|
Post by brianthetaoist on Aug 5, 2014 5:33:35 GMT -5
Correct me if I'm wrong but hasn't Owens made good progress on cutting down the walks this year? Or am I miss remembering? Absolutely. Last year, his BB/9 rate was about 4.5. This year in AA, it was 3.5. And even that's understating the improvement a little because he had some higher BB games earlier in the season ...
|
|
jimoh
Veteran
Posts: 3,984
|
Post by jimoh on Aug 5, 2014 7:21:25 GMT -5
I thought Owens always had a slower and a harder curve, but that he had thrown the harder one rarely because a and aa hitters could not hit the soft one. Very interesting night From a spring interview --?sorry can't paste both link and quote on phone On his two curveballs: “I have that one that is a slower for two-strike situations if I think the hitter is a little overzealous; or if he’s sitting on a curveball, I’ll throw it even slower; or I’ll throw it 2-0 or 3-1 and just drop it in there. And then I have another curveball that is on a sharper plane: it starts at the belt and I usually spike it in the dirt and trust my catcher to block it. I throw that one a little harder.”
|
|
|
Post by jmei on Aug 5, 2014 7:32:16 GMT -5
That slow curveball is going to be a show-me pitch at the upper levels, I think. Useful for occasionally stealing a strike, but MLB hitters have the ability to sit back on it and cream it (one of the reasons Greinke and Darvish haven't thrown their slow curves much). The development of that faster curve is key, especially as a chase pitch versus lefties.
|
|
|
Post by nexus on Aug 5, 2014 7:53:59 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by jmei on Aug 5, 2014 8:01:26 GMT -5
Wow, that curveball did look lethal.
|
|
|
Post by ibsmith85 on Aug 5, 2014 8:08:40 GMT -5
Dare we say pitching porn? That was fun to watch. Was his curve that much better than previously seen? Even at 91, the fastball showed some real zip, much like Koji blowing it by the hitter and then looking at 89 on the gun.
|
|
|
Post by jchang on Aug 5, 2014 8:45:14 GMT -5
I really don't think narrowly looking at Owens walk rate is a meaningful metric. looking at broader stats, he is clearly pitching to contact as he said in one of his interviews, (even if batters persist in striking out) rather than having better control. (I never had an issue with this control) year BB/9 K/9 ERA WHIP BA OBP SLG 2013 4.53 11.20 2.67 1.19 .177 .292 .274 2014*3.50 9.37 2.60 1.15 .201 .282 .305 *20 games in AA I think his L/R splits are much more interesting year L/R BB/9 K/9 WHIP BA OBP SLG 2013 v L 7.30 10.22 1.65 .203 .365 .338 2013 v R 3.49 11.57 1.02 .167 .260 .249 2014 v L 2.70 9.18 1.20 .216 .290 .312 2014 v R 3.80 9.44 1.13 .196 .279 .303 The much bigger deal is that Owens is now (much) above average against both L&R.
So Owens is not just pitching to contact (lower SO & lower BB) but also now has a good arsenal against lefties. It is worth noting that lefties were never particularly good in hitting Owens, it just that they used to be able to draw walks.
|
|
|
Post by vermontsox1 on Aug 5, 2014 9:33:16 GMT -5
Brian MacPherson ?@brianmacp 8m Henry Owens threw 20 of his 22 curveballs for strikes last night.
|
|
|
Post by WindyCityRedSox169 on Aug 5, 2014 10:24:45 GMT -5
Outside of the cureveball was the consistent hitting his spots. The curveball was lethal and missed low when it didn't hit Swihart's target which there is nothing wrong with that. The fastball showed pretty damn good command to me. The only miss that I saw seemed to be the curveball which probably caught to much of the plate.
|
|
|
Post by jmei on Aug 5, 2014 10:38:22 GMT -5
He did get away with hanging a few curveballs.
|
|
|
Post by WindyCityRedSox169 on Aug 5, 2014 10:48:29 GMT -5
He did get away with hanging a few curveballs. Are you talking in general throughout the game? I know Matt indicated he got hit hard in one inning and I am guessing those loud outs came as a result of that.
|
|
|
Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 5, 2014 14:51:22 GMT -5
Without having watched the video yet, it wouldn't surprise me if the "80 mph curveball" was a changeup. His change moves enough that at the right viewing angle, you might think it's a curve.
Again, not guaranteeing, but that was my first instinct. Matt was there last night and doesn't remember Owens throwing a curve that hard.
My understanding is that he'd essentially scrapped the hard curve he talked about in the above quote. He likes his slow one, and as long as it works, hey, more power to him.
|
|
|
Post by hammerhead on Aug 5, 2014 15:15:23 GMT -5
The really impressive thing to me is the way he spots the fastball and uses every inch of his lanky frame to create deception and angle. Usually that angle plays up against lefties (from a lefty), but it looks like the deception is messing up righties as well. Owens has always been a binky of mine and I think he can be an ace in the major leagues even though I'm probably the only one not related to him that holds that opinion.
He reminds me a little of Tom Glavine
|
|
|
Post by moonstone2 on Aug 5, 2014 15:30:22 GMT -5
The really impressive thing to me is the way he spots the fastball and uses every inch of his lanky frame to create deception and angle. Usually that angle plays up against lefties (from a lefty), but it looks like the deception is messing up righties as well. Owens has always been a binky of mine and I think he can be an ace in the major leagues even though I'm probably the only one not related to him that holds that opinion. He reminds me a little of Tom Glavine Glavine had three plus secondary pitches and extraordinary control of his two seam which he could locate to either side of the plate at will.
|
|
|
Post by James Dunne on Aug 5, 2014 15:37:29 GMT -5
Glavine also had an extraordinary aptitude for situational pitching. That's really tough to project on any young pitcher.
|
|
|
Post by soxfanatic on Aug 5, 2014 15:46:25 GMT -5
Glavine also had an extraordinary aptitude for situational pitching. That's really tough to project on any young pitcher. HOF ability is really tough to project on any young pitcher.
|
|
|
Post by hammerhead on Aug 5, 2014 16:16:31 GMT -5
I wasn't really using Glavine as a comp, I think the way he hides the ball (LOOKS) similar to Glavine. I'm not really talking about pitches or stuff, I meant it simply as his delivery reminds me a little of Glavine.
|
|
|
Post by brianthetaoist on Aug 5, 2014 16:20:07 GMT -5
Without having watched the video yet, it wouldn't surprise me if the "80 mph curveball" was a changeup. His change moves enough that at the right viewing angle, you might think it's a curve. Again, not guaranteeing, but that was my first instinct. Matt was there last night and doesn't remember Owens throwing a curve that hard. My understanding is that he'd essentially scrapped the hard curve he talked about in the above quote. He likes his slow one, and as long as it works, hey, more power to him. a) I think that could be true. The announcer called his change a "breaking ball" a couple of times ... it's got some glove-side movement, for sure. But ... b) He definitely has multiple looks to his curve at multiple speeds, though. Just from that clip, he struck guys out with a big, slow, looping one and a sharper one that he buried in front of Swihart. Who, btw, looks really solid on balls in the dirt ... I've noticed that before.
|
|
|
Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 6, 2014 8:48:19 GMT -5
Without having watched the video yet, it wouldn't surprise me if the "80 mph curveball" was a changeup. His change moves enough that at the right viewing angle, you might think it's a curve. Again, not guaranteeing, but that was my first instinct. Matt was there last night and doesn't remember Owens throwing a curve that hard. My understanding is that he'd essentially scrapped the hard curve he talked about in the above quote. He likes his slow one, and as long as it works, hey, more power to him. a) I think that could be true. The announcer called his change a "breaking ball" a couple of times ... it's got some glove-side movement, for sure. But ... b) He definitely has multiple looks to his curve at multiple speeds, though. Just from that clip, he struck guys out with a big, slow, looping one and a sharper one that he buried in front of Swihart. Who, btw, looks really solid on balls in the dirt ... I've noticed that before. Well like I said, it could be a curve, and I agree he has, at points at least, had different looks to it. But even his "hard curve" wasn't 80, iirc. As for Swihart, I watched Sunday's Portland game hoping to focus on Rodriguez, but found myself drawn more to his receiving. He really has become a very good defensive catcher.
|
|
|
Post by James Dunne on Aug 6, 2014 9:32:15 GMT -5
Glavine also had an extraordinary aptitude for situational pitching. That's really tough to project on any young pitcher. HOF ability is really tough to project on any young pitcher. Amen.
|
|
|
Post by jchang on Aug 6, 2014 12:40:05 GMT -5
HOF ability is really tough to project on any young pitcher. Amen. We're complaining that its difficult for us to project HOF? what burden does it put on the prospect who might be 18-20yr old?
|
|
|
Post by joshv02 on Aug 6, 2014 12:43:50 GMT -5
We're complaining that its difficult for us to project HOF? what burden does it put on the prospect who might be 18-20yr old? They probably aren't much better at predicting who will be in the HOF.
|
|