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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 5:22:55 GMT -5
I am going to have to let go of the fact we didn't get Fultz.
Tatum is a great get despite the criticism from the pundits. I'm big on character and work ethic and no one has better character and work rate than Tatum. Having guys like him and Brown as the young pillars of the future bodes well. Besides the fact they can play, they have the right attitudes if doing what the coach wants - earning their way and working their asses off. Danny is building a culture and not sacrificing talent to do it.
I don't like the second round picks... first one was ok but not ideal because if who else was on the board.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 5:25:18 GMT -5
I know it won't work out this way right away but how fun would this second unit be next year?
Smart
Brown
Tatum
Yabusele
Zizic
Or
Smart
Rozier
Brown
Tatum
Zizic
Let that grow....
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 5:36:04 GMT -5
Ojeley may be able to make the roster... i hope they can trade D Jackson.... I'm not a fan of his game and I'd rather use his roster spot on a different developmental player...
There are going to be a ton of young guys on this team next year... their first unit better destroy teams early so the second unit can struggle and grow early in the year.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 6:29:51 GMT -5
I can't decide if analysts are just stupid or don't fully get it or just like big moves and screw the future ramifications. The criticism I'm hearing about the Celtics right now is crazy to me. They think it's ridiculous Danny didn't trade for Butler or make another similar move. Butler is an easy one to talk about so I will.
What the heck would trading for Butler accomplish? Who are we dealing? Just to make a comparable type offer to Minnesota you'd have to give up the 3 (Tatum) and let's say Smart and Rozier for Butler and the 16...
So now you are siting there with Butler, great your team next year is definitely better but now your cap room is basically gone. You can carve out space for a guy in the 20m range which will be another solid but complimentary player.
People keep saying they've been promising fireworks for years (Wyc - the fanboy owner said that not Danny btw) and when are they going to stop just rolling it over one year to the next? My god, this team just went to the ECF and it's going to get better top end talent this offseason (both with Tatum and likely Hayward or Griffin), PLUS add more exciting young pieces, especially Zizic.
Even if this team were in full rebuild and they had Tatum, Brown, Zizic, Smart, Rozier, Yabusele and all these upcoming draft picks people would be talking about how young and exciting they are to grow and develop in 3-5 years. So now they are doing that AND going to the ECF and people have an issue with it or don't understand what they are doing? If you can't see it, then get a new job. My lord, Danny is building a very good team now that might even be able to get to a finals this year while drafting and developing a future title contender (like a team like Philly or Phoenix is trying to do) and maintaining the flexibility to trade for that transcendent super star if he becomes available (no not Butler or one year of George or the current version of the Zinger).
Danny has proven to be patient and smart over and over again. I really wanted Fultz but I also didn't want Brown last year so what do I know?
Can't wait for free agency - if we end up with Hayward or Griffin and go into next year with a roster that looks like this I will be chomping at the bit to watch this team:
Starters:
IT
AB
Brown
Hayward/Griffin
Horford
Bench:
7. Smart
8. Rozier
9. Tatum
10. Yabusele
11. Zizic
12. Bogut (or similar vet free agent with midlevel exception)
13. Green (can sit in the bench most of the year to let kids develop then play if needed in playoffs again)
14. Vet free agent big minimum signing
15. Nader
Numbers were for roster counting only.
Yes, that team is dangerously young on the bench but honestly that's the risk they should be taking in this play both sides mode. The kids need to play and make mistakes and learn in big situations and if that means you are a 4-5 seed instead of a 1-2 seed then so be it... I doubt that will happen though.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 6:30:49 GMT -5
Sorry for the long post and vent. Readers digest version is I like the direction and am happy with Danny's patience and can't understand the pundits who don't get what he's doing.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 6:44:12 GMT -5
Do people believe Ainge when he says he would have taken Tatum number 1?
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Jun 23, 2017 6:57:23 GMT -5
So what happens wih Crowder now? Wouldn't it make more sense to trade AB than him? AB we can't afford to keep.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 7:05:35 GMT -5
Read this if you want to feel better about our first second round pick Ojeleye. It's a long read and only a couple paragraphs are about him, but you need to read the part at the beginning thru his couple paragraphs to get the full effect. It's well written and I'm officially on board with the pick now. www.google.com/amp/s/theringer.com/amp/p/41d14ea486b5 |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jun 23, 2017 7:11:06 GMT -5
Do people believe Ainge when he says he would have taken Tatum number 1? Well Danny isn't dumb. That's why he traded down at number one. I do think Tatum was number one on his draft board, finding a way to get more assets while getting that player is even better. |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jun 23, 2017 7:13:10 GMT -5
So what happens wih Crowder now? Wouldn't it make more sense to trade AB than him? AB we can't afford to keep. I'm thinking the Celtics might trade both in the same deal for Paul George. I'm not sure if the money can work, but maybe just maybe if you trade Rozier, Bradley, Crowder you can land George and still sign a max guy in free agency. |
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 7:14:25 GMT -5
So what happens wih Crowder now? Wouldn't it make more sense to trade AB than him? AB we can't afford to keep. If Griffin or Hayward are added then I think Crowder needs to go. I'm torn on Avery. I do not agree that they cannot afford to keep him. Yes it will be an expensive team with 3 max contracts and Bradley making over 20m and then Smart making more down the road (not convinced Smart is going to get paid more than 12-15m), but it's doable. Avery is such a good all around player and a guy who's such a great leader (by example) for the developing players that there is a lot of added value to him. That being said, at some point minutes need to shift and if Brown takes a step forward he could be your SG of the near and longterm future... I feel pretty confident that one way or another at least one of AB, Crowder and Smart are dealt. My bold prediction is that the Celtics come to terms with either Hayward or Griffin then trade 2 of the 3 plus 2 out of the non Brooklyn and Lakers first rounders for PG13. |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jun 23, 2017 7:16:45 GMT -5
Read this if you want to feel better about our first second round pick Ojeleye. It's a long read and only a couple paragraphs are about him, but you need to read the part at the beginning thru his couple paragraphs to get the full effect. It's well written and I'm officially on board with the pick now. www.google.com/amp/s/theringer.com/amp/p/41d14ea486b5Sounds like a great rotational player, which is better than the Celtics have gotten from even their late first round picks in recent years (with the exception of Sullinger). Danny said he was shocked and excited to see him fall so far to the Celtics. You can't have enough bigger men in the NBA. |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jun 23, 2017 7:24:27 GMT -5
Yeah it's probably impossible to sign a max contract guy and trade for Paul George even if you trade Rozier, Bradley, Crowder.
Maybe you can sign a max contract player first and then use a trade expection rule if you trade Crowder, Rozier, and Bradley. Figuring out these kind of things are tough when it comes to the NBA with seeing how things could play out.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 7:30:03 GMT -5
Yeah it's probably impossible to sign a max contract guy and trade for Paul George even if you trade Rozier, Bradley, Crowder. Maybe you can sign a max contract player first and then use a trade expection rule if you trade Crowder, Rozier, and Bradley. Figuring out these kind of things are tough when it comes to the NBA with seeing how things could play out. They can sign a max guy then trade for George... not saying they should or will but it's possible. My guess is they don't need to go full max to get Hayward or Griffin. They may take slightly less so the Celtics don't have to trade a key piece for them to fit. A big reason they are coming here is to win and I'm not sure the extra 2m a year is going to be that important for them. Maybe it will but I doubt it. Hayward, especially, can make that up in advertising for being in Boston vs Utah... Griffin not so much but he's probably the one who's taking the bigger step up in situations by coming to Boston. Who would people prefer now that we drafted Tatum? Griffin or Hayward? |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jun 23, 2017 7:32:27 GMT -5
If there is a way to make the money work and get a max free agent player and then getting even a rental like George, then it's worth it to the Celtics to do that.
That would maximize the roster fully this year, while building for the future.
I wouldn't want to give up the Lakers pick to get George though. You can have the Clippers, Mephis, or all the late 2018 2019 2020 or whatever Celtics picks you want.
You keep the lottery picks for a rental. Trade players (Rozier, Crowder, Bradley), get 4 teams involved to help facilitate a deal, just don't deal lottery picks.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jun 23, 2017 7:36:43 GMT -5
Go get Blake Griffin. I'm all set with anymore wing players. Go get the better rebounder. Plus if Griffin stays healthy, I think he might be the better player.
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 11,611
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Post by nomar on Jun 23, 2017 7:39:00 GMT -5
The money would have to balance out in a Paul George trade so we can afford to sign Griffin/Hayward and trade for George.
The real issue would be that you'd essentially be guaranteeing that IT leaves in free agency the following year if you want to extent PG. I kind of shutter at the idea of Smart running point as a starter in 2018-19.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 7:39:12 GMT -5
Ohh and go get Blake Griffin. I'm all set with anymore wing players. Go get the better rebounder. Plus if Griffin stays healthy, I think he might be the better player. I'm close to feeling this way... he's also a very good passer (not that Hayward isn't). You can always have one of Horford and Griffin on the court and often times both. |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jun 23, 2017 7:44:11 GMT -5
Ohh and go get Blake Griffin. I'm all set with anymore wing players. Go get the better rebounder. Plus if Griffin stays healthy, I think he might be the better player. I'm close to feeling this way... he's also a very good passer (not that Hayward isn't). You can always have one of Horford and Griffin on the court and often times both. Yeah, you could put Horford at the 5 basically 90 percent of the time. Not his best position on the court, but he can do it, even against bigger centers. Griffin could account for more rebounds as Horford does what he does best and boxes those big guys out. Griffin is almost the perfect fit for this team. |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jun 23, 2017 7:45:16 GMT -5
The money would have to balance out in a Paul George trade so we can afford to sign Griffin/Hayward and trade for George. The real issue would be that you'd essentially be guaranteeing that IT leaves in free agency the following year if you want to extent PG. I kind of shutter at the idea of Smart running point as a starter in 2018-19. Can't you use the bird rights on both Smart and IT and keep both players in this scenario? |
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 7:46:04 GMT -5
The money would have to balance out in a Paul George trade so we can afford to sign Griffin/Hayward and trade for George. The real issue would be that you'd essentially be guaranteeing that IT leaves in free agency the following year. I kind of shutter at the idea of Smart running point as a starter in 2018-19. You'd sign the player then trade for George then the money doesn't need to match.... And if this team makes he Finals you might still go for 4 max contracts (IT might get more like 25m versus a max but still..) IT Smart George Griffin/Hayward Horford Brown Tatum Rozier Zizic FA Big with midlevel FA FA Yabusele Ojeleye Nader/Bird/Allen |
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 7:47:59 GMT -5
The money would have to balance out in a Paul George trade so we can afford to sign Griffin/Hayward and trade for George. The real issue would be that you'd essentially be guaranteeing that IT leaves in free agency the following year if you want to extent PG. I kind of shutter at the idea of Smart running point as a starter in 2018-19. Can't you use the bird rights on both Smart and IT and keep both players in this scenario? It's not that they can't do it physically it's just will the ownership pay the ridiculous luxury tax... you're talking a stupid expensive roster, but if they can add Griffin/Hayward plus George while keeping all their top prospects and picks then it's interesting to say the least. |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jun 23, 2017 7:52:14 GMT -5
Can't you use the bird rights on both Smart and IT and keep both players in this scenario? It's not that they can't do it physically it's just will the ownership pay the ridiculous luxury tax... you're talking a stupid expensive roster, but if they can add Griffin/Hayward plus George while keeping all their top prospects and picks then it's interesting to say the least. Wick Grosbeck (spelling?), the owner of the Celtics has gone on record to saying money is never a issue when trying to put a team together in any given certain year trying to go for a championship. I don't think he'd go this much over all the time but for one year, he'll do it. |
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 7:54:57 GMT -5
It's not that they can't do it physically it's just will the ownership pay the ridiculous luxury tax... you're talking a stupid expensive roster, but if they can add Griffin/Hayward plus George while keeping all their top prospects and picks then it's interesting to say the least. Wick Grosbeck (spelling?), the owner of the Celtics has gone on record to saying money is never a issue when trying to put a team together in any given certain year trying to go for a championship. I don't think he'd go this much over all the time but for one year, he'll do it. It's not a one year issue - this coming year they wouldn't be over. It's when you go to extend George and Thomas and Smart after this year that they would get crushed going forward. |
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Post by rjp313jr on Jun 23, 2017 7:55:11 GMT -5
Just call him Wyc
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