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Post by Jonathan Singer on May 20, 2013 9:32:58 GMT -5
5/20 Red Sox (LHP Jon Lester 6-0 2.72) @ White Sox (RHP Dylan Axelrod 1-3 4.27) 8:10 pm ET, NESN/WEEI5/21 Red Sox (LHP Felix Doubront 3-1 6.03) @ White Sox (LHP Jose Quintana 2-1 3.97) 7:10 pm ET, NESN/WEEI5/22 Red Sox (RHP Clay Buchholz 1.78) @ White Sox (LHP Chris Sale 5-2 2.53) 8:10 pm ET, NESN/WEEIMLB StandingsRed Sox Hitting StatsRed Sox Pitching StatsMLB ScoreboardMLB TransactionsWeatherSeries Thread Disclaimer: The SoxProspects Moderators will be somewhat liberal in policing the Red Sox "Series" Threads. Some of the Ground Rules are applied loosely in here, as we understand that there is a tendency to want to react (or overreact) to every play of a Sox game with one line reactionary posts. Those posts are okay in the Red Sox Series threads to a point - we certainly appreciate the passion. Just try not to overdo it, and try to maintain some semblance of reason. In addition, please don't let those type of posts spill over to other more substantive threads, where they may be deleted. -The Management
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2013 19:22:04 GMT -5
Am I the only one concerned about Ellsbury?
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wcp3
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Post by wcp3 on May 20, 2013 19:27:03 GMT -5
That's why Lester's not an ace.
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Post by templeusox on May 20, 2013 19:51:59 GMT -5
Shhh...No one say anything about Jacoby Ellsbury's performance this season. He's gotten a pass his whole career. No need to start holding him accountable now.
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Post by godot on May 20, 2013 20:01:23 GMT -5
No, Ellsbury has not been given a pass. The Globe writers are always nailing him, and Abraham has almost daily account of his struggles. Right now he is totally put of sync in approach and mechanics. What is his ground ball rate? His 30 home runs was not going to be repeated, as pitchers would throw him differently. But it is more than that. I wonder how much has to do with the shoulder injury. They take time to heal and sometimes can result in a different swing
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Post by station13 on May 20, 2013 20:11:50 GMT -5
Ellsbury just doesn't square up the ball anymore. I don't know how much longer he is allowed to flounder.
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Post by bluechip on May 20, 2013 20:55:04 GMT -5
Ellsbury just doesn't square up the ball anymore. I don't know how much longer he is allowed to flounder. I would love to see Pedroia bat second or leadoff and then move Drew up in the order.
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Post by bluechip on May 20, 2013 20:57:39 GMT -5
Ellsbury just doesn't square up the ball anymore. I don't know how much longer he is allowed to flounder. I would love to see Pedroia bat second or leadoff and then move Drew up in the order. EDIT: My if I was Farrell: Pedroia Drew Napoli Oritz Nava Victorino Salty Ellsbury Middlebrooks That even (without really trying) separates the the lefties.
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wcp3
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Post by wcp3 on May 20, 2013 21:38:46 GMT -5
So, Ellsbury looks good.
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Post by bsout2 on May 20, 2013 21:56:00 GMT -5
Mortensen has been great this year, considering all that has been asked of him.
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Post by station13 on May 20, 2013 22:06:35 GMT -5
Ellsbury with his penchant for wearing out second basement. But he's wearing out his stay as a lead off hitter.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on May 20, 2013 22:09:03 GMT -5
Ellsbury with his penchant for wearing out second basement. But he's wearing out his stay as a lead off hitter. But he's fast. And it's something he's done in the past. These are the only criteria that matter.
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Post by marrcus on May 20, 2013 22:47:34 GMT -5
"So, Ellsbury looks good. " --------------------- At least he looks healthy.
I don't know how long it's going to be before there's some real problems in the OF but it's pretty obvious that if the RS are going to be around in the dog days they are going to have to come up with another OF at some point.
Victorino is going to get hurt and Gomes isn't good enough.
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Post by hammerhead on May 21, 2013 6:50:50 GMT -5
Ellsbury is trying to pull everything and it's ugly. There were at least two times last night he tried to pull an outside pitch, when he should be just trying to flick that into Left Field for a base hit. Maybe the fact that it's a contract year is on his mind and he's trying to hit a 5 run homer every AB?
Gomes is terrible, he takes the occasional walk, but he's a big glue-bag and can't play the outfield. Carp is light years better even since he's cooled off recently. They should give Carp a string of real playing time especially now that Victorino is hurt every other day. Sooner or later you need to start thinking about Brentz.
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Post by okin15 on May 21, 2013 8:58:51 GMT -5
I would love to see Pedroia bat second or leadoff and then move Drew up in the order. Pedroia Drew Napoli Oritz Nava Victorino Salty Ellsbury Middlebrooks Ugh, I'd hate to have Napoli third. Victorino has done well at the top of the order as well. I wouldn't mind moving Ells down and the next 5 up one spot though.
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Post by James Dunne on May 21, 2013 9:11:47 GMT -5
I'd prefer Napoli behind Ortiz myself. I'd also put Pedroia second. Victorino, with limited power but solid on-base ability, would make a pretty sensible leadoff hitter.
I really don't think lineup construction is a serious problem with the Red Sox right now though. Ellsbury has been underperforming, but this isn't like that time where Grady Little had the three worst OBPs in the lineup in the three first spots. We're getting to the point where Ellsbury's struggles going back to last year are moving outside the small sample area, so I can see the calls to move him, but again, it's not 2003 - there isn't a Bill Mueller toiling away 8th in the order because the manager insists that he's comfortable there, unlike when he went 0 for 4 that one time he hit second.
I still have nightmares about the Grady Little era.
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Post by okin15 on May 21, 2013 9:14:16 GMT -5
I didn't realize how good Time Naehring and Bill Mueller were until I looked up old lineups the other day. Damn, they shoulda been superstars!
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Post by James Dunne on May 21, 2013 9:29:21 GMT -5
Naehring couldn't stay on the field, unfortunately. He was very well regarded in his day, though.
John Valentin is one of the most underrated players of that era. He was the best player on a really good 1995 team, and he hit .303/.384/.492 with excellent defense at three infield positions from 1994-1997. Basically, he was the player that Michael Young's fans thought Michael Young was. His bat started to slow in '98 though, and it was sadly a pretty steep decline for him.
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Post by welovewally on May 21, 2013 9:55:55 GMT -5
I thought (actually I expected) Middlebrooks would be better defensively then what he has shown so far.
Wouldn't Iglesias be a better option then Ciriaco as the teams infield/utility player? I hope its in the works with him playing 3B at Pawtucket recently.
And I agree that Bryce Brentz should be getting some consideration as a possible addition to the Outfield mix for LF and this batting lineup.
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Post by ibsmith85 on May 21, 2013 10:05:52 GMT -5
Naehring couldn't stay on the field, unfortunately. He was very well regarded in his day, though. John Valentin is one of the most underrated players of that era. He was the best player on a really good 1995 team, and he hit .303/.384/.492 with excellent defense at three infield positions from 1994-1997. Basically, he was the player that Michael Young's fans thought Michael Young was. His bat started to slow in '98 though, and it was sadly a pretty steep decline for him. I am still miffed at why he absent from the players on the top of the SP pages snuggled nicely between The Hit Dog and Nomar. LOVED Valentin.
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Post by jrffam05 on May 21, 2013 11:11:42 GMT -5
Wouldn't Iglesias be a better option then Ciriaco as the teams infield/utility player? I hope its in the works with him playing 3B at Pawtucket recently. I don't get this, I have no idea how you could possible justify playing Iglesias anywhere else but SS. Even if he is filling the utility/defensive replacement roll, he should come in at SS and Drew should move to third.
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danr
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Post by danr on May 21, 2013 12:05:39 GMT -5
Something's happened to Iglesius at Pawtucket and it's not good. Maybe a call up, despite his anemic BA, might be in order.
I don't think Brentz is ready yet, but he's not too far away. Meanwhile, I'd like to see Hazelbaker get a shot. It appears Victorino is going to be in and out of the lineup and Gomes should be out of it altogether. The Sox are going to have to do something about the OF situation.
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Post by bluechip on May 21, 2013 12:20:32 GMT -5
Pedroia Drew Napoli Oritz Nava Victorino Salty Ellsbury Middlebrooks Ugh, I'd hate to have Napoli third. Victorino has done well at the top of the order as well. I wouldn't mind moving Ells down and the next 5 up one spot though. I approached this from the sabermetric prospective. The most important spots in the order are second and fourth. Third is actually the fifth most important position to a lineup statistically. The idea is you put your best OBP at leadoff, your best hitter at cleanup, and you second best hitter second. Fifth is actually sightly more important than the third position. I am fine with Pedroia hitting second, and Drew leading off, but Drew probably has more power than Pedroia, so that is why I would bat him second. Nava and Napoli are interchangeable, but I like Nava's OBP skills in the slightly more important 5th slot. If you use the Baseball Musing lineup analysis tool (using stats for the season except for Drew, who I used May stats, since I think that better demonstrates his ability), it optimizes the lineup as: Pedroia Drew Salty Oritz Nava Middlebroooks Napoli Ellsbury Victorino It predicts the lineup will score 5.942 runs per game. BTW, it predicts 5.932 for a lineup of: Pedroia Drew Napoli Oritz Nava Middlebroooks Salty Ellsbury Victorino www.baseballmusings.com/cgi-bin/LineupAnalysis.py?Player0=Pedroia&OBA0=+0.429&Slug0=+0.438&Player1=Oritz&OBA1=+0.402&Slug1=+0.647&Player2=Napoli&OBA2=+0.335&Slug2=+0.503&Player3=Victorino&OBA3=+0.343&Slug3=+0.362&Player4=Salty&OBA4=+0.347&Slug4=+0.495&Player5=Ellsbury&OBA5=+0.303&Slug5=+0.335&Player6=Nava&OBA6=+0.382&Slug6=+0.488&Player7=Middlebroooks&OBA7=+0.249&Slug7=+0.433&Player8=Drew&OBA8=+0.394&Slug8=+0.536&Model=0
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Post by James Dunne on May 21, 2013 12:56:50 GMT -5
Stephen Drew's season batting average is lower than his career number, but his OBP is right on target, and his SLG is just a tick below. His May numbers are way out of proportion with his career production. He's never come close to a .394 OBP and a .536 SLG.
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Post by bluechip on May 21, 2013 14:08:00 GMT -5
Stephen Drew's season batting average is lower than his career number, but his OBP is right on target, and his SLG is just a tick below. His May numbers are way out of proportion with his career production. He's never come close to a .394 OBP and a .536 SLG. I think his May numbers will come down, but his numbers for the rest of the season are tough to peg. His approach this season is different than in the past and he is finally healthy. He is only swinging at 18.7 % of pitches outside of the zone, down from 24.3% for his career (this number is similar to least season). His numbers last season though were depressed as he was coming back from an injury. Overall, I don't expected a .900 OPS, but I do expect an OBP exceeding his career average, if not his career best.
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