bosox
Veteran
Posts: 2,117
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Post by bosox on Aug 9, 2016 21:27:22 GMT -5
Could Kimbrel still be hurt? I know that reliever are volatile, but this is just ridiculous. I thought his control was sporadic before the injury.
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radiohix
Veteran
'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
Posts: 6,370
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Post by radiohix on Aug 9, 2016 21:28:27 GMT -5
Any updates on Manny Margot numbers? WHy? Can we get him back? Will this change anything? No, just let it go. Its done and over with. It's something to keep in mind when the team's GM wants to get some of the "big names" out there while giving some of our top notch prospects. Never pay big prices for relievers.
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Post by bosox81 on Aug 9, 2016 21:28:44 GMT -5
Honestly, just make Ziegler the closer. It's the one move by DDo that has worked so far.
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Post by patford on Aug 9, 2016 21:29:18 GMT -5
37 freakin pitches. Now he's probably out for 2 games because Farrell didn't take him out earlier. Two batters too late. "37 freakin pitches. Now he's probably out for 2 games because Farrell didn't take him out earlier." There's a silver lining.
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Post by bosox81 on Aug 9, 2016 21:29:31 GMT -5
Could Kimbrel still be hurt? I know that relievers are volatile, but this is just ridiculous. He had two outstanding games in Seattle.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Aug 9, 2016 21:34:57 GMT -5
Could Kimbrel still be hurt? I know that relievers are volatile, but this is just ridiculous. He had two outstanding games in Seattle. and thats what is frustrating. walking 4 guys in a row, that's just too much of a difference.
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,845
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Post by nomar on Aug 9, 2016 21:38:49 GMT -5
Could Kimbrel still be hurt? I know that relievers are volatile, but this is just ridiculous. Yeah he's clearly not right.
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Post by bosox81 on Aug 9, 2016 21:39:34 GMT -5
He had two outstanding games in Seattle. and thats what is frustrating. walking 4 guys in a row, that's just too much of a difference. The Mariners also have a different approach from the Yankees. I watched one of the games and they were swinging at stuff in the dirt.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Aug 9, 2016 21:41:04 GMT -5
S. Barnes (1)
Add: I was at the Seattle games. He was getting ahead in the count and then throwing the slider with the false bottom. That's the way he's effective. He was falling behind in this game and that doesn't work anywhere near as well. My impression is he's not much good after 25 pitches.
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Post by James Dunne on Aug 9, 2016 22:01:20 GMT -5
I've never seen a manager have a replacement reliever ready three batters after bringing the closer in. Blaming Farrell for Kimbrel walking the park is ridiculous.
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Post by bosox81 on Aug 9, 2016 22:07:21 GMT -5
S. Barnes (1) Add: I was at the Seattle games. He was getting ahead in the count and then throwing the slider with the false bottom. That's the way he's effective. He was falling behind in this game and that doesn't work anywhere near as well. My impression is he's not much good after 25 pitches. Like being 1-2 on Hicks? Also 2-2 on Headley and Ellbury?
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Post by telson13 on Aug 9, 2016 22:25:29 GMT -5
Last three outings by Porcello he has gone 9 innings, 8 innings, and 8 innings. Bullpen loves this guy. EDIT: Please do me a favor, and go to Porcello's game logs this season. Look at the IP column and the ER column. Then tell me whether you still miss Lester. I've been saying this: at 2 years/$65M extra for Lester, and ages 27-30 instead of 32--37? I'll take Porcello. I liked Lester too, but he was always going for the money. His whole "hometown discount" speech was a ploy to get the fans and media on his side and drive up the price. He never made any effort to stick around.
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Post by Coreno on Aug 9, 2016 22:48:10 GMT -5
S. Barnes (1) Add: I was at the Seattle games. He was getting ahead in the count and then throwing the slider with the false bottom. That's the way he's effective. He was falling behind in this game and that doesn't work anywhere near as well. My impression is he's not much good after 25 pitches. Like being 1-2 on Hicks? Also 2-2 on Headley and Ellbury? Yes... The count was 1-2 to Hicks after a first pitch ball, and both Headley and Ellsbury were 2-1 before being 2-2. I would absolutely say he was falling behind hitters.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Aug 9, 2016 23:27:00 GMT -5
S. Barnes (1) Add: I was at the Seattle games. He was getting ahead in the count and then throwing the slider with the false bottom. That's the way he's effective. He was falling behind in this game and that doesn't work anywhere near as well. My impression is he's not much good after 25 pitches. Like being 1-2 on Hicks? Also 2-2 on Headley and Ellbury? After he'd already thrown over 20 pitches, he went 3 straight balls to Gardner before walking him on 5 pitches. Then 0-1, 1-1, 2-1, 2-2, 3-2 then a foul and a walk to Ellsbury. That isn't going to work for the guy, not when he's climbing up towards 30 pitches. Before that, he'd gone 3-2 and 8 pitches to Gregorius, and a walk to Headly on six pitches. If he can't be more efficient, then taking him out is exactly what the team should do.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 10, 2016 0:11:14 GMT -5
Not surprising, but Kimbrel says his knee is still bothering him at times. I feel he came back too soon, figuring he can pitch, which is different from pitching effectively and/or consistently.
If that knee is still not right, I'd rather see him rest for awhile so he can come back stronger later than give haphazard performances like tonight.
I feel like the season hinges primarily on David Price and secondarily on Craig Kimbrel, which going into the season sounded like a great thing, but now sounds like a tenuous thing.
If Price and Kimbrel (being healthy enough) can capture their form from over the past five years that would give the Sox an ace to add to Porcello and Wright and a dominant closer supported by Ziegler, Barnes, and Tazawa.
Benintendi looks like he should have no problem being the solution in LF, and strangely enough the bottom of the order is now as strong as it's been since JBJ was lighting up the bottom of the order.
Between Leon, Benintendi, and back to the top of the order Betts, the Sox are getting strong performances from where the lineup turns over. Now they need Xander, Ortiz, Hanley, Shaw, and JBJ to re-emerge from their slumps.
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Post by bosox81 on Aug 10, 2016 1:20:48 GMT -5
Like being 1-2 on Hicks? Also 2-2 on Headley and Ellbury? After he'd already thrown over 20 pitches, he went 3 straight balls to Gardner before walking him on 5 pitches. Then 0-1, 1-1, 2-1, 2-2, 3-2 then a foul and a walk to Ellsbury. That isn't going to work for the guy, not when he's climbing up towards 30 pitches. Before that, he'd gone 3-2 and 8 pitches to Gregorius, and a walk to Headly on six pitches. If he can't be more efficient, then taking him out is exactly what the team should do. Yeah, I'm going to drop this one. I was searching for things that did not exist. Just trying to find some reason for Kimbrel's struggles. Maybe it's all in his head. I don't know.
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ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,936
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Post by ericmvan on Aug 10, 2016 2:05:27 GMT -5
Letting Porcello pitch the 8th was a dumb decision that worked. But he had a great game. Letting him face Ellsbury in the 7th after Gardner had doubled was dumb; if his liner isn't right at Mookie, it's a 5-4 game and Kimbrel's meltdown leaves them with a tie game. He was up to 99 pitches including 18 already in the inning, two of the last four batters had doubled, and he was facing hitters for the 3rd time. There's no way a reliever isn't a better option at that point. The funny thing is, if Headley's ball takes a normal bounce and Shaw doesn't make the error, then there are still two outs, but now Porcello has just given up an RBI double and the tying run is coming up. And I bet JF goes to the pen. To a manager like JF, that's a much more serious situation, as opposed to thinking "he should have been out of the inning and this jam is not entirely his fault." But managers do this all the time -- they'll lift a pitcher after three straight cheap singles, but if three straight guys annihilate the ball and the defense makes two great plays, they'll leave the pitcher in -- even more so if the third hitter went yard rather than doubling. At some point, teams will have predictive models for what a pitcher can be expected to give up in the rest of an inning, based on exit velocity, pitches thrown so far and in this inning, times around the order, and so on. Chances are that such a model would tell you to pull Porcello at that point: 100%.
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Post by tjb21 on Aug 10, 2016 7:42:01 GMT -5
Good win, thank you Porcello.
Weird ending, just never easy with this team.
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Post by DesignatedForAssignment on Aug 10, 2016 11:26:04 GMT -5
with Leon's fade, I thought Ted Williams' .406 was safe for another year. But now Benintendi is making a late season run at the mark.
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ianrs
Veteran
Posts: 2,420
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Post by ianrs on Aug 10, 2016 11:28:29 GMT -5
Not enough can be said about Porcello's outing last night. That guy has been absolutely rock solid all year. Great start to the series, though you have to wonder what the heck is going on with Kimbrel.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 10, 2016 12:53:03 GMT -5
Not enough can be said about Porcello's outing last night. That guy has been absolutely rock solid all year. Great start to the series, though you have to wonder what the heck is going on with Kimbrel. His knee is still sore. He made it back really, really quickly from surgery and was barely in the minors rehabbing for more than a second before he was back in Boston. That seems kind of rushed to me. If his knee isn't right, maybe they should consider putting him on the DL to rest it further and call up Heath Hembree. They need Kimbrel to be right. Last night that obviously wasn't the case and I have trouble believing the knee bothering him wasn't a big part of that. One other thing - I kind of have to give Farrell some credit here. There was a lot of complaining about Matt Barnes being used in important situations when a lot of people here considered him to be just about the worst reliever the Sox have. Farrell kept using him, had faith in him, and saw something in him that said this kid is going to improve with experience. So far that's the case - Barnes (along with Ziegler) has been very valuable out of the bullpen, which they need with Kimbrel not right and Koji possibly out for the season.
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Post by GyIantosca on Aug 10, 2016 13:17:52 GMT -5
Porcello totally redeemed himself. Please talk to Price he is killing the Sox this year.
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Post by DesignatedKyle on Aug 10, 2016 13:53:19 GMT -5
1. Pedroia 2. Bogaerts 3. Betts
new lineup for to-nite
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Post by soxfanatic on Aug 10, 2016 15:41:27 GMT -5
Evan Drellich evandrellich 9 sec. Get this: Steven Wright hurt his shoulder pinch running in LA diving back into bag. Scratched from next start. MRI showed no structural dmg. Unbelievable. Another questionable decision turned sour.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 10, 2016 15:51:13 GMT -5
Evan Drellich evandrellich 9 sec. Get this: Steven Wright hurt his shoulder pinch running in LA diving back into bag. Scratched from next start. MRI showed no structural dmg. Unbelievable. Another questionable decision turned sour. That's awful. They take Ortiz out of harm's way to place Steven Wright into harm's way. Brilliant. They couldn't find another pitcher (I would say Buchholz but I think he was already pitching?) or bench player to pinch run?
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