp has TJ now. Position players tearing their Achilles or acl is much less do Mom Probably so but if anything you're kind of making an argument why it's sometimes best to focus on drafting position players. Pitchers get hurt more often which as a young developing pitcher trying to make your way through the minors if you get TJ poof there goes a year of precious development time. They also just flat out breakdown more than position players. I'm not saying that the answer is to never draft pitchers high but it's also not to just focus on pitchers either. But that’s not apples to apples Losing a season of development or in their arb years as an SP is without question less costly than losing a High end FA SP to FA. Even in this case Giolito was a meh signing and is $19 million against the luxury tax for nothing I’m arguing FA money should overwhelming be used on position players To me that’s what the dodgers for the most part did up until this offseason. They have always had a line of young productive SPs coming through the system
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Post by sxfan on Mar 11, 2024 14:47:01 GMT -5
Elbow surgery scheduled for Giolito tomorrow per Pete Abraham.
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Post by julyanmorley on Mar 11, 2024 14:50:44 GMT -5
Won't know if it's TJS or internal brace until he wakes up it sounds like.
Internal brace would be a lot better for the team. He would likely be ready for ST next year and his remaining contract would be looking fine at that point.
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Post by notstarboard on Mar 11, 2024 15:37:19 GMT -5
Won't know if it's TJS or internal brace until he wakes up it sounds like. Internal brace would be a lot better for the team. He would likely be ready for ST next year and his remaining contract would be looking fine at that point. I feel like the best case for the team would be TJ, but for the Sox to be good in 2025 regardless, and for Giolito to come back on fire around the ASB. Then the Sox get a healthy, productive Giolito for the stretch run and into the playoffs, and a bargain of an option for 2026.
I'm still hoping for internal brace, though, because it would mean an easier road back and it feels like less has to go right for him to be helpful.
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Post by greenmonster on Mar 11, 2024 17:10:58 GMT -5
Anyone with a better medical perspective care to share their opinion.....does the fact that Giolito has already had a full TJ make the chances of a second TJ vs Brace more or less likely??
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Post by bojacksoxfan on Mar 11, 2024 17:26:07 GMT -5
Anyone with a better medical perspective care to share their opinion.....does the fact that Giolito has already had a full TJ make the chances of a second TJ vs Brace more or less likely?? I don't know that, but until recently the track record for returns after a 2nd TJS were horrible. But it appears that the surgical process has improved a lot. Nate Eovaldi is the poster boy for post TJS #2 success now and the Twins Chris Paddack is another guy who seems to have come back well, or at least well enough for the Twins to pencil him into their rotation.
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Post by bg23 on Mar 11, 2024 17:28:12 GMT -5
Anyone with a better medical perspective care to share their opinion.....does the fact that Giolito has already had a full TJ make the chances of a second TJ vs Brace more or less likely?? a prior TJ doesn’t make the internal brace more or less likely (not a doctor so don’t quote me lol). The internal brace is determined feasible by the location of the tear and the severity of the tear. They will leave open the possibility of having to do a full TJ once they get in there and see what they are working with, but seemingly based on their review of imaging the internal brace is a possibility, and I would even venture to say a strong possibility. What I haven’t had the time to look up the data on is success rate of second TJ vs internal brace after TJ. I would think he has a better chance of a successful recovery/return to form after the internal brace but that’s just my assumption.
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Post by stunzisox on Mar 11, 2024 17:57:50 GMT -5
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Post by wOBA Fett on Mar 11, 2024 18:47:36 GMT -5
Won't know if it's TJS or internal brace until he wakes up it sounds like. Internal brace would be a lot better for the team. He would likely be ready for ST next year and his remaining contract would be looking fine at that point. Or he reaches the 140 inning mark in 2025 and the $14MM team option in 2026 becomes a $19MM mutual option in 2026 with a $1.5MM buyout.
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Post by julyanmorley on Mar 11, 2024 19:00:51 GMT -5
Won't know if it's TJS or internal brace until he wakes up it sounds like. Internal brace would be a lot better for the team. He would likely be ready for ST next year and his remaining contract would be looking fine at that point. Or he reaches the 140 inning mark in 2025 and the $14MM team option in 2026 becomes a $19MM mutual option in 2026 with a $1.5MM buyout. Good luck to next year's manager trying to get him to agree to go on the IL with a non-catastrophic injury
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Post by iakovos11 on Mar 11, 2024 19:03:26 GMT -5
Anyone with a better medical perspective care to share their opinion.....does the fact that Giolito has already had a full TJ make the chances of a second TJ vs Brace more or less likely?? I got nothing with this. However, if it's cancer, maybe I can something.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Mar 11, 2024 21:03:23 GMT -5
Second opinion confirms first: Lucas Giolito to have elbow surgery and is lost for 2024 Red Sox righthander Lucas Giolito is scheduled for elbow surgery in Alabama on Tuesday afternoon, the extent of which is to be determined.
Giolito tore his ulnar collateral ligament while facing the Twins on March 1. He saw Dr. Jeffrey Dugas for a second opinion Monday. Dugas confirmed the initial diagnosis and will handle the surgery.
“We’ll know more when they go in,” manager Alex Cora said. “The type of surgery, we don’t know.”
Read more at Globe.com/Sports
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Post by Foulke_In_Athol on Mar 11, 2024 21:05:24 GMT -5
[br I think I speak for the entire board when I Say.... "Gnarly"
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