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Interesting Roster Decisions Ahead...
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Jun 16, 2017 13:43:08 GMT -5
The problem with Plouffe is that he is almost a clone of Pablo, both in hitting and fielding. If he is available, and a lot of people seem to think he is, Todd Frazier, who hit 40 HRs last year, would be a better choice, assuming the price isn't too high. That's just not true. Sandoval is currently-.9 war, Plouffe is .2 war. Plouffe is a massive upgrade defensively. He has been in a major slump hitting for a month, but that happens. I see no reason to think his average won't go back to his career numbers in the .240 to .250 range with a little power. Frazier isn't a bad choice, but he is going to cost a ton more. I also don't see his average going up much. 3 straight years it has gone down.
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Post by larrycook on Jun 17, 2017 1:30:40 GMT -5
How sad is it when the choices for improvement over sandavol at third base are plouffe or Frazier?
How sad that our worthless GM has put us in such a horrible predicament.
Oh mr. Henry, maybe this offseason you can pull the plug and end this debacle before Any more sore armed pitchers in need of major surgery are acquired.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Jun 17, 2017 14:00:14 GMT -5
They'd make the playoffs if the season ended today and have the third-best record in the AL. How is that a "debacle?"
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Post by gregblossersbelly on Jun 17, 2017 14:22:18 GMT -5
They'd make the playoffs if the season ended today and have the third-best record in the AL. How is that a "debacle?" Don't ya miss the salad days of 2014&15? Dat was before DD ruined The Olde Towne Team😀
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Post by mredsox89 on Jun 17, 2017 14:32:45 GMT -5
They'd make the playoffs if the season ended today and have the third-best record in the AL. How is that a "debacle?" It's actually pretty impressive that they're in the position they're in getting nothing from $20M at 3B and nothing out of what they thought would be their top two setup relievers, plus almost nothing from Wright, 6+ weeks without Price, and nowhere near 100% Hanley. They've had guys step up, and I think most people would agree that this offense should/will get even better
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Post by jimed14 on Jun 17, 2017 15:02:23 GMT -5
If this team had the same fortune as the 2013 team with career seasons and injuries, they'd win 110 games.
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Post by soxjim on Jun 17, 2017 15:13:35 GMT -5
I don't see that many roster interesting roster decisions for the time being- When Pedrioa gets healthy and comes off the DL, Sam Travis gets sent down. Rutledge platoons probably with Moreland. When Johnson gets activated for his next start, Workman gets sent down. The only interesting roster decision that could come up in 2-3 weeks is the Carson Smith one. When he gets activated, then the Sox are faced with DFAing Boyer or Abad. They could do that or send down Matt Barnes. Marco Hernandez would get sent to the 60 day DL to make room for Smith on the 40 man roster if they sent down Matt Barnes. Given Farrell's affinity for Barnes, I don't see them sending him down. Dumping Boyer is an easy call -- he's found some success but is running a near-5 FIP and is as close to replaceable as it gets. I agree about the Travis option/Rutledge platoon at first base, but I would hope the organization is looking aggressively for an external solution to replace Rutledge or Marrero -- particularly, a RHH who is a capable defender at 1B and 3B. That way they can platoon with Moreland and you only keep Marrero or Rutledge in the lineup against LHP, while having every spot in the infield backed up. Plus it's good insurance in case Pablo gets hurt again or continues to be inept defensively. Frazier, Freese, and Ploufee all come to mind. I never agreed with the dislike for Barnes for this year. There is no way Barnes should even sniff going back to the minors.
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Post by Mike Andrews on Jun 17, 2017 15:14:41 GMT -5
They'd make the playoffs if the season ended today and have the third-best record in the AL. How is that a "debacle? I'm with Chris here. Everybody is free to have and express their own opinions, but the "Dumbroskwi" and "debacle" stuff is a little much here sometimes. DD inherited a last place team less than 2 years ago. Injuries to David Price, Eduardro Rodriguez, Steven Wright, Brian Johnson, Tyler Thornburg, Carson Smith, Roenis Elias, Robbie Ross, Dustin Pedroia, Brock Holt, Marco Hernandez, and to a lesser extent Hanley Ramirez this year. They have Chris Sale now, they have the 3rd best record in the AL, and they're 1 game out of 1st place. 17-8 over last 25 games. Devers and Travis knocking on the door as potential playoff contributors. Possibly some help to bolster the bullpen in Pawtucket. The Travis Shaw trade looks terrible with the benefit of hindsight. But the club did go into the season with 3 quasi-adequate 3B options in Sandoval, Holt, and Hernandez, with Devers maybe a year away at the time of the trade. Sandoval tanked and the other two went down with injuries. I don't buy that DD could have foreseen the Thornburg injury. I also don't weep too much for Travis Shaw, who hit .258 with a .619 OPS in the second half last year. It would be nice to have Shaw, but at this point, the club just needs a stopgap until Devers is ready. Just my two cents.
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Post by soxjim on Jun 17, 2017 16:42:53 GMT -5
How sad is it when the choices for improvement over sandavol at third base are plouffe or Frazier? How sad that our worthless GM has put us in such a horrible predicament. Oh mr. Henry, maybe this offseason you can pull the plug and end this debacle before Any more sore armed pitchers in need of major surgery are acquired. I've become more disappointed with DD more over time -- but to use words like "debacle" when we are doing pretty well is extreme. I get the feeling some of you were more happy watching 2014 and 2015 teams after a certain point in the season because you knew we were done and there no longer was any reason to feel nervous watching. Bottomline is imo 2014 and 2015 season were "debacles."
In order I think we need to do
1-- Most important fix 3b. As long as we are up in the standings, it's okay to wait for the right move. 2-- If there is 3b out there and if he has a big salary but has the ability to DH in the future - I'd be okay with that. Hanley Ramirez health is a concern. He seems very brittle. 3-- Consider trading Young if we can get a 3b that can DH in the future. No way we can make a 1 for 1 trade -- and get a good 3b that can be a potential future DH - I realize Young doesn't have much value. But maybe there can be some three-team trade worked out where a team that is out of it will be able to shed salary by trading a high priced player while they take in Young. 4-- Have ot ut a stop to beign shutout as often as we have so a 3b bat imo is important. 5-- Find a decent backup for Xander. The guy will wear down just like last year.
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Post by soxjim on Jun 17, 2017 16:52:16 GMT -5
Mike I agree 100% with your 1st paragraph but to call the 2nd "hindsight" -- any trade you can ofc call it "hindsight" but I don't think that trade was popular. SO how much was it "hindsihgth?" It was a bad trade. And it is the GM's job not get wiped out in a trade and trading Shaw should have gotten more along with not getting wiped out, no?
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jimoh
Veteran
Posts: 3,990
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Post by jimoh on Jun 17, 2017 17:18:13 GMT -5
2-- If there is 3b out there and if he has a big salary but has the ability to DH in the future - I'd be okay with that. Hanley Ramirez health is a concern. He seems very brittle. [...] Isn't it still crucially important for the future that we spend one year under the salary cap so that we reset out penalties to a lower level, so that it will cost much much less to go over it next year?
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Post by larrycook on Jun 17, 2017 18:56:27 GMT -5
They'd make the playoffs if the season ended today and have the third-best record in the AL. How is that a "debacle?" Why do you think the debacle is related to play on the field? I happen to be happy with the job Farrell has done.
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Post by soxjim on Jun 17, 2017 20:39:17 GMT -5
2-- If there is 3b out there and if he has a big salary but has the ability to DH in the future - I'd be okay with that. Hanley Ramirez health is a concern. He seems very brittle. [...] Isn't it still crucially important for the future that we spend one year under the salary cap so that we reset out penalties to a lower level, so that it will cost much much less to go over it next year? That is my hope too. That was the point of my comment to "consider trading Young." Right now they have $7.7, under? And if they trade Young -- isn't that another $6.5m? So go after a guy that keeps you under but can be a 3b/dh.
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Post by bnich on Jun 17, 2017 20:42:52 GMT -5
They'd make the playoffs if the season ended today and have the third-best record in the AL. How is that a "debacle?" Why do you think the debacle is related to play on the field? I happen to be happy with the job Farrell has done. So then explain what the "debacle" is. Isn't the job of a GM to field a team capable of winning ball games? With all the unforeseen injuries I think this team was in a great place to perform and perform well. I think a lot of people underestimate what Marco Hernandez meant to this ball club until his season ended. I don't see any reason why the word "debacle" would be brought to explain anything here (aside from sandoval).
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Post by m1keyboots on Jun 17, 2017 21:50:13 GMT -5
Why do you think the debacle is related to play on the field? I happen to be happy with the job Farrell has done. So then explain what the "debacle" is. Isn't the job of a GM to field a team capable of winning ball games? With all the unforeseen injuries I think this team was in a great place to perform and perform well. I think a lot of people underestimate what Marco Hernandez meant to this ball club until his season ended. I don't see any reason why the word "debacle" would be brought to explain anything here (aside from sandoval). I think he means the way DD kind of throws somewhat promising minor leaguers in deals when it may not be necessary, or trades a couple potential stars for one established older star. Maybe the way he stocks up on bullpen arms that seem to fall apart within months of joining the squad. Our third base situation has been a debacle, with extremely brief moments of reprieve. With oppo Pablo home runs, or Marrero matador defensive gems We've gone all in two years in a row when it comes to trading Espinoza, Kopech, Allen, Shaw, Dubon, Moncada, Asuaje, Margot. Im sure theres more. I like Sale, Kimbrel, and sure why not Pomeranz too. But fact still remains in two years if we haven't stretched out in the postseason, this era of Boston leadership will give way to whoever is next.
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Post by soxjim on Jun 18, 2017 2:01:33 GMT -5
So then explain what the "debacle" is. Isn't the job of a GM to field a team capable of winning ball games? With all the unforeseen injuries I think this team was in a great place to perform and perform well. I think a lot of people underestimate what Marco Hernandez meant to this ball club until his season ended. I don't see any reason why the word "debacle" would be brought to explain anything here (aside from sandoval). I think he means the way DD kind of throws somewhat promising minor leaguers in deals when it may not be necessary, or trades a couple potential stars for one established older star. Maybe the way he stocks up on bullpen arms that seem to fall apart within months of joining the squad. Our third base situation has been a debacle, with extremely brief moments of reprieve. With oppo Pablo home runs, or Marrero matador defensive gems We've gone all in two years in a row when it comes to trading Espinoza, Kopech, Allen, Shaw, Dubon, Moncada, Asuaje, Margot. Im sure theres more. I like Sale, Kimbrel, and sure why not Pomeranz too. But fact still remains in two years if we haven't stretched out in the postseason, this era of Boston leadership will give way to whoever is next. It is similar to over-emphasizing "the debacle" of 2013 relievers Bailey and Hanrahan.
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Post by m1keyboots on Jun 18, 2017 6:30:37 GMT -5
The baseball gods NEEDED us to see what Koji could do.^^^
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Post by soxfansince67 on Jul 2, 2017 21:16:06 GMT -5
Kicking this up because it will get a bit interesting again.
If ERod is OK/gets through his rehab with no issues - Fister to ?? - Johnson and Ross are working their way back as well (Ross has been on DL for some time - not sure where he is with his issue) - no real need for either of them in Boston.
Sandoval, Holt must be nearing a return - not sure about Rutledge - Peralta getting a look in Pawtucket
At this point the team seems to be gelling as is - Marrero and Lin making nice contributions (Travis could use more regular ABs but if Hanley heats up, back to Pawtucket I suspect).
Hoping to not see Sandoval in Boston again (wishful thinking?) - and don't feel Rutledge should displace anyone currently in Boston.
Maybe Holt bumps Travis back....
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Post by larrycook on Jul 2, 2017 21:42:53 GMT -5
Kicking this up because it will get a bit interesting again. If ERod is OK/gets through his rehab with no issues - Fister to ?? - Johnson and Ross are working their way back as well (Ross has been on DL for some time - not sure where he is with his issue) - no real need for either of them in Boston. Sandoval, Holt must be nearing a return - not sure about Rutledge - Peralta getting a look in Pawtucket At this point the team seems to be gelling as is - Marrero and Lin making nice contributions (Travis could use more regular ABs but if Hanley heats up, back to Pawtucket I suspect). Hoping to not see Sandoval in Boston again (wishful thinking?) - and don't feel Rutledge should displace anyone currently in Boston. Maybe Holt bumps Travis back.... In my mind, once Rodriguez returns, do we move Fister or Porcello to the bullpen? I agree Travis needs more at bats at Pawtucket. I am very concerned holt is coming back and he is not 100%.
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Post by mattpicard on Jul 3, 2017 0:11:23 GMT -5
Kicking this up because it will get a bit interesting again. If ERod is OK/gets through his rehab with no issues - Fister to ?? - Johnson and Ross are working their way back as well (Ross has been on DL for some time - not sure where he is with his issue) - no real need for either of them in Boston. Sandoval, Holt must be nearing a return - not sure about Rutledge - Peralta getting a look in Pawtucket At this point the team seems to be gelling as is - Marrero and Lin making nice contributions (Travis could use more regular ABs but if Hanley heats up, back to Pawtucket I suspect). Hoping to not see Sandoval in Boston again (wishful thinking?) - and don't feel Rutledge should displace anyone currently in Boston. Maybe Holt bumps Travis back.... In my mind, once Rodriguez returns, do we move Fister or Porcello to the bullpen? I agree Travis needs more at bats at Pawtucket. I am very concerned holt is coming back and he is not 100%. There is a 0% chance they move Porcello to the bullpen when Rodriguez returns. Also, for as bad as he's been, he now has a sub-4.00 FIP. He won't be the guy he was last year, but he'll be better than what he's pitched like to-date this season.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 3, 2017 2:49:21 GMT -5
It will be interesting to see who stays and goes in the bullpen. Boyer has done as well as anyone. Abad is the logical first one to go and stick Fister in that long man role once Eduardo comes back but the real question will be who goes once Carson Smith comes back.
I don't see Rutledge or Holt coming back until September if Lin and Marrero makes a good enough platoon at third base until September. Maybe by the Devers will be here.
Ohh and just finally release Pablo and Perralta.
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Post by ryan24 on Jul 3, 2017 6:35:52 GMT -5
It will be interesting to see who stays and goes in the bullpen. Boyer has done as well as anyone. Abad is the logical first one to go and stick Fister in that long man role once Eduardo comes back but the real question will be who goes once Carson Smith comes back. I don't see Rutledge or Holt coming back until September if Lin and Marrero makes a good enough platoon at third base until September. Maybe by the Devers will be here. Ohh and just finally release Pablo and Perralta. Eight starting pitchers for 6 spots. Tough decisions there. Does somebody get traded to get an extra infielder or two? Between the DL and AAA we have a pile load of relief. How will all that sort out. Again are some of these guys moved to get backup in the infield? Yup!! Jonny P and Pablo should be cut now. Pedro you are right on the money.
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Post by jmei on Jul 3, 2017 13:56:18 GMT -5
Marrero's had some relatively clutch hits lately, and his defense and versatility are strong enough that it wouldn't be the worst idea in the world to keep him on the roster. But he's still hitting just .212/.254/.347 (51 wRC+), with peripherals to match, and he really shouldn't be starting regularly.
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Post by telson13 on Jul 3, 2017 14:16:20 GMT -5
The problem with Plouffe is that he is almost a clone of Pablo, both in hitting and fielding. If he is available, and a lot of people seem to think he is, Todd Frazier, who hit 40 HRs last year, would be a better choice, assuming the price isn't too high. That's just not true. Sandoval is currently-.9 war, Plouffe is .2 war. Plouffe is a massive upgrade defensively. He has been in a major slump hitting for a month, but that happens. I see no reason to think his average won't go back to his career numbers in the .240 to .250 range with a little power. Frazier isn't a bad choice, but he is going to cost a ton more. I also don't see his average going up much. 3 straight years it has gone down. Frazier has a career highwalk rate (14%), a good K rate (21%), and his BABIP is only .214. He's never really posted good BABIPs, but that's due some regression. His ISO is well over .200, and his defense is above-average. Given his salary, and impending FA, he may not be as costly as you think. IMO, he's an ideal stopgap...he's not blocking Devers, he's unlikely to be worse given the low BA (and he's currently on pace for 2+ WAR), he has significant upside particularly in the power dept (which the team lacks), and he should be available for a reasonable talent cost. Of course, I'd still prefer that they try Devers out before making a trade, but Frazier is the best other option to me.
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Post by soxpatsceltics on Jul 3, 2017 14:33:44 GMT -5
Marrero has the best argument to stay in the majors. Although he has been serviceable, it's likely he will be DFA'd after the year because he's out of options. Lin is arguably a better player than Marrero now, but he actually has a future with the club. I think him and Travis get sent to Pawtucket for regular at bats when Rutledge and Holt return.
That leaves E-Rod and Carson Smith. Personally, I'd get rid of Abad and trade Hembree, who has no options but should have a market. Fister to the pen as the long man and spot 6th starter when needed.
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