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Post by Jonathan Singer on May 10, 2015 8:30:24 GMT -5
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Post by benjaminbuttons on May 10, 2015 13:26:52 GMT -5
Owens seems to have a lot of these outings where hes not giving up any hits but hes still walking a batter an inning.
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Post by wskeleton76 on May 10, 2015 13:34:44 GMT -5
His control is a big problem.
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Post by benjaminbuttons on May 10, 2015 13:36:41 GMT -5
Comes out for the 5th and walk, walk, hits a batter, walk...pulled
3 ER's on no hits.
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Post by gregblossersbelly on May 10, 2015 14:27:34 GMT -5
Comes out for the 5th and walk, walk, hits a batter, walk...pulled 3 ER's on no hits. That ain't easy to do. Oh Henry  |
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Post by mattpicard on May 10, 2015 15:34:39 GMT -5
Kevin Thomas
?@clearthebases
.@portlandseadogs reliever Jonathan Aro getting congratulations in the clubhouse. Headed to Triple-A @pawsox
Kevin Thomas @clearthebases · 32s 32 seconds ago
Correction: it is Dayan Diaz getting called up to @pawsox from Portlaand
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Post by jdb on May 10, 2015 15:48:15 GMT -5
Owens probably needs at least the rest of the year in AAA and most likely a good bit of next season.
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wcp3
Veteran
Posts: 3,834
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Post by wcp3 on May 10, 2015 15:52:11 GMT -5
Owens has been pretty overrated by this board for awhile now - his control has shown little to no improvement over the years.
He's still young enough where it's definitely not panic time, but at some point he needs to actually take steps forward.
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Post by jdb on May 10, 2015 15:56:38 GMT -5
Owens has been pretty overrated by this board for awhile now - his control has shown little to no improvement over the years. He's still young enough where it's definitely not panic time, but at some point he needs to actually take steps forward. Agree. We probably will regret not selling high on him. |
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Post by Chris Hatfield on May 10, 2015 16:09:59 GMT -5
his control has shown little to no improvement over the years. Not true. It was improved last year and that was part of why some of us started to buy in, but it's gone in reverse this season. BB/9 2012 GRE: 101.1 IP, 4.17 BB/9 2013 SAL: 104.2 IP, 4.56 BB/9 // POR: 30.1 IP, 4.45 BB/9 2014 POR: 121 IP, 3.50 BB/9 // PAW: 38 IP, 2.84 BB/9 2015: PAW: 31 IP, 7.26 BB/9 after today Part of me wonders if he's trying to get too cute after getting hit hard in his AAA call-up last year. His LD% against this year has jumped to 22 after sitting around 14 last year. K rate has dropped too. Still, let's give him time to learn the slider he just added and see if he can improve the C&C at all. |
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Post by Oregon Norm on May 10, 2015 17:24:41 GMT -5
As mentioned a few times, there's adjustment needed. This kid is all of 22, has cruised through the system - till now - and is in the process of expanding his repertoire. I'm sure there are plenty of teams who'd be glad to take him on if the Sox want to dump him. The way a young player handles his first taste of adversity can tell us a lot about him and what comes next. As pointed out, some of the peripherals have turned, but that new pitch may have a bit to do with that also. A little patience may be in order after all of six starts.
As for how the board sees him, and the idea that he's been over-rated, go back and take a hard look at the thread. It's filled with some very tough back and forth about his value and what he might develop into. That's what the board is for, to hash that stuff out. For everyone who thought he was a cinch, there were others bringing up questions, many specifically about his control. It's been far from a love-fest. He's got work to do, let's see how he deals with it.
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Post by DesignatedForAssignment on May 10, 2015 19:19:43 GMT -5
Seadogs: 5 errors ... the long summer continues.
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Post by azblue on May 10, 2015 19:56:22 GMT -5
A young prospect hits a speed bump and the line forms to push him in front of the next bus. Reminds me of the comments about Brian Johnson in his first year. Anything less than consistent, exceptional performance and the sky is falling.
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Post by okin15 on May 11, 2015 8:33:15 GMT -5
I think the current concern is real and understandable, but that doesn't take away from the improvement he showed last year, his potential going forward, or his young age. Agree with Chris and Norm on this one. It's wait and see (but maybe not as high on my list as he was.)
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Post by ancientsoxfogey on May 11, 2015 9:56:41 GMT -5
I think the current concern is real and understandable, but that doesn't take away from the improvement he showed last year, his potential going forward, or his young age. Agree with Chris and Norm on this one. It's wait and see (but maybe not as high on my list as he was.) As long as batters continue to not be able to hit the ball on HO you keep him and work with him. Sandy Koufax didn't discover control and command until he was 25. Now I'm not comparing HO to Koufax other than to say that some players "get it" later than others. But as long as the H/9 stays low, one has to consider HO at least intriguing. Make sure a long reliever or piggyback starter is available on his days -- something. Allowances can be made in the minors. |
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Post by benjaminbuttons on May 11, 2015 11:45:45 GMT -5
A young prospect hits a speed bump and the line forms to push him in front of the next bus. Reminds me of the comments about Brian Johnson in his first year. Anything less than consistent, exceptional performance and the sky is falling. 7.26 BB/9 you're right, no room for concern we're just picking on him. To come into this thread after he walked 6, hit a batter and gave up 3 ER's in 4 innings. "Anything less the exceptional" come on. |
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Post by kman22 on May 11, 2015 11:56:31 GMT -5
A young prospect hits a speed bump and the line forms to push him in front of the next bus. Reminds me of the comments about Brian Johnson in his first year. Anything less than consistent, exceptional performance and the sky is falling. 7.26 BB/9 you're right, no room for concern we're just picking on him. To come into this thread after he walked 6, hit a batter and gave up 3 ER's in 4 innings. "Anything less the exceptional" come on. He also allowed zero hits... |
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Post by mgoetze on May 11, 2015 12:14:24 GMT -5
He also allowed zero hits... That tends to be a pretty unpredictive stat though. |
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Post by jimed14 on May 11, 2015 12:25:29 GMT -5
He also allowed zero hits... That tends to be a pretty unpredictive stat though. He has allowed 6.81 H/9 in his minor league career. Eventually, it's predictable that he'll give up less hits than other pitchers like Barnes or Workman who gave up more than 8. |
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Post by jmei on May 11, 2015 12:46:16 GMT -5
That tends to be a pretty unpredictive stat though. He has allowed 6.81 H/9 in his minor league career. Eventually, it's predictable that he'll give up less hits than other pitchers like Barnes or Workman who gave up more than 8. (a) the H/9 disparity is largely driven by the differences in strikeout rates, and you should just say BABIP when you mean BABIP, (b) Owens has all of 426 IP in his minor league career, which is nowhere near large enough of a sample to conclude that he has a true-talent BABIP skill (it takes roughly 2000 balls in play for a pitcher's observed major league BABIP to be as predictive of his future BABIP as the league average BABIP; Owens has 1071 minor league BIP). (c) even with a true-talent .281 BABIP, giving up 0 hits on 9 balls in play is pretty flukey. |
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Post by brianthetaoist on May 11, 2015 13:12:46 GMT -5
Yeah, Hank's BB/9 is way up, and his K/9 is way down ... his H/9 is held down by an unsustainable .200 BABIP. There's not much good going on; he's had a bad start to the season so far, for sure. But it's also just a bad month, and he's trying to incorporate a new pitch. It's always good when prospects dominate, but it's way too early to start getting worried about Owens.
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Post by jimed14 on May 11, 2015 13:14:42 GMT -5
IMO, it's also better for prospects to struggle and recover in the minors rather than never struggle and then have to learn how to get through it in the majors.
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