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5/27-5/29 Red Sox vs. Indians Series Thread
radiohix
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'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
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Post by radiohix on May 29, 2019 0:27:53 GMT -5
Why replacing only JDM? Can't he replace Moreland? Chavis can't play both positions at the same time. He seems like a guy who might not be good enough to play first base full-time. Defense seems to hold him back based off of reports on here. It's first base! Just look around the division...Lots of sluggs in there: Pearce, Voigt, Mancini, Tellez, Choi...They're all bad.
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Post by hammerhead on May 29, 2019 0:35:22 GMT -5
So what's the solution for the pen? They are an arm short in the best of times. I think Josh Taylor deserves a look as a 6th or 7th inning lefty. After Taylor there doesn't appear to be anyone knocking on the door.
What teams that are clearly not competing have an arm that can be had for a Chatham type?
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radiohix
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Post by radiohix on May 29, 2019 0:38:36 GMT -5
I really really hope they don't repeat that same mistake with Ockimey because the ressemblance is staggering: Both unprotected the first year but don't get picked up than they dominate the competition in AAA without getting a shot to contribute in the Majors. Let's hope he gets a look this year. I wouldn't let JD Martinez go to hand the DH slot to Ockimey. I can see the case for letting him try to win the 1b job in 2020, but his defense is questionable, and if he can't hit lefties and his BA is around .200, it could be really hard for his walks and power to really play up, but I won't discounts him. I have Dalbec penciled in as the future 1b, but he's got a lot of the same issues as Ockimey, but I think defensively he has a better shot at being a viable 1b (if not 3b because Devers could become a good 3b). Either way both guys would be holding the 1b fort until Tristan Casas is ready, a few years down the road. That guy is going to be a monster. His BA against RHP is around .300, he always hit them for a high avg on top of the walks. Also, Ockimey makes more contact than Dalbec, his K rate was always lower than Dalbec while being more challenged in terms of age advancement. Cora has been using a platoon at 1st base for more than a year now, why not keeping the same process with different personnel?
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Post by philsbosoxfan on May 29, 2019 0:40:17 GMT -5
Pete Abraham Verified account @peteabe
Red Sox were 22-1 when leading after 8 innings before tonight. In the top 4 of pretty much every relief category in the AL.
A hideous loss, no doubt. But the idea they should give up what they've been doing is a little nuts.
It's one 162-game season. Not 162 one-game seasons.
Chris Cotillo Verified account @chriscotillo
Cora on the state of the bullpen: "We feel that we’ve done an outstanding job so far. Nothing is going to change right now." . . . Step back from the ledge folks...
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radiohix
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'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
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Post by radiohix on May 29, 2019 0:42:53 GMT -5
So what's the solution for the pen? They are an arm short in the best of times. I think Josh Taylor deserves a look as a 6th or 7th inning lefty. After Taylor there doesn't appear to be anyone knocking on the door. What teams that are clearly not competing have an arm that can be had for a Chatham type? Will Smith from the Giants is very compeling: LH, pounds the zone (under 2 BB/9) and miss bats and is a free agent after the season but supply/demand and a smart new FO may drive the price up.
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Post by hammerhead on May 29, 2019 0:49:13 GMT -5
Pete Abraham Verified account @peteabe Red Sox were 22-1 when leading after 8 innings before tonight. In the top 4 of pretty much every relief category in the AL. A hideous loss, no doubt. But the idea they should give up what they've been doing is a little nuts. It's one 162-game season. Not 162 one-game seasons. Chris Cotillo Verified account @chriscotillo Cora on the state of the bullpen: "We feel that we’ve done an outstanding job so far. Nothing is going to change right now." . . . Step back from the ledge folks... I don't think wanting an upgrade for Lakins and or Embree is being on the ledge. The use of the high leverage arms has been fine. The fact that AAA or AAAA arms take up at least two roster spots is a problem. The fact that we have a bullpen game once a week taxing a already thin pen is a problem. A GM's job is to fix problems Eovaldi coming back will help, but still .
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Post by philsbosoxfan on May 29, 2019 1:05:32 GMT -5
Eovaldi and Johnson. Nunez is a bigger issue than Lakins. Hembree isn't a bad 6th inning or7th inning option.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on May 29, 2019 1:36:38 GMT -5
I trust that Cora had a reason to stay away from Hembree even though he only faced 2 batters the day before and didn't pitch Sunday. E.g., he's got some of the bug that JDM and then Price had. Otherwise, there's no planet on which you have Lakins warming up instead of Hembree, also your inherited-runner specialist, with Brasier struggling to nail down a save. And Velazquez was either also unavailable or was being saved for potential extra innings.
When you lack a fourth high-leverage arm and one of the three has an off night and needs to be relieved, and your OK #4 guy is unavailable and your potential #4 guy has been optioned for an emergency call-up ... well, that's a recipe for disaster. But it's also a dish that is almost never on the menu.
It is true that the Sox pen goes from 9th in MLB in Win Probability Added to 12th with tonight's -0.87, which is to say, from playoff-caliber to not. But that should right itself in time.
It still looks like an adequate pen but not a strength. Steven Wright can't get un-suspended too soon.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 29, 2019 4:05:46 GMT -5
He seems like a guy who might not be good enough to play first base full-time. Defense seems to hold him back based off of reports on here. It's first base! Just look around the division...Lots of sluggs in there: Pearce, Voigt, Mancini, Tellez, Choi...They're all bad. Good point, but it seems like malpractice to sign JDM when Mookie Betts doesn't have a contract yet. You can't sign everybody, especially with John Henry as your owner.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 29, 2019 4:21:13 GMT -5
I would think the Angels chose Buttrey over Lakins in the Kinsler deal, but who knows? I don't know if Buttrey was the must have for the Angels or if they presented the Sox with a list of acceptable relievers/players for Kinsler. The only thing for sure that I question now was why didn't Buttrey at least get a look last year with the Red Sox? It was almost like they were trying to keep him pristine so that his trade value wasn't ruined by some poor big league outings, but who really knows? The only thing that is now obvious is that they misevaluated who Buttrey has become. Honestly, I didn't see this coming or I'd be a hypocrite if I said I did. But then again I don't have the scouting resources that the Red Sox did. That they still came to the conclusion that this was a kid they should part with was a bad evaluation. And of course, the thought that Kinsler was still a good player was misguided, too - although I get why they wanted stability at 2b. But man, wouldn't they have just as fine if they just went with Brandon Phillips as the RH hitting 2b and kept Buttrey? I’m pretty sure at this point they finish 88-74 and out of the playoffs. Lots of good developments this year, but way too many meh performances and some tactical errors that’re gonna bite them. Plus, TB looks really good and NY has been Yankees-lucky with their fill-ins. Oakland’s on a run, and they’re definitely not the sub-500 team they were before this win streak. Sox still have a solid chance, but losing this one to a direct wild card contender was bad. If they get a little lucky and play to their abilities, they could win 92-93 and sneak in. Could be a long, aggravating summer tho. You don't even have to believe in Oakland or Cleveland being better than the Sox. All you have to believe is that they'll beat up on the crappy teams within their division at the end the year. I mean we are in a 3 way scenario where the Sox get a playoff spot- -Both Oakland and Cleveland don't clean up at the end of the year (highly unlikely given the talent in their divisions) -One of New York or Tampa Bay really regresses (unlikely given the talent on both teams) -The Sox tear through the league for a 20-25 game stretch where they're mostly unbeatable (most likely option) The odds that both AL wild card teams come out of the East is highly unlikely, given the fact that New York, Tampa, and Boston will be beating up each other in September. At this point, making the wild card this year might be considered a success.
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Post by incandenza on May 29, 2019 9:13:00 GMT -5
I’m pretty sure at this point they finish 88-74 and out of the playoffs. Lots of good developments this year, but way too many meh performances and some tactical errors that’re gonna bite them. Plus, TB looks really good and NY has been Yankees-lucky with their fill-ins. Oakland’s on a run, and they’re definitely not the sub-500 team they were before this win streak. Sox still have a solid chance, but losing this one to a direct wild card contender was bad. If they get a little lucky and play to their abilities, they could win 92-93 and sneak in. Could be a long, aggravating summer tho. You don't even have to believe in Oakland or Cleveland being better than the Sox. All you have to believe is that they'll beat up on the crappy teams within their division at the end the year. I mean we are in a 3 way scenario where the Sox get a playoff spot- -Both Oakland and Cleveland don't clean up at the end of the year (highly unlikely given the talent in their divisions) -One of New York or Tampa Bay really regresses (unlikely given the talent on both teams) -The Sox tear through the league for a 20-25 game stretch where they're mostly unbeatable (most likely option) The odds that both AL wild card teams come out of the East is highly unlikely, given the fact that New York, Tampa, and Boston will be beating up each other in September. At this point, making the wild card this year might be considered a success. Fangraphs odds to make the playoffs: 79%. Friendly reminder that the Red Sox are 18-9 since April 29th, aka, exactly the same winning percentage they had in 2018.
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Post by manfred on May 29, 2019 10:53:59 GMT -5
Brutal loss, but elite closers blow saves, too. These things happen. Only counts once in the L column.
Sox do seem one arm short, but Barnes has been sick... far better than I anticipated. I have to give Cora and DD credit: they were righter than I was about the bullpen. I thought it was doomed, expecting Barnes to regress badly.
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Post by James Dunne on May 29, 2019 11:03:17 GMT -5
Brutal loss, but elite closers blow saves, too. These things happen. Only counts once in the L column. Sox do seem one arm short, but Barnes has been sick... far better than I anticipated. I have to give Cora and DD credit: they were righter than I was about the bullpen. I thought it was doomed, expecting Barnes to regress badly. Elite closers do blow saves too, sure. But... I don't think the problem is that Barnes didn't enter the season stamped with the Proven Closer TM. It's the depth getting to him and Walden. Brasier's been shaky. Workman is inducing soft contact but the walks and the lack of track record for soft contact don't portend well. Hembree's gotten okay results despite peripherals and a batted ball profile that should terrify anyone. I'll match their top two relievers up with anyone right now, it's the fact that they have two relievers who have been outstanding and several more guys who are like #5/6 options. And Barnes is currently 12th on the team in batters faced - he seriously just passed Thornburg last night. He's been allowed to dominate in short bursts as he's gotten good rest/recovery, but you wonder if he can still pitch at that level if they lean on him harder.
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Post by jimed14 on May 29, 2019 11:08:12 GMT -5
Brutal loss, but elite closers blow saves, too. These things happen. Only counts once in the L column. Sox do seem one arm short, but Barnes has been sick... far better than I anticipated. I have to give Cora and DD credit: they were righter than I was about the bullpen. I thought it was doomed, expecting Barnes to regress badly. Elite closers do blow saves too, sure. But... I don't think the problem is that Barnes didn't enter the season stamped with the Proven Closer TM. It's the depth getting to him and Walden. Brasier's been shaky. Workman is inducing soft contact but the walks and the lack of track record for soft contact don't portend well. Hembree's gotten okay results despite peripherals and a batted ball profile that should terrify anyone. I'll match their top two relievers up with anyone right now, it's the fact that they have two relievers who have been outstanding and several more guys who are like #5/6 options. And Barnes is currently 12th on the team in batters faced - he seriously just passed Thornburg last night. He's been allowed to dominate in short bursts as he's gotten good rest/recovery, but you wonder if he can still pitch at that level if they lean on him harder. Why would you use batters faced as a stat? Thornburg can't get guys out and was pitching in the lowest possible leverage so it's not surprising at all. Barnes has pitched in 6 more games.
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Post by James Dunne on May 29, 2019 11:19:08 GMT -5
Elite closers do blow saves too, sure. But... I don't think the problem is that Barnes didn't enter the season stamped with the Proven Closer TM. It's the depth getting to him and Walden. Brasier's been shaky. Workman is inducing soft contact but the walks and the lack of track record for soft contact don't portend well. Hembree's gotten okay results despite peripherals and a batted ball profile that should terrify anyone. I'll match their top two relievers up with anyone right now, it's the fact that they have two relievers who have been outstanding and several more guys who are like #5/6 options. And Barnes is currently 12th on the team in batters faced - he seriously just passed Thornburg last night. He's been allowed to dominate in short bursts as he's gotten good rest/recovery, but you wonder if he can still pitch at that level if they lean on him harder. Why would you use batters faced as a stat? Thornburg can't get guys out and was pitching in the lowest possible leverage so it's not surprising at all. Barnes has pitched in 6 more games. To show his workload hasn't been particularly heavy? Thornburg was pitching low-leverage, but also only doing it like once a week. It's not to minimize what Barnes has done, and it's worked out well to this point. Hopefully it means he has more in the tank for the stretch run, like the opposite of how Junichi Tazawa was used by Farrell. I'm just not sure it's going to be fair to expect him to dominate at the level he has if they need to turn to him for 5-6 batters or on consecutive days more often. He's only worked consecutively five times, and Cora hasn't yet had him work three straight days.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 29, 2019 12:47:55 GMT -5
Mitch Moreland is on the IL with a lower back strain and Lakins was optioned to Pawtucket.
The Red Sox recalled Colten Brewer and lefty Josh Taylor.
Saw this on RedSox.com
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Post by soxfansince67 on May 29, 2019 13:03:21 GMT -5
One loss, folks - a bad one, but counts the same as a "less bad" one. Got that mess out of our system. Start the winning again today. Certainly not a comfy game to try to fall asleep after...but it's another day.
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Post by James Dunne on May 29, 2019 13:26:14 GMT -5
Mitch Moreland is on the IL with a lower back strain and Lakins was optioned to Pawtucket. The Red Sox recalled Colten Brewer and lefty Josh Taylor. Saw this on RedSox.com Rick Porcello is their backup infielder and outfielder.
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Post by station13 on May 29, 2019 13:55:00 GMT -5
Brewer recalled because this organization has no other options. Shameful.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 29, 2019 14:13:06 GMT -5
You don't even have to believe in Oakland or Cleveland being better than the Sox. All you have to believe is that they'll beat up on the crappy teams within their division at the end the year. I mean we are in a 3 way scenario where the Sox get a playoff spot- -Both Oakland and Cleveland don't clean up at the end of the year (highly unlikely given the talent in their divisions) -One of New York or Tampa Bay really regresses (unlikely given the talent on both teams) -The Sox tear through the league for a 20-25 game stretch where they're mostly unbeatable (most likely option) The odds that both AL wild card teams come out of the East is highly unlikely, given the fact that New York, Tampa, and Boston will be beating up each other in September. At this point, making the wild card this year might be considered a success. Fangraphs odds to make the playoffs: 79%. Friendly reminder that the Red Sox are 18-9 since April 29th, aka, exactly the same winning percentage they had in 2018. If you want to default to Fangraphs, then be my guest, but there's two teams ahead of you currently. There's also 2 teams that play in bad divisions. The doomsday scenario is very real here.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 29, 2019 14:46:08 GMT -5
Fangraphs odds to make the playoffs: 79%. Friendly reminder that the Red Sox are 18-9 since April 29th, aka, exactly the same winning percentage they had in 2018. If you want to default to Fangraphs, then be my guest, but there's two teams ahead of you currently. There's also 2 teams that play in bad divisions. The doomsday scenario is very real here. Pedro, I'm not sure I agree with this. Yes, the AL East is the strongest - but only the top 3. The AL East is very weak toward the bottom. The Sox would be battling with Cleveland and Oakland for that 2nd wild card spot if they don't catch TB, which is questionable. However I wouldn't be shocked if Cleveland dealt Bauer away during the deadline. This team, if it does make the playoffs, isn't going to go far. I don't think Cleveland would go all in. They're as likely to sell. Frankly, they're not a very good team. The Red Sox made them look good yesterday, but they're really not. So there's Oakland, but from top to bottom that division doesn't have any awful teams even though Seattle has been awful since their starting burst. Still, the M's are a bad team, not a horrible one. The Rangers and Angels are reasonably near .500. The A's aren't a juggernaut. It's not hard to imagine them tripping every now and then over the Rangers, Angels, and M's - and of course playing Houston isn't going to help them. Yeah, the Sox have the Yankee and Rays to deal with - that's one more additional great team, but they also have the Blue Jays and the Orioles to deal with. It wouldn't be hard to see Toronto dealing Strohman away or whatever veteran assets they have. I do like Toronto's future a bit, but I don't think that comes this year - I think Toronto will lose around 90 games. The Orioles are awful now and will continue to free fall throughout the rest of the season. In theory the Red Sox should beat up on Baltimore even though they haven't yet. So no, I'm not going to tell you the Sox are shoo-in to make the playoffs, but I don't think it's as dire as you have it. Yes, they could blow it. No, it's not highly likely they will. It's unlikely the Sox catch TB and even more unlikely they catch NY, but it's NOT unlikely they make the playoffs anyways. The Sox, have played well for the month of May even though they've cooled off the past couple of weeks. It's not hard to imagine them going on a bit of a run where they go 35-20 for a stretch. They probably won't be able to sustain it because they will trip over their bullpen as the season goes on. They'll have the days where they strand a village, and they're going to have games that you'd think they'd win drop into the loss column. The 2018 Red Sox were amazing at avoiding that. The 2019 Red Sox keep finding the pitfalls. That's what I think will prevent them from finishing first, but I think there's just too much talent to keep them from finding their way into the 90 - 95 win category and into the playoffs.
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Post by Guidas on May 29, 2019 14:48:21 GMT -5
Mitch Moreland is on the IL with a lower back strain and Lakins was optioned to Pawtucket. The Red Sox recalled Colten Brewer and lefty Josh Taylor. Saw this on RedSox.com Short bench stays short.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on May 29, 2019 15:09:14 GMT -5
Pedro...there is no Doomsday....there is only Boomsday....because Rafi Devers awaits all mashable pitches.
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Post by soxfansince67 on May 29, 2019 15:09:48 GMT -5
At this point, they are adding arms if they have a pulse. With Mitch on the IL, there is a bit of uncomfortable exposing going on. Let's hope Weber can hurl another gem so we don't have to dig too deep into tonight's pen....and let's hope that are big bats are really big. Would be a great night for Mookie to reignite.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 29, 2019 15:15:00 GMT -5
I'm almost 75 percent sure they make the playoffs too, but there was 2 teams ahead the Nationals last year in the race for the division. There was also competition from other teams in the wild card. The Sox are eerily similar to the Nationals situation last year.
I don't have high expectations this year. Bullpen is built on thumb tacks and glue. You have barely any farm system to help you out later in the year.
I'll be happy with a New York stumble in the playoffs and the Sox making it to at least the wild card game. At least make it there.
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